Maybe expected a bit more...., Recent Fuel pump purchase Options

[914Next]

Not sure if I'm just ranting, venting or just verbalizing a bit of disappointment. And let me say that I fully accept and I don't expect any guarantees (unless a seller offers one) in buying a part on the World but I'm just a bit disappointed after my recent (september) purchase of what was supposedly a very nice (possibly NOS?) 3 port fuel pump for my 914. I bought it as a spare and then found reason to actually need it a couple of weeks ago. When my service guy installed it, it leaked terribly so I had to quickly buy a remanufactured one and overnight to my service garage.

Won't disclose the seller but he is one of the most highly respected contributors on the World. We negotiated a bit and I agreed to pay $600 for this part....premium money.

I don't expect a refund but I sent a note to him telling him that the part was unusable.

What did I expect? I guess maybe a "damn, really sorry about that" or some other simple acknowledgement that spending $600 in good faith and ending up needing to spend another $500 for a re-manufactured pump is a real bummer.

But, no response. I guess in the end I am just venting and feeling like as a seller I would have handled it differently. But....I move on.

[willieg]

An excellent conversation starter. If the seller is one of the big 914World sellers, I hope we see a response. Always more than 5 sides to a story.

[Geezer914]

Where are you buying fuel pumps for $500-600 dollars? Are they gold plated? A Delphi pump from Rock auto goes for $126.95!

[TheCabinetmaker]

Where are you buying fuel pumps for $500-600 dollars? Are they gold plated? A Delphi pump from Rock auto goes for $126.95!

But is that a 3 port pump?

[914Next]

Where are you buying fuel pumps for $500-600 dollars? Are they gold plated? A Delphi pump from Rock auto goes for $126.95!

Yeah I'm one of those originality nuts and wanted to replace the pump with the original 3 port unit for my survivor. And yes, always multiple sides to a story although I think even he would have to agree with my summary as there are documented message exchanges on the transaction. I'm not looking to get into a public discussion with him here. I bought the part....at my risk. I just would have handled this differently as a seller.

[dr914@autoatlanta.com]

I used to say years ago that "914 fuel pumps never go bad!" but then the cars got old and they all failed, either by leaking or locking up from the cars sitting. Hence we do not ever sell nor test a used pump, we automatically send them out to the Bosch rebuilder

I am sure that the seller had very good intentions, but probably did think that MAYBE a 50 year old electric fuel pump MAY have problems, if not at the time of the sale very soon after.

The three port standard on 70-74 914s was replaced by the two port front mounted pumps for the 75 76 year. It is very very very inexpensive and CAN be used as a substitute for the very expensive three port variety if you are not an originality freak like I am (lol)

Not sure if I'm just ranting, venting or just verbalizing a bit of disappointment. And let me say that I fully accept and I don't expect any guarantees (unless a seller offers one) in buying a part on the World but I'm just a bit disappointed after my recent (september) purchase of what was supposedly a very nice (possibly NOS?) 3 port fuel pump for my 914. I bought it as a spare and then found reason to actually need it a couple of weeks ago. When my service guy installed it, it leaked terribly so I had to quickly buy a remanufactured one and overnight to my service garage.

Won't disclose the seller but he is one of the most highly respected contributors on the World. We negotiated a bit and I agreed to pay $600 for this part....premium money.

I don't expect a refund but I sent a note to him telling him that the part was unusable.

What did I expect? I guess maybe a "damn, really sorry about that" or some other simple acknowledgement that spending $600 in good faith and ending up needing to spend another $500 for a re-manufactured pump is a real bummer.

But, no response. I guess in the end I am just venting and feeling like as a seller I would have handled it differently. But....I move on.

[914Next]

I used to say years ago that "914 fuel pumps never go bad!" but then the cars got old and they all failed, either by leaking or locking up from the cars sitting. Hence we do not ever sell nor test a used pump, we automatically send them out to the Bosch rebuilder

I am sure that the seller had very good intentions, but probably did think that MAYBE a 50 year old electric fuel pump MAY have problems, if not at the time of the sale very soon after.

