OK, Miles tale of woe has got me worried. I disassembled my car 4 months ago, it was running just fine before the "rustoration" started, and in the process I drained and removed by gas tank. It has been sitting on the parts shelf since then. What should I do (if anything) to clean and reline the tank? How should I store it (I haven't done anything, but it sits there with no gas in it and the cap on. Any suggestions will be appreciated. By the way, IMHO the way the Steve at Otto's has responded has not helped him at all. Based on his comments alone, I would not care to do business with his shop.

I'm glad you asked, I was wondering the same Q... I stored my car in the garage until I got the time/money to work on it... and now I'm paranoid as hell!! should I replace the lines too or would the amount of gas in them hurt anything if the lines are in good shape?

I also agree about Otto's in regards to Miles thread... I don't intend to do business with the shop... they are there with partwerks and AA now!

It seems to me that replacing the fuel lines and relining the tank is one of the first projects we should perform since these are usually 30 years old and do not age well. One of the first posts I read was about rust in the tank and brittle plastic fuel lines. What good would it do to dump $$$$ in the motor and such if we feed it rust or it burns up! I think a decent radiator shop can handle the tank, but for peace of mind I'm going to do it. I"ve seen articles on this forum or PP.

POR-15 also sells a refinishing kit. I've heard good things, on the whole, about it.

--DD

Take the tank to a radiator shop and have them boil the tank, prior to the POR 15 setup.

Ive used the sealant on 2 tanks. Wurks gud...

Hey Korijo, when time permits can you give us some tips on how YOU did it? Or where do I find the thread. Thanks

The POR-15 kit is very easy to use, I did.

1. Remove tank
2. Plug up drain holes
3. Pour in warm water and cleaner and some clean nuts and bolts or clean rocks to switch around and break up all the rust and varnish. You may want to do this twice.
4. Let dry (best to use some sort of mild air flow, like a small electric room heater/fan blowing inside the main opening)
5. Pour in sealant. Plug up top hole that you poured goop in). Swish tank around for about 10 minutes in every direction to totally coat the inside. This can get tiring.
6. Drain out the sealing goop and make sure that when you are done, that the fuel inlet.outlet ports are untaped and cleared out so that the clean fuel can flow.
7. Let dry for 2 to 3 days or more. Again, some mild air flow helps.

One note... if you plan to powdercoat your tank (to make it purty), do the powdercoating first, then reline your tank. Otherwise the heat from the powdercoat oven may melt the POR liner you apply.



Regards,

Karl Ellzey

dude, nice tank.........


does your wife ever see these parts on the furniture???
I put a clean piston in the dishwasher and got yelled at for 20 minutes............

hey, who is that in your avatar and from what movie...it's looks familiar?!?!?

Tanks Kellsey, I guess I'll boil the tank, powdercoat it and finish it with POR-15. Dumd question but how clean do the ports end up? What I mean is do I have to retouch them or did the tape hold up and leave the inside of them smooth and coated? I'd hate to do all of this and find that the ports rusted sooner.

I got mine boil and coated inside for $100 at a local shop. Didnt feel like going through the hassle of all the steps with the Por15 kit.
Pretty good price considering the Por15 kit cost around $40

This subject has me wondering if varnish was the cause of my fresh 2.0L blowing as well. The PO let the car sit for 9+ months prior to my purchase. He rebuilt the engine 10,000 miles before it went up for sale. The PO roadraced as a hobby and appeared to know what he was doing from what I saw at his shop and I felt comfortable with his mechanical ability.

We made the deal, installed a new battery at his house since the original was dead from sitting too long. Checked oil level and blasted home.......about a 180 mile drive, running 90 mph almost the whole way. Car ran like a top and all mechanical and electrical systems worked like a new car. He rebuilt every part of the drivetrain prior to letting it sit.

I drove the car about 4 weeks and while filling it with gas one day (engine was at idle), the motor started knocking like hell. Towed it home and just stuck this up as another one of those pesky Porsche experiences I have witnessed many times in the past. Since my car was purchased for the sole purpose of stuffing in a v8, I did not go to the trouble of taking the failed engine apart. Pulled the valve covers and found nothing wrong there.

Fuel tank was found to contain rust during my restoration and was treated with the Por 15 tank restoration kit. All chemicals needed to perform job were in the $50 kit.

Looks like there are several lessons to be learned here when purchasing a old car that has been sitting for long periods of time.

