Im trying to Figure out if an extra radiator i have will work for my V8 conversion. It is at an 35-45 degree angle to fit under the hood, is that to much?

It's a 30x18 dual core, I thought it would fit but guess not. What size are the renegade ones? They look raked out when the are installed as well.

Thanks.

I looked at this earlier and was curious to see what was going to come back! I don't think angle has much to do with anything. You need a certain area of cooling tubing and you need to get air through it.

The most important factor( if you have a big enough radiator) is getting the air out. You can have a mack truck rad. but if there is no where for the air to go it ain't gonna cool. That being said, inlet size isn't critical, flow is. Make sure you have enough "draw" on the flow. In the old days when they first came out with a 4 row, it didn't make that much difference if you can't get the air through. Supplemental fans made the difference! Here again though, in the limited space, even fans may not get the air out.

Since then, they've come out with bigger tubes(more area) and gotten the same or better cooling with just 2 rows. The guys at renegade really have the ticket, they've done this so often, and come up with a great combination. I've done okay all these years with just a regular camaro unit, but don't waste your time trying to make some junk work, just get their kit. It's well worth the $ and will save you countless hours and many sleepless nights.

B

Here's the Renegade setup,

18x30 dual core is a pretty standard rad size for NASCAR stuff - I am assuming it is 1" capillary like a typical alum dual core double pass made in the past decade. Assuming all of that, you have enough radiator.

For your specific question, you can lay that radiator nearly flat and be okay - you should see the angles in some Ultima kits and so forth. Does it have a radiator cap/fill neck on it, or does the rad require a separate fill tank? My point is if you lay it over, you want to have a separate fill tank that feeds the radiator.

Here is my 16x28 dual pass, two core NASCAR style radiator and you can see it is laid over pretty far. Also note the Moroso fill tank.

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Renegades setup was the best money I have spent on my v8 to date. I highly recommend it & them . I really looked for quite a while but by the time you get all the pieces. You are going to spend close to that if not more. It is everything you need in one package. You can do it cheaper if you are resourceful. I tried or at least looked before spending the money. After my issues at last years WCR . Believe me I was wishing I had just ponied up the dough then

Renegade's setup is $1K. I have around $600 in my setup with 525HP that I beat the hell out of on the track and don't over heat. If he already has the radiator and it appears to be more than sufficient, he is most of the way there IMHO.

I have a dual one inch tube aluminum and a wrx radiator that are the same outside size but the custom radiator is thicker. They are neither crossflow. Either one will need to be angled to fit. Neither is as thick as the renegade setup but my hp requirements are also lower. The wrx radiator works on 375 hp subys and thats all I will need. The fiero uses a angled design and sbc's have been put in them forever. The trick is to get the low pressure on the back side and not have any recirculation of the hot air.

The fiero configuration looks a lot like byndbad's setup. Except it has a front trunk and the gas tank goes down the center tunnel.

It looks like with renegades setup you lose enough of the trunk to say you don't have one so that means just concentrate on cooling and not try to save some trunk.

All good stuff from the guys above. I have a rod Simpson radiator which is close to the Renegade set up.
Bruce is on the right track with air flow. I never had cooling problems but I did fab up a schroud that sucks air thru the complete surface. Also make sure you have a air dam of sorts to build up a "high Pressure" in front of the radiator when driving and a decient exit ait path to create a "low pressure" behind the radiator. and you should be free of cooling problems.
Last but not least, elimiinate any air in the water flow, have a bleed port at the highest point in the sustem.

hope this helps,

Tony

All good stuff from the guys above. I have a rod Simpson radiator which is close to the Renegade set up.
Bruce is on the right track with air flow. I never had cooling problems but I did fab up a schroud that sucks air thru the complete surface. Also make sure you have a air dam of sorts to build up a "high Pressure" in front of the radiator when driving and a decient exit ait path to create a "low pressure" behind the radiator. and you should be free of cooling problems.
Last but not least, elimiinate any air in the water flow, have a bleed port at the highest point in the sustem.

hope this helps,

Tony

Your right he does have a rad alllready. I was thinking he was looking. I originally went with what my car came with. Didn't work well for me. So I started looking at other options. I'm not one to fab up a system. So my search concentrated on radiators with dual fans, relay & a shroud.

All good stuff from the guys above. I have a rod Simpson radiator which is close to the Renegade set up.
Bruce is on the right track with air flow. I never had cooling problems but I did fab up a schroud that sucks air thru the complete surface. Also make sure you have a air dam of sorts to build up a "high Pressure" in front of the radiator when driving and a decient exit ait path to create a "low pressure" behind the radiator. and you should be free of cooling problems.
Last but not least, elimiinate any air in the water flow, have a bleed port at the highest point in the system.

hope this helps,

Tony

Thank you all, I can go back to sleep happy.

To answer Byndbad914's question, it is 1.5" thick and it does have a Cap/Filler neck on it. I guess that was where my concern was with the Angle.