The three port standard on 70-74 914s was replaced by the two port front mounted pumps for the 75 76 year. It is very very very inexpensive and CAN be used as a substitute for the very expensive three port variety if you are not an originality freak like I am (lol)

Not sure if I'm just ranting, venting or just verbalizing a bit of disappointment. And let me say that I fully accept and I don't expect any guarantees (unless a seller offers one) in buying a part on the World but I'm just a bit disappointed after my recent (september) purchase of what was supposedly a very nice (possibly NOS?) 3 port fuel pump for my 914. I bought it as a spare and then found reason to actually need it a couple of weeks ago. When my service guy installed it, it leaked terribly so I had to quickly buy a remanufactured one and overnight to my service garage.

Won't disclose the seller but he is one of the most highly respected contributors on the World. We negotiated a bit and I agreed to pay $600 for this part....premium money.

I don't expect a refund but I sent a note to him telling him that the part was unusable.

What did I expect? I guess maybe a "damn, really sorry about that" or some other simple acknowledgement that spending $600 in good faith and ending up needing to spend another $500 for a re-manufactured pump is a real bummer.

But, no response. I guess in the end I am just venting and feeling like as a seller I would have handled it differently. But....I move on.

Thanks George....can't disagree with anything you say. And thanks for the quick turnaround on the replacement pump.

Steve

[Superhawk996]

I can see this one from both sides.

Seller may have been selling a NOS pump and they certainly are hens teeth and command a premium price. Especially for the /6 low pressure version of the 3 port pump.

But here’s the problem with anything NOS that contains rubber - especially seals. Rubber drys out and shrinks with age. 50 year old NOS seals are not a good thing.

Seller may have been in a bind. test it with fluid (gas or kerosene) and now no one will believe it’s NOS. Likewise - he gives up the price premium for NOS once it has been “used”.

Now here is my personal experience and buying on World. I bought one and tested it immediately. It worked fine and didn’t leak. I made the mistake of draining it and then having to store it for a year. Next time I used it, it began to leak. Weeping - not a ton be weeping at the electrical connector seal. Ugh!

I eventually ran it for several hours and the leak stopped. The seal must have gotten wet and swelled or possible moved a bit with thermal expansion and resealed.

When I put it away, this time I’m storing it with some kerosene sealed inside the housing hoping that helps prevent the seals from drying and shrinking. No idea if this will help or hurt. We’ll see.

One thing is for sure, it can no longer be sold as NOS or guaranteed to not leak.

I can certainly see why you are disappointed too! We all have high hopes and expectations for rare and pricy NOS parts.

So it sort of is a buyer beware, have to recognize what we are dealing with which is 50 year old parts and sometimes storage and shelf wear take their toll, even on NOS.

[914Next]

I can see this one from both sides.

Seller may have been selling a NOS pump and they certainly are hens teeth and command a premium price. Especially for the /6 low pressure version of the 3 port pump.

But here’s the problem with anything NOS that contains rubber - especially seals. Rubber drys out and shrinks with age. 50 year old NOS seals are not a good thing.

Seller may have been in a bind. test it with fluid (gas or kerosene) and now no one will believe it’s NOS. Likewise - he gives up the price premium for NOS once it has been “used”.

Now here is my personal experience and buying on World. I bought one and tested it immediately. It worked fine and didn’t leak. I made the mistake of draining it and then having to store it for a year. Next time I used it, it began to leak. Weeping - not a ton be weeping at the electrical connector seal. Ugh!

I eventually ran it for several hours and the leak stopped. The seal must have gotten wet and swelled or possible moved a bit with thermal expansion and resealed.

When I put it away, this time I’m storing it with some kerosene sealed inside the housing hoping that helps prevent the seals from drying and shrinking. No idea if this will help or hurt. We’ll see.

One thing is for sure, it can no longer be sold as NOS or guaranteed to not leak.

I can certainly see why you are disappointed too! We all have high hopes and expectations for rare and pricy NOS parts.

So it sort of is a buyer beware, have to recognize what we are dealing with which is 50 year old parts and sometimes storage and shelf wear take their toll, even on NOS.

