Home  |  Forums  |  914 Info  |  Blogs
 
914World.com - The fastest growing online 914 community!
 
Porsche, and the Porsche crest are registered trademarks of Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche AG. This site is not affiliated with Porsche in any way.
Its only purpose is to provide an online forum for car enthusiasts. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners.
 

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

> Autocross tire squeal, Not the good kind
worn
post Sep 24 2015, 08:55 PM
Post #1


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
After a spirited run around and over the cones I noticed a rubber smell persisting. This week driving to work I heard a squeal. Today it seems the right rear tire is rubbing the inner fender where the box projects towards the wheel. The camber has become more pronounced and is visibly tipped in at the top of the wheel. Tires are 205s, but they cleared before. Clearly something has changed, and I suspect that in fact it changed during the autocross. Can you help me with ideas? The suspension console looks ok but the car has rust separating much of the firewalls from the floor at the rear. Car actually feels solid with no door gap issues.

Thanks
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
2 Pages V  1 2 >  
 Reply to this topicStart new topic
Replies(1 - 19)
mepstein
post Sep 24 2015, 09:02 PM
Post #2


914-6 GT in waiting
***************

Group: Members
Posts: 19,312
Joined: 19-September 09
From: Landenberg, PA/Wilmington, DE
Member No.: 10,825
Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
I'll bet the suspension console is failing. Classic issue for these cars. Bob just noticed his going on huey after a spirited run at the track. They fail from the inside out.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
ConeDodger
post Sep 24 2015, 09:08 PM
Post #3


Apex killer!
***************

Group: Members
Posts: 23,610
Joined: 31-December 04
From: Tahoe Area
Member No.: 3,380
Region Association: Northern California
QUOTE(mepstein @ Sep 24 2015, 11:02 PM) *

I'll bet the suspension console is failing. Classic issue for these cars. Bob just noticed his going on huey after a spirited run at the track. They fail from the inside out.


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) ^^^
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
JamesM
post Sep 24 2015, 10:31 PM
Post #4


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,915
Joined: 6-April 06
From: Kearns, UT
Member No.: 5,834
Region Association: Intermountain Region
check the bushings in the trailing arm first
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
cary
post Sep 24 2015, 11:12 PM
Post #5


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,900
Joined: 26-January 04
From: Sherwood Oregon
Member No.: 1,608
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
1. console is cracked
2. alignment settings came loose

I bet money on #1. BTDT. The kids went airborne over a parking lot curb at an autocross in Montana. Within a month the console was cracked.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
EdwardBlume
post Sep 24 2015, 11:40 PM
Post #6


914 Wizard
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 12,338
Joined: 2-January 03
From: SLO
Member No.: 81
Region Association: Central California
Do more of a closer inspection. hope its failed bushings but thats got more symptoms....
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
LowBridge
post Sep 25 2015, 06:22 AM
Post #7


Member
**

Group: Members
Posts: 370
Joined: 10-August 15
From: Lunenburg, MA
Member No.: 19,045
Region Association: North East States
QUOTE(JamesM @ Sep 25 2015, 12:31 AM) *

check the bushings in the trailing arm first

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) jack the car up and you should notice that you can flex the wheel in and out. look at the pickup points and if they look fine then it's the bushings. you can get large amounts of movement from both problems and it's easy to tell which one it is.

hopefully it's just bushing as that is the cheap fix.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Chris Pincetich
post Sep 25 2015, 08:29 AM
Post #8


B-)
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,082
Joined: 3-October 05
From: Point Reyes Station, CA
Member No.: 4,907
Region Association: Northern California
Pre-AX tech inspectors in my PCA zone typically grab a wheel and shake it very hard, rocking in and out. Not on all cars; they like to pick on old 914s since they break down and/or spew oil more often!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif) This motion can reveal bad bearings or suspension bushings, because you will feel it. I would not try that with the car up on a jack or even jack stands. If you already know about lots of rust back there.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Good luck (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 25 2015, 09:04 AM
Post #9


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(JamesM @ Sep 24 2015, 09:31 PM) *

check the bushings in the trailing arm first


Well, the votes are in and I will check it out. Matched my suspicions but it is always best to ask the world about these things. I will get back with a verdict in a day or two. It seems I am lucky if I can go two steps forward and one step back. I would say rust too, except I know the car pretty well and have fixed these issues on the conversion tub. I kinda think that the longs and console are better than that. But - rust not only is insomniac, but camouflaged at every turn. So, I know better than to guess. I wish the lift wasn't a half hour drive...

