Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: bumper top seals
914World.com > The 914 Forums > Originality and History
dr914@autoatlanta.com
I am very worried about the availability of the front bumper top seals. I just got word that the tooling has gone bad and has been disposed of. I bought the last 13 bumper top seals in the world but they have windshield washer holes in them I priced the tooling and it is over 30,000 to make. Then I would have to commit to 1000 pieces.
The point here is what are we going to do in the restoration of our 914s if a high appearance item like this cannot be purchased? Any one want to step up to the plate?
jonferns
Im sure that nobody is going to swallow the cost of the tooling, but im sure that there are quite a few interested and who can commit to buying a seal or two. Put me down for one if you decide to do it.
tod914
Think the only concievable way to do it, would be to have the production costs covered up front. 1000 units I don't see how one could possibly sell that many. 300 units @ $100 would be hard enough to do. Would 150 club members chip in for that to get a huge price break? Don't see it happening unfortunetly. That's alot of people.
JeffBowlsby
So George, tell us a little about the bumper tops you do have with the washer jet holes. Can one of those be used to make a mold from? How much are they?
dr914@autoatlanta.com
Yes they can be used as a model for a new part, and they cost the same as the original ones. The hole would be a problem to fill in and get it to look right for concours. Adding headlight washers is the only solution but I have not checked to see if they are still available!!!!!
I have one of the bumper tops at a molder now who does silicone molds to see if I can get a cheap factory look pad that at least will LOOK like the original.
The point about all of this is I am beginning to feel like Pat, disheartened that I can no longer restore a 914 to the level that I want by buying all of the factory parts to do it, and now look at the original unmolested cars that I have and covet them more than ever. 914 restoration will have to become one off and the original cars now to skyrocket in value.
914Sixer
I have one NOS one we can use for a pattern. I emailed George about this one.
Pat Garvey
QUOTE(tod914 @ Mar 26 2009, 04:10 PM) *

Think the only concievable way to do it, would be to have the production costs covered up front. 1000 units I don't see how one could possibly sell that many. 300 units @ $100 would be hard enough to do. Would 150 club members chip in for that to get a huge price break? Don't see it happening unfortunetly. That's alot of people.

Tod,

I think we all rcognize what one of these things is potentially woth, to a collector (CW). And $100 wouldn't touch it.

I don't need one right now, but if I'm stupid enough to hang in with this car I'll need one down the road. Same for the rear.

So, just for curiosity, I DO need one - now. How much would I (CW) be willing to spend? Well, there are next to none (new) available. What are my options? Ever see a 914 without one? Looks really bad & destroys resale.

In my estimation, 914 owners MUST have a source for these. Front or rear, if someone (listening George?) needs these, they need these - no getting around it. Would you pay $500? If I had no other choice I'd do it in a nanosecond, when I need one. Hell, I'd probably pay more.

1000 units? You may be surprised, especially when the availability of junker car parts is exhausted.

A good mule is needed, which 914sixer has offered.

Do it!
Pat

ps: getting back a small amount of enthusiasm when I see posts like this.
PanelBilly
Six hundred and shipping. That's what I paid and I was only concerned about making sure it was new. My car's not going to be all original, but the idea of a fiberglass bumper, just wasn't going to fly
Tom_T
QUOTE(dr914@autoatlanta.com @ Mar 26 2009, 11:16 AM) *

I am very worried about the availability of the front bumper top seals. I just got word that the tooling has gone bad and has been disposed of. I bought the last 13 bumper top seals in the world but they have windshield washer holes in them I priced the tooling and it is over 30,000 to make. Then I would have to commit to 1000 pieces.
The point here is what are we going to do in the restoration of our 914s if a high appearance item like this cannot be purchased? Any one want to step up to the plate?


So George - I need one & have recently looked at your AA parts on-line & you show genuine still available & at your 30% off sale at $380 or $450 - do those have the holes then???? confused24.gif

I'm also looking for the 2 front "tits" / bumper horns for my `73, which you also list - are they really new & genuine at $53 Left & $76 Right???? unsure.gif

Why don't you pm me with what you actually have available, and look at this post below for the F & R Chrome Bumpers that I need to either fix & re-chrome or replace - at something less than $1500 - $2000 tho!

Posted Pix of Damaged `73 2L Chromies at:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...64208&st=60

If they had holes - I seem to recall that Porsche made a black plastic plug to fill them, when washers weren't installed?? ....does that work at all??

What's the progress on your repros? confused24.gif

By the way guys, by my good ole' HP12C calculator - at even only the middle of the above range $400 apiece - that's only 75 bumper top pads to recoup the $30,000 in tooling costs! ....NOT 1,000 at $100 each - although over several years with them being NLA, I'm sure they'll sell that & more!