I heard today that "Steve" from Ottos is actually Steve Stromberg. If this is true, I'll add that he hosed me on a set of bumpers I had restored through a personal deal (not at Ottos) I made with him about a year ago. Several emails to make this good went without a reply. Look forward to meeting him in person to resolve this the southern way.

John

Duct tape works well for sealing the ports.

Yes, my wife yells at me for leaving parts around the house, especially since the house is for sale. doh! I have the confined to one small area downstairs, an area upstairs int he bonus rom, and in the garage... so I guess they are everywhere.

When we are showing the house, I make a disclaimer. The men touring the home usually dig the car parts and start talking cars....

Code of the South. I resemble that remark. This really is a very small community, screw somebody and your reputation precedes you around the world wide web.

When we get the tank sealed at the Rad shop when they bring it back we put a air hose in and let a small amount of air blow thur it for two days to make sure it is fully cured. Steve

Yep, same Steve.

Oh... my avatar...

I feel greeeaat!


The rest are pretty funny too...

I like the 3-year Old and the Lunatic!

http://www.turnpikefilms.com/spots.html

Yes that is correct I am Steve Stromberg .I have dealt with many of you when I was at Pelican .Where I was know as the Grommet Hunter. Just try and get odd stuff from Pelican now, It anit going to happen as NO ONE there is the Master of the Micro Fiche like myself . So If I may be of service feel free to email me with those Items that you are looking for. Door Handle seals No problem. I have sources for parts all over the world. Between Otto and Myself you are getting 60 years of Porsche Knowlege. Steve

William,
Good radiator shop in Lowell that will do it...he drilled a hole in mine to access the inside of the tank behind the baffle plate...(specify where you want him to drill, dont let him decide on that point)
He cleaned it, vaccuumed all the crap out, dunked it in some seriously caustic stuff.
then closed it up and did the por 15 epoxy treatment to the inside.
All clean now, clean fuel with no more rust in the filters....
Nice guy, reasonable price...
I forget, but I think Lowell Radiator...
Not to many left around here that fix them any more, most places just sell you a new one...this guy is old school and quite an amusing place to go check out when you need a ride.

Rich

William,
I am sorry that you feel that way.. We sent him a fresh motor, how many other shops would do that even after we found out It was not our fault the motor failed. any other shop would of said NO WAY. Before you make a decision not to deal with me you should think about this I have the lowest prices and back them up with my knowlege of porsches that started in 1972 when I bought a 1961 356 Cab that had a engine fire and spent my Seinor year fixing it in autoshop. I have got more years of working on these cars than most of the guys on the board have been alive. Feel free to ask me question s I dont post a lot of answers on this board but just do a search on the pp board using SteveStromberg and my 1700 plus post will come up. Thanks for reading this and if I may be of service just send me an email. Steve

Steve you certainly have some balls my friend. I'm not taking sides in this matter, my comment was that I did not care for the tone and nature of your responses, they didn't seem professional or dignified. I especially thought the posting of prior e-mails from Miles and the tenor of your remarks was sarcastic and taunting. This is absolutely the last thing I want to deal with in any shop/ parts provider. I can spend (or not spend) my money anywhere. I do this for fun and have found most of the 914 community (Brad, Rich, Chris Foley, Jeff Bowlsby, the usual suspects) to be absolutely a joy to talk to and work with. And yes, occasionally I buy stuff from them, but they are more than happy to share their knowledge and assist me even if I'm not buying anything. IF what Miles says is true (car misrepresented, hobbled together, etc.) shame on Otto. If not, a more restrained and rational explanation of Otto's position would advance his case. Your attacks on Miles have seemed over the top and have not directly answered the numerous allegations of misrepresentations (sway bars, California car, original paint, etc. , etc.) A lot more would be accomplished by sticking to the merits of the claim and more importantly trying to help a brother in the 914 community who has a real problem to be resolved. I would like to see nothing more than for the responsible party to step up to the plate and fix this car.

Damn,
60 years........

I feel the need for an ultimate challenge coming on.

Two engines, one dyno and a pull to the death at redline.... all the while measuring torque, HP and engine temperatures. My best against whatever they can concokt in the crystal ball thats been snowballing for 60 years..... Man up and torture, hell we can both use it as a tax writeoff for R&D- no excuses!

As for bad gas! If you open the fuel filler and it smells like anything other than pure gas that would come out of the pump its starting to die.

