OT Porsche should have used Aluminum Options

[Unobtanium-inc]

It's timeless. On the left of the weld is original 550 Spyder aluminum from 54-55, on the right is brand new aluminum, hard to tell a difference!

[mb911]

Oxy welded aluminum ?

[Unobtanium-inc]

Oxy welded aluminum ?

This was TIG

[Brett W]

Oxy/hydrogen is perfect for this situation. Much easier to planish as its not hard like a TIG weld. No soot and contamination like Oxy/acetylene.

What aluminum did you use? 1100 or 3003?

[carr914]

that weld looks like ass

[mb911]

I have been teaching welding at a college level for 21 years and thought for sure it was a picture of oxy welds because of the inconsistencies of the weld. Below is a typical example of aluminum TIG and you will see the white cleaning action on the edges of the weld that is why I questioned it. I will not comment any further as I am very happy to see the body saved and the willingness to preserve the vehicles.

[Superhawk996]

Man, hard crowd to please. As I offer my "opinion" I'll also post a couple pictures of my "proof of work" to show that I have at least a little experience that formed the basis of my opinion. I built a concept tank for a Norton Cafe out of aluminum. This tank was pressure tested. There were something like 12 or 13 panels that were used to fabricate this tank.

First off, I'm with @mb911 , great to see an old car being saved. That is the top priority. I'm only jealous that I don't get to play with 550's. I'm also jealous that I still can't lay that stack of dimes look on aluminum consistently like the previous picture.

On the subject of OxyAcetylene welding, lest we forget, much of the welding on the aluminum components and fuel & oil tanks for airplanes of WW2 was Oxyacetylene. Not as pretty as TIG but 100% functional.

OxyHydrogen would be nice but let's be honest, most of us don't have hydrogen sitting around the garage. I had no issues with soot contamination. Flux, and proper flame setting take care of that.

The weld appearance doesn't really matter as long as there is 100% fusion through the panel and the finished weld sits proud of the surface. As previously noted, it will be leveled off flush with the surrounding metal prior to paint.

In my experience, OxyAcetylene left less porosity and was easier to polish since it didn't leave the cleaned margins that TIG left. I found that OxyAcetylene left an invisible weld seam. TIG did not. I'll chalk that up to my poor TIG skills and/or ability to fine tune the AC cleaning of my Lincoln Precision TIG equipment. Invisibility of the weld seam on a 550 is moot, since it will be painted. Invisibility of the seam is very important on a bare polished tank.

Here is top view of the tank as well as the bottom welds that look . . . well, not as pretty.

So this is for all you guys with OxyAcetylene sitting around. Don't think you need TIG to do welding on Aluminum. Get the proper size tips (0, 00, 000), get the proper flux, proper goggles, then get out there and go weld some aluminum. Any technique you learn with heat and filler rod control will only help later on if/when you move on to TIG.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I can see you guys walking up to a 550 in 1956 after it won the Targa Florio and telling Porsche how shitty their welds are. Here are some Factory welds. Given what Porsche did with these welds I think the ones we are doing are ok. Not to mention you're missing the point of body welding, most of what you are looking at gets ground down and goes away. So while welding up some plumbing or exhaust where the weld will be exposed for the life of the fixture it might matter how pretty the weld is, when doing auto body, even aluminum, you weld, then grind so what matters is weld penetration and when you weld both sides you get maximum penetration.

[Superhawk996]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) that has to be so cool to see those parts in person . . . to hold them in your hand, and to see what they did all those years ago.

I restored a 1960's Honda Dream back in the early 90's. The quality of the welds is terrible. Functional - yes. Pretty - hell no. That was back when the Japanese were just really getting serious about kicking America's (and the UK) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bootyshake.gif) in the motorcycle market. They were quick learner's and took the advice of people like Demming seriously.

Was super cool to be able to look at that early step in their evolution.

Same going on there with the 550. Absolutely cool and thanks @unobtanium-inc for sharing these sorts of photos and learning opportunities with the community.

[Unobtanium-inc]

that weld looks like ass

With that attitude, there is a reason people don't like you.

[Puebloswatcop]

Unobtanium,

Pay no attention to nay sayers. Hell I used to weld as a ship fitter back in the 70's and 80's. Hadnt really welded since. So when I started working on my car, my welds didn';t look the best either, but they are improving and they are functional. I will say that unless you do it every day, it is a perishable skill.

I think that your project is awesome and saving an old piece of art such as yours is awesome... So don't let the nay-sayers discourage you.

[Root_Werks]

Working with aluminum is hard, I've only welded it a few times with no formal training. Mild steel is much easier to work with.

Project is really coming along. Being able to work on such a piece of history is very cool!

[Brett W]

The factory probably gas welded those.

It is a cool project, also interesting to see how crude the factory was with those cars.

Agreed, the process is kinda irrelevant, as long as you got full penetration and filled the pin holes so you can properly file and finish it. The underside is not relevant just the exterior as long as you can finish it to acceptable quality. once ground down it will need planishing and straightening anyways so fancy dime stacking doesn't matter here..

[Shivers]

So this is for all you guys with OxyAcetylene sitting around. Don't think you need TIG to do welding on Aluminum. Get the proper size tips (0, 00, 000), get the proper flux, proper goggles, then get out there and go weld some aluminum. Any technique you learn with heat and filler rod control will only help later on if/when you move on to TIG.

Thank You. Do you pre-heat the aluminum like cast iron?




@Unobtanium-inc

Very cool project.

[Superhawk996]

Thank You. Do you pre-heat the aluminum like cast iron?

No. Not for sheet aluminum.

[mb911]

I can see you guys walking up to a 550 in 1956 after it won the Targa Florio and telling Porsche how shitty their welds are. Here are some Factory welds. Given what Porsche did with these welds I think the ones we are doing are ok. Not to mention you're missing the point of body welding, most of what you are looking at gets ground down and goes away. So while welding up some plumbing or exhaust where the weld will be exposed for the life of the fixture it might matter how pretty the weld is, when doing auto body, even aluminum, you weld, then grind so what matters is weld penetration and when you weld both sides you get maximum penetration.

Just to clarify I after many thousands of hours of aluminum welding thought for sure your welds pictured were oxy welded. As many stated that was the norm until the late 60s early 70s and the bead charitistics looked to verify it. My statement was not to give any hard feelings.

[mepstein]

The process isn’t irrelevant. Maybe if you are mounting the part to a wall but not if it’s going to get finished and used. I’m not laying in on Adam. It’s his property to do what he wants and sometimes you have to just do the best you can. But welding is more than sticking two pieces of metal together.

Again, I’m not criticizing Adam. I often think I am doing good, at least for myself, when I take unused parts and turn them into something useful. In my mind, It’s better than letting them for in a box. If someone can do better, they will get the chance when I sell it off, give it away or I’m dead.

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[Unobtanium-inc]

Maybe if you are mounting the part to a wall but not if it’s going to get finished and used. I’m not laying in on Adam.

Who would be crazy enough to do that?

[lesorubcheek]

550s are amazing. Thanks for sharing and, I'll say it again, I really wish I lived closer 'cause it'd be amazing to see this in person. Please keep posting updates.

Dan

[mb911]

550s are amazing. Thanks for sharing and, I'll say it again, I really wish I lived closer 'cause it'd be amazing to see this in person. Please keep posting updates.

Dan

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