While probably not of interest to a multi-billion-$$ conglomerate like Porsche - esp. in this crap economy, but I'd say it should be of great interest to George/AA, PP, Pelican or somebody out there! That break even in just 75 units + materials & labor to produce the first batch - perhaps only 100 - 150 to sell, is a pretty good investment for someone in the Biz like AA!
tod914
Original post states George would have to commit to 1,000 units. Mikey is picking up the ball on this smile.gif
Tom_T
QUOTE(tod914 @ Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM) *

Original post states George would have to commit to 1,000 units. Mikey is picking up the ball on this smile.gif


Tod -

I'm just questioning George's math & economic analysis, since the "nut" or "hurdle" to recover the $30k tooling cost is only 75 units at $400 retail apiece. I do understand that there are other materials, labor & process costs involved in this, but I really doubt that 1000 units is required to hit break-even overall, and start making a profit - particularly since he could & would probably charge more like $5-600 for this NLA item! type.gif

As an MBA in business for myself since `83, I know the process of analyzing & evaluating such a business venture, and I think that there is substantial profit in doing this venture, given both higher pricing possible - given that when last available they went for over $500 a year or so ago, and that over time of 3-5 years, 1000 units sold is probably feasible - let alone the long term sales. type.gif type.gif

...and then there's all those other NLA parts - particularly front & rear "tits" (& the rear top strip will soon be NLA too - although I just got one from PP for 15% off), lighting USA plastic lenses, etc. which could be outsourced to auto parts makers without much business right now!? type.gif type.gif type.gif

...hint, hint to those entrepreneurs out there. Heck - with Real Estate Development 'dead" right now, maybe I should look into this venture myself!?
....hmmmmmm idea.gif

Anyone else see the benefits? ...anyone know of auto parts suppliers back in MI, IN, etc. for similar parts in need of specialty products to produce in the downturn?
confused24.gif smash.gif

Good Luck to Mikie welder.gif

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
Tom_T
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 02:46 PM' post='1158675']
[quote name='tod914' post='1158580' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM']

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
[/quote]

PS - does anyone know why all the used F & R top strips/pads seem to have a series of "dimples" every inch or so across the middle where the "crease" is??

Even my damaged ones are in far better shape rubber-wise (except for a small tear on the front-left), if they can just be shaped back into the proper curve - NO dimples at all!

Maybe I should just re-fit & use those!!?? idea.gif smash.gif

...any "Thotz" from the Xperts out there?

REAR TOP STRIP - NEW VS. DAMAGED/OLD:

Click to view attachment

> not much diff in condition - bend aside!


...continued next post...

Tom_T
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:34 PM' post='1158704']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 02:46 PM' post='1158675']
[quote name='tod914' post='1158580' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM']

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
[/quote]

PS - does anyone know why all the used F & R top strips/pads seem to have a series of "dimples" every inch or so across the middle where the "crease" is??

Even my damaged ones are in far better shape rubber-wise (except for a small tear on the front-left), if they can just be shaped back into the proper curve - NO dimples at all!

Maybe I should just re-fit & use those!!?? idea.gif smash.gif

...any "Thotz" from the Xperts out there?

REAR TOP STRIP - NEW VS. DAMAGED/OLD:

Click to view attachment

> not much diff in condition - bend aside!


...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


REAR TOP STRIP - PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> no tears on rear one!

...continued next post...
Tom_T
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:42 PM' post='1158707']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:34 PM' post='1158704']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 02:46 PM' post='1158675']
[quote name='tod914' post='1158580' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM']

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
[/quote]

PS - does anyone know why all the used F & R top strips/pads seem to have a series of "dimples" every inch or so across the middle where the "crease" is??

Even my damaged ones are in far better shape rubber-wise (except for a small tear on the front-left), if they can just be shaped back into the proper curve - NO dimples at all!

Maybe I should just re-fit & use those!!?? idea.gif smash.gif

...any "Thotz" from the Xperts out there?

REAR TOP STRIP - NEW VS. DAMAGED/OLD:

Click to view attachment

> not much diff in condition - bend aside!


...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


REAR TOP STRIP - PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> no tears on rear one!

...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - CENTER DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> still no tears on rear one - but not the case for the front! --V


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE OUTSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE INSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


> maybe fixable with rubberized sealant - particularly the inside, but never a concours job for sure - but what are the choices now with fronts being NLA ????

...continued next post...
tod914
Tom, someone posted in the main about offering a service to repair them.
Tom_T
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:51 PM' post='1158711']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:42 PM' post='1158707']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:34 PM' post='1158704']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 02:46 PM' post='1158675']
[quote name='tod914' post='1158580' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM']

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
[/quote]

PS - does anyone know why all the used F & R top strips/pads seem to have a series of "dimples" every inch or so across the middle where the "crease" is??

Even my damaged ones are in far better shape rubber-wise (except for a small tear on the front-left), if they can just be shaped back into the proper curve - NO dimples at all!

Maybe I should just re-fit & use those!!?? idea.gif smash.gif

...any "Thotz" from the Xperts out there?

REAR TOP STRIP - NEW VS. DAMAGED/OLD:

Click to view attachment

> not much diff in condition - bend aside!


...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


REAR TOP STRIP - PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> no tears on rear one!

...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - CENTER DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> still no tears on rear one - but not the case for the front! --V


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE OUTSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE INSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


> maybe fixable with rubberized sealant - particularly the inside, but never a concours job for sure - but what are the choices now with fronts being NLA ????

