....I thought the purpose of the "nailed" threads was to distill OEM information and provide photo documentation of OEM cars and their specific details. The lengthy discussion of wheels and tires is certainly warranted, but it shouldn't be in the "nailed" Forum. Anyone looking for specific tire and wheel specs is going to be discouraged by trying to sort through all that discussion and all those quotes. The OEM wheel and tire selection appropriate to a 914/4 or /6 should be limited to an excellent, exemplary photo of an OEM wheel (no polishing, no plating, etc.) and a listing of factory approved and equipped tire sizes. A good photo of an OEM size tire would be nice, but not necessary. All else in that thread belongs in a discussion thread on this Forum site.

I cite the wheel and tire thread as the most flagrant abuse of the original intent of the nailed threads. The other threads also contain pictures of unoriginal areas for too many 914s. Are the cars presented clean?, many times "yes", but are hardly appropriate to be used to depict an original, representative example of a particular model. Each "nailed thread" should contain the very best example that we currently have (i.e. Garvey's '72/4 would be presented as the classic, as delivered model of its type). Other model years and trim levels should be represented by only the best examples that we can provide.

It was my belief that the "nailed thread" section was to present a (mostly) pictoral documentation of original equipment, color and presentation. Lets endeavor to make it a "go-to" site for those seeking to know how the 914 was "in its day".

If I've pissed anybody off, I'm sorry but we need to get back to basic info here

Paul

Point taken!

I won't bore the masses with my personal problems, but they are getting in the way of keeping this forum on target. Will do my best & that I promise, but things are a little rocky right now.
Pat

I was ready to split a lot of the "tires & wheels" posts into another area, but re-read all the posts & thought about it some more.

There IS some really good info there. There is some (in my opinion only) erroneous material. Fact is, (and I am not in agremeement) Vred's are accepted by PCA (they are WRONG). But, others have some valid arguements, though for euro delivery on (maybe late madel delivery too).

So, I'm about to poll the audience on that thread. We'll see.
Pat

Pat, I found it really helpful & educational on all fronts.

So IMHO - I encourage you not to strip it out, but perhaps drop it into regular threads if you must. The poll has been useful too!

Maybe you could also look at my thread on mfgr date for "proper" Fuchs 2ls & advise if you know how PCA etc. judge that aspect, since I have to find a set of 5 & recreate the OE wheels Fuchs 2L Alloys on my 73 2L, after the dealer or PO dang fool removed them!

Thanx!

As an example (of how it should be presented) in a "nailed" thread distilling information on wheels & tires, posts #1, #2, #6 and #58 are useful posts defining wheel and/or tire info. The discussions are certainly valid and encouraged, but I believe they should be located in the general O&H threads, and not in the "nailed" area.

Paul

Paul, while I agree with those 4 examples being on target - for those of us out here looking for resources & help in nailing down what is correct, there are many more of the posts which are helpful as well.

For example, several which I had posted listing the OE fitments from various MY's sales brochures, those with who & what is actually available today in terms of tires, vintage tire dealer contacts, etc. - are what those of us trying to reconstruct our 914s back to OE now are also VERY important. Likewise, several of the discussions are helpful in clarifying questions on these matters.

If buried in the milieu of general O&H post threads, then this valuable resource simply disappears & becomes lost after a time - unless there is a way to keep selected ones at the top of the list permanently & automatically (Moderator??)?

While the 4 posts which you listed are historically accurate & interesting factoids - one can likewise make a valid argument that "what was but isn't around anymore" is essentially useless to restorers today!

If they do NOT make the OE Tires for a particular model/engine today, then it's a mute point!

A suggested format would encompass.....
(This being a very preliminary example)

For MY 197x
wheels available were...4 cyl : 4.5x15 (show excellent photo)/steel
: 5.5x15 (" " )/steel
: 5.5x15 (" " )/alloy-Pedrenni
tires sizes for MY 197x 4 cyl: 155 15
: 165 15
OEM tires by Dunlop, Continental, etc, etc.


This, of course, is only a suggested format, and can and should be updated as information is acquired, verified and confirmed.