It kills alot of engines, and EFI hates it as well.



Nice try... Its not what you know, not what you have experienced... Its how you apply it and what you remember.

Man up and build. I'm still as pissed off as a Hornet about your slimy alias posting about me and if need be I'll work 7 days a week for a year to contine to prove that 30 years of experience ain't worth a damn if its not applied correctly or anytrhing less than 100%!

You chose your flavor with me pal, and if it don't taste too good eat it anyway.

I'll insert my favorite quote here:

"Come on you sons of bitches, do you want to live forever?"

Dan Daly, battle of Belleau Wood -1918

Meanwhile, back at the farm...

My Humble Opinion Follows with regard to the original topic:

I won't coat a fuel tank. It took 20-30 years for that rust to form. Any car that's driven regularly shouldn't need to have the tank coated. If you take the tank to a good radiator shop and if it boiled or put in an ultrasonic tank, it will be clean and shiny and good as new. I'd rather have a few rust flakes in my fuel filter than coating flakes...

But that's just me...

Thanks Gint, that too makes sense to me. If the tank ends up rust free after boiling and such, then I can wait another 20 something years. Does the removal of rust weaked the tank? Maybe coating it adds extra protection. I also worry that the coating will find its way into my motor.

I hope I didn't bore anyone with keeping to the topic

Sorry to be an ass and invade the post, but that guy really irks me!

Anyway, the tank won't be severely weakened unless the rust is really bad. If its that bad replace the tank.

Mine was really bad in myu car (been sitting for 10 years) and I took it to a radiator shop and had them re-do it, works fine.

I got a good one!

A customer bought a stock turn-key1600 bug engine from me, phones me up says it runs like crap, and stalls half the time. I ran it in for at least a couple of hours, so I don’t understand why and I asked all the usual questions. He brings back the engine and I run it for several hours, no problem. He takes it back. Phones up, this time hopping mad, stills runs like shit (not all the time) and he wants his money back. I say, “look, bring me the car and I’ll check it out”. Nope, he doesn’t trust the car, yanks the engine (again) brings it up and yells at me to fix it right. So this time I stick it in the wife’s car and she drives it for two weeks, again no problems. He comes and picks it back up.

A couple of weeks later he phones up all apologetic, seems the tank liner (POR 15 I think, but not positive) peeled off in great big chunks and would fold over the outlet. A new tank was the end of his problems. He asked how much he owed me and I said forget about it. He sent me a cheque for $400 anyways.

I doubt if I will ever seal a tank.

What Jake said. As long as the rust isn't real bad, you're not going to have any issues with just boiling or ulrtasonic and ploppin 'er back in. You'll have to repaint the outside of the tank though. Mine's gonna get powder coated.

I just got off the phone with a local shop, said they WOULD boil it without re-lining... but said rust would form in the tank before I could even pick it up?! WTF?!?! are these guys full of shit? or should I shell out the 125 for the boiling +lining?

Tell 'em to just boil it. Then tell 'em thanks. Then paint and plop it back in.

That's what I would do anyway...

if the tank is taken to bare metal, yes, it's going to rust.....not sure what the humidity is like there, but once moisture gets to the bare metal, it'll start.....but like Mike feels on this, once the tank has some fuel in it (and sloshed around) the tank should be fine...that is as long as the car is driven and filled up once in a while....

does anyone know if the powdercoaters purge the inside of the tank with nitrogen or some other inert gas before baking them???

Hey Jake no need for apologies, but everything that could be said has been said.

Mark Henry confirmed my one fear of relining. Naked steel does start to rust right away but at that rate it's no more worse than I already have.

When does the Jake Motor group buy begin?

i had mine sitting on the shelf for over a year (yes, empty & dry) ...

when i was ready to put it back in, i simply rinsed it out with lots of water (yes, water!).
then let it dry in the sun (upsidedown) for a hour or so.

cleaned out the fuel lines with pressured brake-cleaner and hooked it all back up.

it's like new
Andy

Couldn't say... mine has been empty and open for almost a year.

If you haven't come straight from the hot tank I doubt that they will powdercoat it.. My guy's eyes got BIG when I brought my tank in, but I had come straight from the hot tank and there was no smell of gas inside. He did not even speak of purging it. Buy the way, POR-15's instruction sheet say's that all tanks do not require liner. Of course I did mine, you guy's make me nervous!