Motor tear down Options

[lsintampa]

75 914/4 2.0 d-jet

Boring story, but it looks like I need to get into my motor. The motor came with the car and was nice and clean. All parts that could be powder coated were, it was like new looking. It also had valves re-adjusted, leak tested (OK), and internal probes showed it to be very clean (info from PO).

It sat on my garage floor for 5 months while I tended to the car's other needs. I did drop some oil into each cylinder before I put the plugs in. But the fuel feeder tubes and inlet ports were wide open for a while. But plugged with rags (noted).

Anyway now that I'm finally getting around to trying to start it, the motor is all but seized up. It turns, but it is really hard to move and when it does, it sounds raspy like it's grinding something or scraping something. Hard to explain but it don't sound good.

So, I'm starting all over and I'm going to drop that motor back out and get into it. It is the ONLY way that I will know for sure what I'm dealing with.

Thanks for everyone that's helped along the way. I'm sure once I get into this motor, I'll be looking for help once again.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)

[Bartlett 914]

That seems pretty extreme. How did it turn over when the rebuild was done? Maybe you should do something to put oil pressure into the system and try it.

[lsintampa]

That seems pretty extreme. How did it turn over when the rebuild was done? Maybe you should do something to put oil pressure into the system and try it.

I can only go on what I was told and what I observed since I got the car. I don't think it was rebuilt. From what I know it was cleaned, new external seals were put on and the valves adjusted.

How do you get oil pressure in this motor? My first air cooled motor, I'm used to oil pumps in the sump that work off of the motor running.

[stugray]

Did the PO possibly install a "better" oil pump during this upgrade?

Hint...Hint....

Stu

[r_towle]

To get it primed, remove all the plugs and spin it for about 30 seconds.
That should bring oil up to the rockers which you can see if you remove one of the valve covers.
Beware, it could be messy.

Rich

[lsintampa]

Did the PO possibly install a "better" oil pump during this upgrade?

Hint...Hint....

Stu

better how? sorry I'm not getting the hint

[lsintampa]

To get it primed, remove all the plugs and spin it for about 30 seconds.
That should bring oil up to the rockers which you can see if you remove one of the valve covers.
Beware, it could be messy.

Rich

If I could spin it, I wouldn't be dropping it out to tear it down. This is the major issue, it barely moves at all.

[lsintampa]

I can see why you all may be confused.

When I said it "turns", I meant it moves - it sure as heck doesn't turn. If I put a 30MM socket on the wheel hub and get a breaker bar, I can move it a bit, until it gets so tight that all I'm moving is the clutch on the flywheel - I think that's the rasping sound I hear.

I dosed all 4 cylinders with oil for two days, but still not really freeing up.

Not seeing much else to do at this point other that pull it and take a look inside.

[Java2570]

I know you've had several threads here lately about this engine....since it hasn't run for so long, do you know any history about the engine and how it was stored?
When you got it, did it actually turn better than it does now? Do you have any documentation on what was done to the motor? It would be nice if someone in your area that knows these cars could take a look at it.....

[stugray]

better how? sorry I'm not getting the hint

Oil pump "upgrades" to the type-I pump often result in the cam gear hitting the pump causing all kinds of "grinding" possibilities.

What is the chance that the PO did a motor rebuild with a new pump, but didnt clearance it right?

Stu

[lsintampa]

better how? sorry I'm not getting the hint

Oil pump "upgrades" to the type-I pump often result in the cam gear hitting the pump causing all kinds of "grinding" possibilities.

What is the chance that the PO did a motor rebuild with a new pump, but didnt clearance it right?

Stu

Not sure about that. I'm sending him an email now, but I don't think the oil pump was messed with - maybe resealed, but I don't think replaced. Really don't know.

Thanks!

[Bartlett 914]

Sorry but I thought you rebuilt it. Remove the plugs. Does it then move? I did a install of a motor that had been sitting awhile. It was a used motor not rebuilt. Carbon had broken loose causing the motor to not turn. I did not force it. I removed the heads and cleaned them. Resealed everything and I am good. Not sure if this helps....

[r_towle]

Sorry, throughout you fuel injector saga you kept stating that you would turn it over and no fuel was coming out of the injectors, that is why I assumed it turned over.


Just pull the motor out.
It takes about a Saturday to tear it down to the crankshaft, including removal of the motor.

Overall, you can rebuild one in about 30 hours, but that does not include any possible machine work.

Don't be scared of the prospect, it's a fairly simple motor, and everyone here will help, kibitz, make sarcastic comments, and bust your balls three years from now when you have not finished it yet

[lsintampa]

Sorry, throughout you fuel injector saga you kept stating that you would turn it over and no fuel was coming out of the injectors, that is why I assumed it turned over.


Just pull the motor out.
It takes about a Saturday to tear it down to the crankshaft, including removal of the motor.

Overall, you can rebuild one in about 30 hours, but that does not include any possible machine work.

Don't be scared of the prospect, it's a fairly simple motor, and everyone here will help, kibitz, make sarcastic comments, and bust your balls three years from now when you have not finished it yet

Thanks,

Yeah it was turning over for a bit. Then it just seized up. There was one backfire, so timing I know was off.

Got this info from the PO:

"the long block was not opened up and the motor turned over by hand
(plugs out) very easy, so as long as nothing got down an intake or exhaust
port and ingested I would be skeptical of internal problems...that said, the
flywheel was a new aftermarket unit and I did not install it, and I would
investigate the front blower/fan/pulley area...the AC pulley was originally
installed behind the cooling fan and the bolts that held that assembly were
most likely slightly longer than the factory bolts and if the pulley was not
reinstalled you could have interference with the front on the block....just
my thoughts...you might want to pull the trans. to look for flywheel rubbing
issues ( it looked the same but??) if not I would next look at the front end
for blower fan problems that are causing rubbing and ultimately end play
issues."

In any event, the motor is coming out and we'll go from there.

[stugray]

If you reinstall the fan without the proper spacer you will have this very issue...

Stu

[speed metal army]

Not in gear is it ? Just checking....

[mepstein]

I't didn't seize from sitting in your garage for 5 months. Either it was siezed before or something is keeping it from turning. My car sat in my mom's humid garage for 22 years and the piston and cylinders looked fine and turned easily.

[lsintampa]

If you reinstall the fan without the proper spacer you will have this very issue...

Stu

And if that happens, what type of damage can be expected? Curious if this turns out to be the case, what I'll be looking at.

I'm assuming the motor is going to need repairs, so I'm debating now my options.

Thanks Stu,

Len

[VaccaRabite]

Sorry, throughout you fuel injector saga you kept stating that you would turn it over and no fuel was coming out of the injectors, that is why I assumed it turned over.


Just pull the motor out.
It takes about a Saturday to tear it down to the crankshaft, including removal of the motor.

Overall, you can rebuild one in about 30 hours, but that does not include any possible machine work.

Don't be scared of the prospect, it's a fairly simple motor, and everyone here will help, kibitz, make sarcastic comments, and bust your balls three years from now when you have not finished it yet

Its true. I'm proof of this.

Zach

[nathansnathan]

If you reinstall the fan without the proper spacer you will have this very issue...

Stu

And if that happens, what type of damage can be expected? Curious if this turns out to be the case, what I'll be looking at.

Without the spacer, the end of the bolts for the fan hub would tear up the crank seal.

Another possibility, it could be an end play issue. If it's too much, the distributor drive gear can hang up and keep the crank from turning. Too little and it would definitely be hard to turn. It's supposed to have 3-5 thousandths play.