Thanks one and all. Great support!
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
mepstein
post Sep 25 2015, 11:20 AM
Post #10


914-6 GT in waiting
***************

Group: Members
Posts: 19,312
Joined: 19-September 09
From: Landenberg, PA/Wilmington, DE
Member No.: 10,825
Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
Jacking up the car and removing the wheel will let you check out the suspension console.

If it's too rusty to use a jack then it shouldn't be driven.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
JRust
post Sep 25 2015, 11:42 AM
Post #11


914 Guru
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 6,307
Joined: 10-January 03
From: Corvallis Oregon
Member No.: 129
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
QUOTE(mepstein @ Sep 25 2015, 10:20 AM) *

Jacking up the car and removing the wheel will let you check out the suspension console.

If it's too rusty to use a jack then it shouldn't be driven.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) I would bet suspension ear is cracked & more than half way & you'll be thanking your lucky starts. It's much nicer to catch it before it tears off completely
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 25 2015, 03:44 PM
Post #12


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(JRust @ Sep 25 2015, 10:42 AM) *

QUOTE(mepstein @ Sep 25 2015, 10:20 AM) *

Jacking up the car and removing the wheel will let you check out the suspension console.

If it's too rusty to use a jack then it shouldn't be driven.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) I would bet suspension ear is cracked & more than half way & you'll be thanking your lucky starts. It's much nicer to catch it before it tears off completely

Thanks. I peaked underneath before I left for work. I had to drive my TR6 instead. It looks like either the inner bushing is gone, or the inner suspension ear has an ovalled hole. Or both. Wouldn't rule out cracks though. No major displacement of pieces.

It is no way near too rusted to jack up. The jack points even work, but I rarely use them. If I do, instead of buying one of those round plates for the floor jack I use a tow hitch ball with the shank ground square to fit in the hole. No matter what angle I reach the jack point is steady.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Cairo94507
post Sep 25 2015, 04:08 PM
Post #13


Michael
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 9,820
Joined: 1-November 08
From: Auburn, CA
Member No.: 9,712
Region Association: Northern California
On my 2nd Six I got very lucky. When the engine was out to straighten out some issues from the 3.0 CIS install, I was cleaning the engine compartment and underneath since it was so accessible and found the passenger side rear suspension mounting point cracked more than 1/2 way.

It was a lucky break as we had the engine already out so we addressed that by replacing that ear and also replaced the batter box at the same time as it had some rust holes. Back then it was only about $400 if I remember correctly. That even included respraying the engine compartment so it looked like new. The body shop was right behind my mechanic so we just rolled the car over to their shop.

Once I saw the damage I was shaken up as I drive that card hard regularly through a 10 mile canyon road and can only imagine the crash if that ear had completely failed.
User is online!Profile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
EdwardBlume
post Sep 25 2015, 05:33 PM
Post #14


914 Wizard
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 12,338
Joined: 2-January 03
From: SLO
Member No.: 81
Region Association: Central California
My inner ear was cracked after 86K miles and 100% street use. Found it after an engine pull and prior to repaint.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 26 2015, 04:40 PM
Post #15


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(cary @ Sep 24 2015, 10:12 PM) *

1. console is cracked
2. alignment settings came loose

I bet money on #1. BTDT. The kids went airborne over a parking lot curb at an autocross in Montana. Within a month the console was cracked.

