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> Why is twin/multiple disc clutch better??
Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 05:07 PM
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What am I missing here?

The friction material and contact surface area of the 1st disc and the flywheel remain the same (or are made smaller) when going to a twin or mutiple disc setup

Is the gain from a smaller diameter clutch/pressure plate and more clamping force??

I thought I had read that Porsche is considering twin disc clutches in some of the newer cars, something about being able to upshift while under power?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

Hayden or anyone else, care to enlighten us??
(or maybe just me since everyone else might "get-it" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) )
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TimT
post Jun 19 2003, 05:24 PM
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With twin discs you get double the contact area.

You can reduce the diameter of the rotating mass (clutch/pp/flywheel) and reduce the MOI (moment of inertia) and your engine with rev more freely, and some of the hp stored in the flywheel may be available to accelerate the car more quickly. You dont gain hp, but hp is free to accelerate the car instead of the rotating mass ( flywheel)

Some manufacturers (tilton, quartermaster,coleman) make up for the area lost by reducing the diameter of the rotating mass by doubling,or even quadrupling the number of driven discs.

Rev a car with a dual mass flywheel someday, takes forever to settle back to idle, then rev a car with a light flywheel/clutch package returns to idle quickly.

The car is more responsive with a light flywheel and clutch. I think Tilton songle plate clutches are good to almost 500 ft/lbs, but you cannot slip them at all..


Lighter is Faster
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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 05:37 PM
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Tim nailed it.

I just called and ordered the complete setup from WEVO earlier today for the silver tube car. It will get the new 3.2 short stroke engine and WEVO 915 before the end of summer.

Next phone call will be to Paul Guard to order all custom ratios and a main shaft that allows the use of any gears. The plan will be to go full straight cut gears this winter.

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kdfoust
post Jun 19 2003, 05:55 PM
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Well not to clarify but to add to the confusion...

I acutually thought that the Porsche twin clutch setup was because the tranny had two main shafts and an "extra" set of gears which allows preselection of a gear. To shift you just engage one clutch and disengage the other. But, I think having four pedals on the floor will be confusing... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

Have fun,
Kevin
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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 05:59 PM
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I still don't see how the surface area is increased at the flywheel and clutch mating surface???
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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:07 PM
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Mike.. the clutch has two (twin disc setup) steel friction area's. You get 2-3-4 disc setups. It will have multiple friction discs and multiple steel discs..

Have you never had a automatic tranny apart ?? The clutch packs in a automatic tranny are almost idetical to the Tilton setup.

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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:14 PM
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In between each steel plate is a friction plate.

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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 06:22 PM
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Now I get it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Tilton


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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:23 PM
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Here you go.. better shot of the parts.

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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:23 PM
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You can see the "steels" and the "frictions".

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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 06:24 PM
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I didn't know the "friction or "floater" plate was there to transmit the power......


Learn something new everyday (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mueba.gif)
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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 06:25 PM
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Thanks for not reaching thru your monitor and choking me !!!! LOL
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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:26 PM
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Do you have a new cover for the roller bearings ?? You changed your avatar and added another step or two.

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TimT
post Jun 19 2003, 06:27 PM
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You stall the car alot getting to learn how to drive with these clutches LOL (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mueba.gif)
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seanery
post Jun 19 2003, 06:28 PM
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y?
is it more like an on/off switch?
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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:33 PM
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It is basically a on/off switch. You have to spin the tires to get the car to move forward.

Here is what happens when you "bounce" the car on the clutch thru the pits. (I figured out why we broke the Ford 9 inch in the Winston Cup car)

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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 06:35 PM
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I "had" a rubber cover for the thrust bearings...looked great on Pro/E, came out like cr@p when made, they don't protect like I want them to.

The silicon will have to do until I get back from "vacation" in two weeks.........

Does Tilton make organic clutches for the multiple disc units??
(I saw the 8.5" units for Imports)

Would the Multi-disc clutches work better with an organic friction material??
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Mueller
post Jun 19 2003, 06:36 PM
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DAMN.....that takes a lot of force to break one of those nodular iron carriers!!!!
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Brad Roberts
post Jun 19 2003, 06:39 PM
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Try and drive 750hp that spins to 9k RPM thru the pits with a Tilton 7inch multi disc clutch. I couldnt figure out why/how we broke it. I just figured it out. Once you get the car rolling with the Tilton.. the car will tend to "bounce" or buck as it moves forward until you push in the clutch and match the speed of the engine with the slow movemnet forward of the car. Its hard to describe.. but you can tell which cars have the small clutches in the pits..

Combine this bucking with 3400 pounds of Winston Cup car and it play's hell on the 3rd member (pic above)

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TimT
post Jun 19 2003, 06:43 PM
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We have a 900+ hp turbo 935 clone in our group, the car only weighs 2100 but getting it rolling is a pain in the balls...... g-50 trans with 1st good to about 60 the car doesnt make power at all till on boost..

lots of clutch discs go into that car (RSR clutch not Tilton)

QUOTE
Its hard to describe.. but you can tell which cars have the small clutches in the pits..


yeap
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