1.5 is not very thick compared to renegades. I will depend on how much hp the motor makes. I would try to do the install keeping in mind that a thicker radiator might be needed later. Also check to see if a high performance radiator the same size is available if it's needed or you will be making new shrouds and everything all over again. Most average sbc's making about 275 hp use a 19 x 28-30 two row copper radiator. The replacement radiator for my suburban with a 350 is a aluminum core/ plastic tank two row and it's about 19x 30. The aluminum core really cools a lot better but the plastic tanks are questionable if the radiator is not mounted really well. Think about it hard as I really hate to need to do something over just because I tried to save maybe 200.00. There are many new all aluminum radiators on the market for about 250.00

You might just wall off the sides out at the light walls and build the radiator support to hold the radiator you have and maybe all you would need to change is the support and the fan shroud for a new radiator if it is needed.

Though yet to be tested, I am using an AFCO dual pass, dual core ASA racing radiator, 15" x 27 1/2" with cap delete, bleed port, and sensor bung. It was $229 directly from AFCO a couple of years ago. I would make sure you pay attention to your ducting, as you want to avoid having the air flowing around the radiator rather than through it.

Andys

Well Considering I got the Aluminum Radiator from a friend and the fact that I had a set of 14" fans already and Im only invested 35$ into coolong so far. I dont think I would regret it if I had to do it over! PITA yes, but I figured that with the aluminum sheet for ducting all the ish I have already I should be good for a clean radiator install for just under 200$ and that beats the hell out of a G for Renegade's.

Just my Brain Change....

Off the subject can some one post a pic of the Renegade fill tank in the engine compartment, I have read through every V8 Thread and no one has a clear defined pic of that setup.

Thanks again guys....

And byndbad914 your Car was built by Baja Shop Huh? I saw it there before...

Renegade

yep, I see you are in Orange - I had it built there in '06 before they moved out near Corona! I have since moved as well in '07 to CO.

You can run a rad with a cap on it, just put a higher pressure one on than on the fill tank. Being alum you can simply weld a bung in to get the flow back into the tank. The fill tank can just tee into the low pressure side of the system.

Here is a shot of mine after everything is installed.
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you can see the return comes in the top pass side, flows across and then there is a return loop back to the tank where some goes back (the blue hose to the top of the fill tank). out of the bott of the fill tank you can see it T's into the low pressure suction side out of the radiator (goes between the rad and the water pump suction side). It is a bit hard to see the brass fitting but it goes into the dull alum feed pipe v. the shiny return pipe. Works perfect. the white plastic tank is just for overflow should that happen.

Here is what you would have seen at AJs - this was right after I picked it up
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I just previewed and realized the two most important tools are in that shot - a hammer and a crescent wrench

On the fill tank it looks like it is bypassing the radiator from the top to the waterpump suction side.

The angle should be OK. Desert Hybrids runs an angled setup in arizona, so it should work. Just make sure that there is sufficient airflow in and out, and that the front is shrouded and sealed. Also make sure that the hot air is not recirculated into the front when sitting still.

I had this setup made for me ata local radiator shop for $275.00 and have never had the car over 190F

Mark

Not a good picture but this is a Double pass 16X28 Ron Davis with 2 16" Spal fans. I also have a SPAL pwm fan controller, It has programmable presets for the fans. You start with one fan at 1/2 speed and fan speed increases with tempeture. When the fan reaches full speed and the tempeture increases 10 degree more the second fan comes on at full speed also.
Bob
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I keep seeing that the Renegade setup is the beat way to go but NO ONE ever divulges as to the details of the setup such as how many rows/cores; is it a double or triple pass radiator etc...

Did y'all have to sign your souls to these folks?

Anyone have these details?

Thanks!

AFAIK Its a dual core double pass custom radiator they have made combined with the appropriate bleeding system and good shrouding.


I've been toying with the idea of making a small displacement radiator system for the 914 since Rennegades is overkill and pricey for anything v6 and smaller.

From Big Cat Bob, not me, Bob B but this is the same set up I have and I believe this is the Renegade set up. My set up came in a car I bought and the PO said it was a Renegade set up. When I removed it from the 74 car it was printed Ron Davis Racing

“Not a good picture but this is a Double pass 16X28 Ron Davis with 2 16" Spal fans. I also have a SPAL pwm fan controller, It has programmable presets for the fans. You start with one fan at 1/2 speed and fan speed increases with tempeture. When the fan reaches full speed and the tempeture increases 10 degree more the second fan comes on at full speed also.
Bob”

Are you still screwing with your radiator? This has been going on for a long time.

Bob B

Good to know!

Now, do you know whether a 2 row double pass radiator cools more efficiently than a 4 row cross flow unit?

I have a two row cross flow Griffin unit in my car and on an 85 degree day, it will creep past 200 degrees. This is on a mildly tuned 350 with no T-stat installed (around 300HP).

Indeed; it has been going on for a long time. My last attempt was to add an oil cooler which helped but during a hot day (a few days ago), that dang temp came up past 200 again so now I have resigned myself to go either 4 row cross flow or 2 row double or triple pass rad. That's what I am trying to figure out!!

I just read that thread. I'd like to see a pic of the expansion tank from the side and bottom plus a few more from different angles. I's difficult to see where some of those hoses travel in your pic. Post it back on your thread so we don't hijack this one; too much anyway!

Can do. Are you looking to see how I have things routed to replicate for yourself or to verify I have things plumbed correctly? I am pretty sure I followed all of the routing recommendations correctly!

Your cooling will be a little different I believe due to your tube frame, you have a lot more exhaust for the hot air to escape.

To verify!

I see!

Go here for a schematic and pics of what I did.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...90647&st=60