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> Wide-band preliminary results, EFI guys must read!, Narrow-band sucks!!!!
Mark Henry
post May 20 2005, 02:43 PM
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10.5 AFR!! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) That’s what I was running!

I was tuning with a Haltech AF-30 narrow band and they are “supposed” to be pretty good. Since I was running so rich before, now my gas mileage should go up and the throttle seems way crisper. I’ll post my fuel values later (before and after) once I’ve fine-tuned them a bit better.

Wide band users! If you’re running an exhaust extension tube, your lambda is not getting hot enough for an accurate reading! Even if it is a heated unit…mine is.
The WMS wideband has an LED that lights up when it hot enough…It took almost 10 min. at the “Y” in my Ansa exhaust (with SSI’s) before I had a green “hot enough” LED. A header would most likely heat up way faster.
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lapuwali
post May 20 2005, 02:57 PM
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Did you tune your car via the Halmeter to be on the rich side, or was that after tuning to 14.7:1?
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william harris
post May 20 2005, 03:05 PM
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Is it just me? I have no idea what any of this means? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Wide band - is that like my cable with Comcast? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif) English translation - or better yet - the "For Dummies" version for the rest of us. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/happy11.gif)
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Mark Henry
post May 20 2005, 03:13 PM
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Hmmm.....

Seems like there's a problem with my wideband...I should have a green LED in 15 seconds...It's not heating up like it should. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/headbang.gif)

Talked to Ross at SDS and they're going to Fed-Ex me another meter ASAP.
Of course it's a long weekend here this weekend. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif)

Results on hold for now. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad.gif)
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Mueller
post May 20 2005, 03:18 PM
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QUOTE (william harris @ May 20 2005, 02:05 PM)
Is it just me?  I have no idea what any of this means?   (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Wide band - is that like my cable with Comcast? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif)   English translation - or better yet - the "For Dummies" version for the rest of us. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/happy11.gif)

in very simple terms:

the narrow band is like a regular light switch, on/off (rich or lean)

the wide band is more like a rheostat potentiometer light switch, many variables (it's tell you how rich or how lean you are)
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mightyohm
post May 20 2005, 03:40 PM
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Mark - The wideband sensor should be able to heat up even with the car off, mine only takes about 30 seconds.

If it's not heating up your supply voltage may be too low at the controller, or the controller is not trying hard enought to heat the sensor (bad design).

The sensor will not work properly unless the lambda cell is HOTTER than the exhaust gas it is measuring. Totally different than narrowband.
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lapuwali
post May 20 2005, 03:57 PM
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QUOTE (william harris @ May 20 2005, 01:05 PM)
Is it just me? I have no idea what any of this means? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Wide band - is that like my cable with Comcast? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif) English translation - or better yet - the "For Dummies" version for the rest of us. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/happy11.gif)

See my blog. I just put a definition there that seemed to help one other person with the same question on another thread.
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Mueller
post May 20 2005, 03:59 PM
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QUOTE (lapuwali @ May 20 2005, 02:57 PM)

See my blog.

not to sound like a perv....nice Blog man (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/pray.gif)
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Mark Henry
post May 21 2005, 11:24 AM
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QUOTE (jkeyzer @ May 20 2005, 05:40 PM)
If it's not heating up your supply voltage may be too low at the controller, or the controller is not trying hard enought to heat the sensor (bad design).

SDS has over a thousand WMS units in service already and I'm only the second return. They think the issue is in the harness.
For the simple install there's only two wires (power and ground) so there's nothing to screw up.

Anyways, I should have a new one by tuesday and they're paying for the return shipping.
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crash914
post May 21 2005, 01:01 PM
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10.5 to 1 is way way too rich....of course that is what my MS is reading....

I know that my WB02 gets hot very quickly. I drilled and installed a bung just after both pipes came together. Bursch exhaust.

Modern FI is the bomb...no matter which you are running..
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airsix
post May 21 2005, 03:12 PM
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Mark/Herb,
This is funny. I tuned with narrow-band to get things roughted in before getting my LM-1 wideband. Guess what. My narrow-band tuned AFR was about 10.5. That lambda curve sure is steep. Wideband rocks. They'd sell more of them if instead of sighting the technical aspects they just said "Buy this. It will fix your AFR, but more importantly it will save your marriage, your relationship with your kids, keep you from losing your job, and help you avoid being institutionalized."

-Ben M.
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crash914
post May 21 2005, 04:06 PM
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My wife hates it when I am tuning in the garage....I am tuning for a 2.35v crossover point...

My car is rich rich rich.....it really stinks at 10.5. But Hey! it doesn't ping!!
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Mark Henry
post May 21 2005, 04:47 PM
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My duty cycles are so low with the 2.0 injectors I'm going to try some smaller injectors....I think my buddy has some 1.7 injectors (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/idea.gif)

What other injectors fit a stock injector holder?

My wideband is now hit and miss...same issue this AM but now it's working fine.
Bet it makes me look like a duffus when they test it..."Ummm.... dars nutin' wrong with it"
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airsix
post May 21 2005, 07:23 PM
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QUOTE (Mark Henry @ May 21 2005, 02:47 PM)
My duty cycles are so low with the 2.0 injectors I'm going to try some smaller injectors....I think my buddy has some 1.7 injectors (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/idea.gif)

What other injectors fit a stock injector holder?

Mark,
Try some 1.7 injectors. If 1.7 injectors are still to big you could try the injectors I was using - 1.8 Turbo Subaru. They are hose-barb and a direct drop-in swap. They flow less than the 1.7 injectors so with your displacement (2.2?) they might be too small. Anyway, those are the two options that are probably the easiest/cheapest.

-Ben M.
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Mark Henry
post May 21 2005, 07:33 PM
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Thanks Ben (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

Nope...this engine is my stock orginal 1.8 with 75K on it. sold the 2.0

Still gathering parts on my 2.6 T4....still need TB's and a header...only $ in my way (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad.gif)
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airsix
post May 22 2005, 07:10 PM
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QUOTE (Mark Henry @ May 21 2005, 05:33 PM)
Thanks Ben (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

Nope...this engine is my stock orginal 1.8 with 75K on it. sold the 2.0

Mark,
If you try the 1.7's and they are still too big let me know. I'll send you my Scooby injectors. They are still in the car and I can drive it - I just can't go above 5,000rpm on boost. Without boost they're fine all the way past redline. I only payed $5 each for them.

-Ben M.
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Mark Henry
post May 23 2005, 06:34 AM
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Thanks Ben (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif)

I'll let You know once I've tried them...Maybe I should try my 1.8 L-jet injectors first.
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