...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

FRONT TOP STRIP - CENTER & DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

^ dark marks to left of tear are just my oily footprint when I crawled over car before removing this bumper - not another tear!



FRONT TOP STRIP - CENTER & PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


> no other tears on front one!


...continued next post...
Tom_T
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 04:05 PM' post='1158717']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:51 PM' post='1158711']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:42 PM' post='1158707']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 03:34 PM' post='1158704']
[quote name='Tom_T' date='Apr 16 2009, 02:46 PM' post='1158675']
[quote name='tod914' post='1158580' date='Apr 16 2009, 10:45 AM']

...and keep me posted, as I still need for my `73 2L App. Grp. car: L & R front tits & top strip/pad - as well as: F & R chrome bumpers, 2 fog lights & switch, original dual tone horn(s), L & R rear taillight assys. plus the US lenses! ...all having been damaged in the 5/85 accident! unsure.gif
[/quote]

PS - does anyone know why all the used F & R top strips/pads seem to have a series of "dimples" every inch or so across the middle where the "crease" is??

Even my damaged ones are in far better shape rubber-wise (except for a small tear on the front-left), if they can just be shaped back into the proper curve - NO dimples at all!

Maybe I should just re-fit & use those!!?? idea.gif smash.gif

...any "Thotz" from the Xperts out there?

REAR TOP STRIP - NEW VS. DAMAGED/OLD:

Click to view attachment

> not much diff in condition - bend aside!


...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


REAR TOP STRIP - PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> no tears on rear one!

...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

REAR TOP STRIP - CENTER DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

> still no tears on rear one - but not the case for the front! --V


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE OUTSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


FRONT TOP STRIP - DRIVER-SIDE INSIDE TEAR DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


> maybe fixable with rubberized sealant - particularly the inside, but never a concours job for sure - but what are the choices now with fronts being NLA ????

...continued next post...
[/quote]

...and more...

FRONT TOP STRIP - CENTER & DRIVER SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment

^ dark marks to left of tear are just my oily footprint when I crawled over car before removing this bumper - not another tear!



FRONT TOP STRIP - CENTER & PASS SIDE DETAIL:

Click to view attachment


> no other tears on front one!


...continued next post...
[/quote]


...and FINALLY...


FRONT TOP STRIP OVERALL: (1 nut still unreachable due to "tit"-brace & bent bumper)

Click to view attachment


> it has the one tear on the outside from the detail shots above - but NO annoying dimples!!!!


...so - wuddiya think? confused24.gif

Tom_T
QUOTE(tod914 @ Apr 16 2009, 03:59 PM) *

Tom, someone posted in the main about offering a service to repair them.


Gee Thanx Tod! Where was that link/thread? ...any idea where in the US they're located?

smile.gif
tod914
He's in TN. Very active on the board, 914rrr??? He also has the very nice olympic blue car (turbo).
Tom_T
QUOTE(tod914 @ Apr 16 2009, 04:29 PM) *

He's in TN. Very active on the board, 914rrr??? He also has the very nice olympic blue car (turbo).


Thanx - I think I know the one you're talking about. he was selling a white 73 roller that I considered for the parts, but then it turned out he was stripping the Fuchs 2.0 alloys, F&R chrome bumpers, top strips, tits, etc. that I needed to sell as parts - which made the car useless to me!

I run him down tohough for this "service" - at least TN is a few hundred miles closer to this coast & I get over there occasionally. I'm old school & like to see who & what I'm dealing with face to face for the most part!
tod914
Tom if I can locate the thread, I'll post it.
TedK
30K to set that up?? Man, that is pricey. I can see myself spending $1,000 for a like-new quality top, but thats just me.
Tom_T
QUOTE(TedK @ Apr 18 2009, 09:00 AM) *

30K to set that up?? Man, that is pricey. I can see myself spending $1,000 for a like-new quality top, but thats just me.


Frankly I was very unimpressed with that "new" (NOS?) rear top strip that I got a couple of weeks ago from PP, which still has the "Genuine Porsche" parts sticker on it, in comparison to my 36 year old one in the post above. Other than the "bends" in my "old" one, I can clean up the surface to look as good as the the "new" one. And the new one is also flexible & bendy anyway, because they're just solid rubber with non-continuous steel inserts molded into them for the bolt attachment points & semi-rigidity. If that's the "as new" finish quality, then I'd not pay for new unless I had to do so!

So a word of warning to George &/or Mikey &/or whomever else might take up this repro. rubber parts "holy grail test" - do a better job of getting a sealed and non-porous finish on them, for both looks & QC!

These OEM ones are somewhat porous & allows moisture to infiltrate down inside & rust the embedded steel parts & bumper tops!!!! VW/Porsche/Audi are all notorious for embedding rustable steel into their gasket parts which then rust away very quickly. I just spent $1000+/- last year to reseal the pop-top on our 88 Westfalia for that very reason! And you can see the rusted steel inside the tears in my old top strips (same thing inside the "crushed tits"), and they've been in my dry garage (not hermetically sealed) here in "The OC" since the "accident" in 85!
dry.gif
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2024 Invision Power Services, Inc.