Each 914 model year would include a good photo of as an excellent example of a wheel appropriate for that MY. Wheel size would be specified and tire fitment for that wheel would be included. OEM tire manufacture could also be aqdded.


Paul

Sample.......

For Model Year 1972, the following wheels were available

Steel 5.5Jx15 fitted with xxx/15 or xxx/15

Alloy 5.5Jx15 fitted with xxx/15 or xxx/15

Tires provided by Michelin (ZX, XAS, .......)
Continental (................)

Regardless of what we do with these posts, you're in incorrect. Fuchs alloys were never available as a'72 option. 1973 was the first year. And...who can tell me what's incorrect with my gorgeous refurbisged steelies?
Pat

Pat,
I thought you had told me that the dealer (Classic P+A) had removed the Fuchs from your car.

Allright, you want a really correct picture of a "steel wheel".......(Jeesh, what I posted was only a sample, example, template, suggestion, etc.).
Let's get back to cleaning up the nailed posts.

Steel wheel..................................

Gosh.....this is better than what's on TV!

Paul, I've been looking all over for xxx by 15 tires, but can't find them anywhere!?

As to Fuchs 4-lugs, I suppose any dealer could strip the alloys off the 2L cars they were OE on & try to get another $800+ from the unsuspecting buyers, & probably did NOT discount the now lesser equipped 2L 914! I think that was Pat's story he posted, if I recall it correctly?

Then there was that BO Recall on the Fuchs 2l Alloy Wheels sent out 12/72 by VW America, which had the dealers pull off the "wrong" Fuchs which didn't fit the new for 73 MY self-centering "hub-centric" front hubs (see that tires & wheels post which you're complaining about for details & link to the recall letters, cuz I'm not reposting yet again).

They also apparently swapped the spare Fuchs for a steelie, then had a set of 4 to sell with 4 such swaps.

In that case, the dealer could talk the unsuspecting 914-2L buyer with the wrong Fuchs, into accepting a set of 4 cheaper Rivieras & a steel spare instead (as they did with my foolish PO/OO), & then keep both the "wrong" & new PAG/VWA supplied set of "correct" Fuchs wheels - 5 + 5 = 2.5 sets of $800+ each of very salable "accessories" off just one 914-2L, as well as collecting a fat fee from VWA/PAG for doing the 5 wheels inspections & change-out!!!!

So in one fell swoop, that dealer has made a "no cost to him" & pure profit equal to that which he'd make by selling several 914s at a 20% profit margin! ....math for that is also at that dreaded tires & wheels nailed thread! No proof, just speculation on their doing this double strip thing!

Paul - I just do NOT think things are as simple as you propose, as BOTH this & the nailed post proves by the ever expanding discussions & questions!

If anyone ever does REALLY sort it all out, then they should write a book!?

Paul,

Let's get the story straight. My 914 came from tha factory with the app grp, sans proper wheel & tires. Came in with 4 1/2"ers. Made the dealer aware of it. The OFFERED me a set of Fuchs (the 2 liters came in at the same time as mine). I hated them, thought they were ugly (duhh!) and said no & "what else can you do, or I won't accept the car?". They gave me a Bursch exhaust (which eventually destroyed my snowplow) and a promise of 5 correct wheels & tires. I was happy - my 914 made lotsa noise, and they DID eventually provide me with the proper wheels & tires. Gave the 4 1/2 " ers to Dick Weiss to use on a 21 window van.

Now, over the years, my correct 5 1/2"ers succombed to the rigors of daily use. They were resored my Forry Hargitt in 1980, though the centers were left "undusted" with flat black. They are so gorgeous that I couldn't do that to them, and are covered by hubcaps. They also have a finish that is too glossy, but I love them, and won't booger them up with flat black centers. That's just me.

Now that we're talking about wheels.....Are yours correct & documented by your COA? Sorry, couldn't resist. If we own these things long enough, we make our own choices as to what we like. I prefer to keep something (as you do too) that "resembles" original. Over the years, I've had my flings with totally bogus wheels, that just looked purdy on the car, got rid of them & went back to basics.

However, the next time my 72 hits the road, it will be with deep dish chromies, and will stay that way. I'll keep the rerstored steelies protected for the inheritor.