No Power to Starter Solenoid, Smoking Distributor Options

[Blown59]

Ive been restoring/modifying my 74 914 for the last 6-7 months. I built wooden car stands which sat atop wheel dollies which in turn suspended my 914 from its 4 jack points and allowed for mobility within my garage. The entire car has been gone through except for the dash removal and engine removal. The restoration was done working around the dash in place. Harness was wound, placed in a plastic bag and taped shut to seal it from debris. The engine compartment was pretty much untouched... except for removal of engine cover, mesh, firewall insulation (re-welded engine cover tabs). Engine compartment will be refinished come winter while the engine is out for rebuild (2270). Trailing arms, all suspension, axle shafts, steering rack, were all removed to sand/blast/paint and reinstall with new bushings (converted to 5 lug with 911, 944, and 986 parts).

So, there is the small back story to the car (in case any of that sets off a flag for my issues). Im the second owner and have not had any issues (other than burning oil - leaky valve cover gaskets, push rod o-rings). The engine is a 1.8 with dual Weber 40 IDFs. It made the trek from Kentucky to St Louis when I bought it about a yr ago with no issues... other than some heavy smoke at stoplights from oil leaking on the heat exchangers. Once back here, it was only driven maybe 300-350 miles before being put up on stands for resto.

Yesterday, I got the car down and wanted to get a couple miles on the car to settle the suspension before taking it in for alignment.

When I got the battery of the trickle charger and got it installed, everything powered up and worked beautifully... All lighting, horn, signals, cigarette lighter, door buzzer, etc. The car would not start. My fuel pump hums, relays click... Checked power at the starter red wire and Im good. Yellow Solenoid has no current. Traced back to the seatbelt relay under the passenger seat. Solid yellow (pin C - on the bottom) which i assume comes from the ignition is hot. Yellow/Red (pin 50 - on top) which runs to the board in the engine compartment is not. Had my daughter "Start" the car and hold the ignition in the "Start" position for current load, No power. Tried bypassing the relay by jumping C and 50 to no avail. In the meantime we could smell a strong electrical burning. Come to notice the distributor smoking. Pulled the cap and the + from the coil. Went back to troubleshooting my non-start only to notice the distributor smoking again. The black - wire was hot. This was happening while my daughter was holding the key in the "Start" position.

At that point i was done for the night... Frustrated I could not get my shakedown in after being up on the stands for 7 months and finding the car wont start and seems to be shorting my points.

Never had an issue like this in the past. Im not sure what distributor is on the car. There is no vac advance as the PO removed the original and installed this one when he installed the Webers (if my memory serves me correctly)

Any ideas why/what could prevent the starter solenoid from getting power even when jumping the two pins? (the harness between the dash was not touched (except to remove gauges to paint the gauge surround) The harness was left in the tunnel and masking tape placed over to protect it. That bit of the passenger compartment under the harness did not get stripped or painted. The bits from under the passenger and driver seat were rolled up, sealed and a plastic bag and taped shut. The bag was suspended with a string during paint. The harness in the engine compartment was never touched, though the rear trunk harness was wound up, bagged and put in the engine compartment during paint.

I told myself I was going to walk away from the car today... but I just have this nagging issue that I cant leave alone until I know its resolved.

Thanks in advance

[ejm]

Sounds like the engine harness connector is miss indexed on the relay board. Easy to put it on one pin off.

[Blown59]

Sounds like the engine harness connector is miss indexed on the relay board. Easy to put it on one pin off.

Ill have a look and see, then report back. Thanks!

[rjames]

Sounds like the engine harness connector is miss indexed on the relay board. Easy to put it on one pin off.

I did that accidentally years ago. The smoke from my distributor was the little ground wire burning up. Luckily I was able to resolder it and all was good again (after correctly connecting the harness to relay board).

[Blown59]

Sounds like the engine harness connector is miss indexed on the relay board. Easy to put it on one pin off.

I did that accidentally years ago. The smoke from my distributor was the little ground wire burning up. Luckily I was able to resolder it and all was good again (after correctly connecting the harness to relay board).

Sure enough, that was the fix!

I chuckled when I read this, thinking who would do such a thing.... Well, apparently this guy! Everything turns over and does what its supposed to, except actually start now. I need to make a permanent jumper or replace the relay if they are available. And I need to see if I need to points are fried (I suspect they are).

Much thanks for sharing your knowledge, Ill sleep a bit easier tonight!

[jcd914]

Sounds like the engine harness connector is miss indexed on the relay board. Easy to put it on one pin off.

I did that accidentally years ago. The smoke from my distributor was the little ground wire burning up. Luckily I was able to resolder it and all was good again (after correctly connecting the harness to relay board).

Sure enough, that was the fix!

I chuckled when I read this, thinking who would do such a thing.... Well, apparently this guy! Everything turns over and does what its supposed to, except actually start now. I need to make a permanent jumper or replace the relay if they are available. And I need to see if I need to points are fried (I suspect they are).

Much thanks for sharing your knowledge, Ill sleep a bit easier tonight!

Go for a permanent jumper for the yellow wires at the seatbelt interlock relay.
The relays are know to fail.
Mine are crimped together.

Jim

[Frankvw]

wow, that was a fast diagnosis and solution based on the provided info !
Yes, I fully understand these issues cause sleepless nights, and help from the 914world is a great remedy.
GOod to read these things on 914world, also learn a lot from this !

[Blown59]

Go for a permanent jumper for the yellow wires at the seatbelt interlock relay.
The relays are know to fail.
Mine are crimped together.

Jim

Thats what Ive done... Sorta... I took a piece of 12g solid wire about 1.5 inches long. Hammered the ends on my vice to flatten them. Trimmed the ends as they obviously grew from hammering and left about .75 inch section of 12g round in the middle. Pulled pins C and 50. Rolled and crimped the flattened ends around the bottom of the spades where they were crimped on the wires. Inserted the spades back into the block and reinserted the relay.

Now I have my annoying buzzer and keep the rest of the circuits in tact.

wow, that was a fast diagnosis and solution based on the provided info !
Yes, I fully understand these issues cause sleepless nights, and help from the 914world is a great remedy.
GOod to read these things on 914world, also learn a lot from this !

I was quite amazed myself and very pleased with how fast this was diagnosed. I dont post much, but have been a long time lurker. I utilized this board for several years off and on before I ever joined. It has proven to be invaluable through my project and Im sure will continue to be. I just hope I can at some point I become knowledgeable enough to pay it forward to others.

Thanks again for all the help!

[Porschef]

Ed’s the man... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[rmital]

Ed’s the man... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I've totally said that before....