All good comments. Thanks.

[brant]

Take the leaking pump and put it into a coffee can of gasoline for a day or two

The seal will soften and swell back to the size it should be
Problem solved

[914Sixer]

My fuel pump rebuilder says to drop whole pump in Kerosene for storage.

[Superhawk996]

My fuel pump rebuilder says to drop whole pump in Kerosene for storage.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) Thanks for that confirmation. Currently buried in storage but when I find it I think I’ll do exactly as you’ve suggested.

[windforfun]

Where are you buying fuel pumps for $500-600 dollars? Are they gold plated? A Delphi pump from Rock auto goes for $126.95!

I bought a new used one on eBay for $100 (Bosch 3 port). It works great. It always pays to shop around.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Chris914n6]

At this point it's nearly 50 year old rubber seals and they weren't made to tolerate ethanol, so none of them are worth a crap unless rebuilt with updated seals.

[ClayPerrine]

I am the seller.

The fuel pump was sold as NOS in good faith. In the ad, I feel that I described the pump accurately, with no misleading info. I never tried to run it, so I had absolutely no idea if it leaked or not. Testing it would have made it used and not NOS, so I didn't test it.

I have been buying, selling, and giving away old car parts my entire life. I am sorry that the pump leaked and wasn't what you expected. The fact that it is 5am on a Sunday morning and I am up on the computer writing this instead of sleeping shows that I am bothered by it.


I have to ask... what do you want from me?

[914Sixer]

I too am in the same spot selling NOS stuff. You HAVE to assume what you are selling is good. Everyone here buys and sells on good faith. Makes me wonder about the NOS fuel pump I have to sell.

[wonkipop]

if you are lucky you might be able to bring the pump back.
run fuel through it and fill it up. cap the ports with little plastic cap seals and put it on the shelf for a week or two.

if you can't get the bottom electrical plug to seal after that then the whole pump will need to be disassembled down and the seals replaced. it can be done and that particular pump probably has perfect internals with no wear on the brushes or commutator.

i would not throw it away. or think its useless.

i've fixed two of these pumps myself, right the way down to the bottom seal.
it can be done. if you are feeling adventurous. but its only worth doing with a pump you know has done low hours.

once restored, pumps should be stored filled with either white spirits or kerosine and with the ports capped with little plastic cap lids. then bagged and sealed up.

[nditiz1]

Same thing could have happened from a big distributor that had this part sitting on the shelf for years. With those and even ebay the buyer has the ability to return for a full refund.

The options I see here are, send back the unit and send a refund.

Keep it as a spare and ask for the seller to pay for the rebuild and then you'll have a rebuilt spare.

Hopefully both sides can work it out and feel good about the transaction.

A note on originality. Sometimes I fall into this trap as well, but I'll be damned if I will fall into a trap with using an out dated less efficient design as in the early FP setup. 3 ports why? Later style serves the same purpose and has less plumbing right? You can buy the new style FP almost 5 times over for just one 3 port. Even if the older pumps were in abundance and cheap I would probably still convert as again its less plumbing. "Well it's not concourse" Yep! You're right! AND I'll drive my non concourse, rusted, bondo covered S box more in one week than you drive your concourse gem in 5 years" - not directed at anyone in particular unless you are a snob. Ok I digress.

Back to being buddies (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[mate914]

If he bought the part "as is" end of story.
You were not forced into buying that one. You chose that one, thinking you were getting a good deal. It sucks and I get it, but going all Karen is not cool.

Matt (IMG:style_emoticons/default/flag.gif)

[StarBear]

My fuel pump rebuilder says to drop whole pump in Kerosene for storage.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) Thanks for that confirmation. Currently buried in storage but when I find it I think I’ll do exactly as you’ve suggested.

@Superhawk996
@914Sixer
I have a spare pump that I keep “in car”. Can soak it in kerosene but any suggestions as to what/how to keep “in car” for roadside breakdowns?
PS: it is rebuilt (somewhat recently, in Sept 2022, AFAIK), not NOS.