OK, how much did you lose, or I winned? It is was the inner bushing, all squirmy and gone. Now I need new CV gaskets and to figure out what bushing to use!

So to heal my heroic old car, what is considered the best solution. Needle bearings with automated greasing? Rubber inserts? Rubber stoppers with holes drilled? Or some sort of polymer like either Delrin or urethane?

What do you guys like? My wife doesn't like riding in it anyway if that helps people make up their minds. Grippier tires and new bilsteins didn't delay this.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 26 2015, 04:43 PM
Post #16


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(Cairo94507 @ Sep 25 2015, 03:08 PM) *

On my 2nd Six I got very lucky. When the engine was out to straighten out some issues from the 3.0 CIS install, I was cleaning the engine compartment and underneath since it was so accessible and found the passenger side rear suspension mounting point cracked more than 1/2 way.

It was a lucky break as we had the engine already out so we addressed that by replacing that ear and also replaced the batter box at the same time as it had some rust holes. Back then it was only about $400 if I remember correctly. That even included respraying the engine compartment so it looked like new. The body shop was right behind my mechanic so we just rolled the car over to their shop.

Once I saw the damage I was shaken up as I drive that card hard regularly through a 10 mile canyon road and can only imagine the crash if that ear had completely failed.

Yeah. That is one reason I decided to reinforce the ears on my six conversion. My son had the car up on jack stands when I got home today, probably expecting to weld. Silly for us to have three welders a thirty minute drive from our lift...
Thanks.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 26 2015, 04:50 PM
Post #17


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(mepstein @ Sep 25 2015, 10:20 AM) *

Jacking up the car and removing the wheel will let you check out the suspension console.

If it's too rusty to use a jack then it shouldn't be driven.

Thanks. It is really rusty in places, but the worm seems to have bypassed this spot at present. Someday I will pull the motor again to do what is right by that car, but right now it is the one that always delivers.

Fer instance, I started tearing apart the motor for my 911 cause of the dilivar studs. Made progress there but would prefer to drive the 911. The six conversion moved ahead in that I think I have all the fuel lines tight. I silver brazed stainless in bad conditions, and had to redo. So, this one little 914 was the one that behaved reliably.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
cary
post Sep 26 2015, 11:53 PM
Post #18


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,900
Joined: 26-January 04
From: Sherwood Oregon
Member No.: 1,608
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
QUOTE(cary @ Sep 24 2015, 10:12 PM) *

I'd bet money on #1.


I'll buy dinner when you make it out here one day.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
worn
post Sep 27 2015, 08:37 AM
Post #19


can't remember
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,162
Joined: 3-June 11
From: Madison, WI
Member No.: 13,152
Region Association: Upper MidWest
QUOTE(cary @ Sep 26 2015, 10:53 PM) *

QUOTE(cary @ Sep 24 2015, 10:12 PM) *

I'd bet money on #1.


I'll buy dinner when you make it out here one day.


As I recall we could probably get dinner where you work (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

What do you use for bushings, or what do you think I should use? There seems to be a range of choices.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
cary
post Sep 27 2015, 09:08 AM
Post #20


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,900
Joined: 26-January 04
From: Sherwood Oregon
Member No.: 1,608
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
Here's what I plan to use.

http://www.elephantracing.com/suspension/r...berbushings.htm

I had metal on metal on my tractors in Montana. LOL.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
« Next Oldest · 914World Garage · Next Newest »
 

2 Pages V  1 2 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 

Display Mode: Switch to: Standard · Linear+ · Switch to: Outline

Track this topic · Email this topic · Print this topic · Subscribe to this forum

- Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 6th June 2024 - 11:22 AM
Invision Power Board v9.1.4 © 2024  IPS, Inc.
All rights reserved 914World.com © since 2002
914World.com is the fastest growing online 914 community!
We have it all, classifieds, events, forums, vendors, parts, autocross, racing, technical articles, events calendar, newsletter, restoration, gallery, archives, history and more for your Porsche 914 ...