SOT: Buggy Racing, Stock 1600 class Options

[Brando]

Well, looks like I might get to do some racing this year afterall -- just not in the teener.

GF's dad wants to run his bug in the stock 1600 class of offroad racing, wants a wrench hand/driver and I'll probably be it!

Tonight I have to go over the rulebook. Soon we have to take the engine that's in it out, split the case and do a cam swap (per rulebook spec). We also have to trim down from the dual kadrons that are on there to a Pict 30 -- byebye torque/hp. Everyone in this class is limited, target HP for your engine should be 85-100 with stock everything. Like any good racing team we'll be looking for loopholes (read: not cheating) and probably blueprint the engine in an attempt to achieve the maximum power we can from the little Type 1. Our goal is 100hp.

So far we haven't found any limitation on what kind of gearbox we can use -- so quite possibly we'll go with an early 911 or 912 901 5-speed. This would allow us to gear 1-4 low enough and provide us with a 5th gear for highway cruising to events (we plan to make this street legal as well). We were planning on using a bus box and adapting to the 930 output flanges and complete axles.

Since these types of events and racing is new to me, anyone have some suggestions or ideas to help us get in the right direction?

thanks!

[Twystd1]

Can you legally run a spray bar on a trans in your class?

I have heard rumor about fellas seriously cheating the pict 30. Go over to STF and hit the search function. There are some good reads over there.

You may also want to talk Len at Hoffman machine. He knows more about these inductions issues and heads than most. 706.613.7454

If there isn't rules for compression. And if you can cheat the cam. Take a look at John Connely's squishy piston and cam setup. Guys are winning races with his stuff currently. i just don't know if this pertaines to your class.

Clayton

[Brando]

Clayton,

First off: Man, you're ugly. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wavey.gif)

Second, thank you much for the input. I will call Len. I still have his cards and brochures from that STF dinner last year. I think we could go spraybar on the trans, but implementing a pump would be a bitch.

For the engine we're limited to their designated cam and everything stock/original per the OE engine specs. Heads can't have any material cut away (unless welded up and machined to stock clearances), deck height I think can be cheated a bit by not running head gaskets, but valve sizes, ports, crank rods etc all have to be stock. What a challenge... If I could afford Raby's prices shit yeah, but we're gonna be a CSOB team.

[Aaron Cox]

Clayton,

First off: Man, you're ugly. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wavey.gif)

Second, thank you much for the input. I will call Len. I still have his cards and brochures from that STF dinner last year. I think we could go spraybar on the trans, but implementing a pump would be a bitch.

For the engine we're limited to their designated cam and everything stock/original per the OE engine specs. Heads can't have any material cut away (unless welded up and machined to stock clearances), deck height I think can be cheated a bit by not running head gaskets, but valve sizes, ports, crank rods etc all have to be stock. What a challenge... If I could afford Raby's prices shit yeah, but we're gonna be a CSOB team.

that was john edwards from costa mesa machine.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

[cnavarro]

I have Nickies too made up for the 1600 class. I have a few sets and i'd like to thin them out if you're interested. Would make a sweet combo with John's pistons if their legal. I know the cylinders are tho.

[Jake Raby]

I have a combo that makes 105 HP for that class.. But at 12.7:1 it's not streetable..

It was the MAORA class champion for 3 seasons consecutively (1999-2002) and the engine was never rebuilt in those 3 seasons!

I'd say the 901 box would be your last hoice, in these classes a 091 Bus box is the mac daddy for strength and gearing as well.

I made that power with a modified 30 Pict 1 carb and stock intake manifold. I still have the blueprints in my data base and most of it still memorized..

[SirAndy]

Our goal is 100hp.

100HP seems a bit high with all those limitations. that's double from stock ...

what do the rules say about weight-loss? less weight is almost as good as more HP ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/thumb3d.gif) Andy

[Twystd1]

Johns pistons ONLY work with his cams. They work like a Larry Widmer (Endyn) setup.

And I assume you need a kinda stock profiled cam. That means you probably can't use a squishy setup.

I just went over to STF for a couple of minutes and checked out some stuff. Brandon... Go spend a couple of hours over there. You will learn more in a day than all of us can teach you specific to your class and how to push the performance envelope for your class.

I B thinking since you can't flow any REAL big flow numbers because of the PICT 30 carb. You are gunna have to build this engine for grunt. Not HP. With gears to match.
m
I am also wondering why you might want to use the 901. I think I would talk the guys at RANCHO and see what they recommend first.

Then surf the net for pics and data as to what the class champions are using.

There are also CVs that have more angle than the 930 CVs. I know a guy that can make you bullet proof axles and CVs. The company is called "Insane Axles". It is one of Jimmy connections.

If your swing arm can travel with a greater degree of arc than the 930s are capable of... You gunna break sumpin.

If you could get Len to help you out as far as head and intake data, and add some of Charles's bad ass cylinders. Add a bit of coatings and cryo.
The appropriate ignition and headers for the combination. Some dyno time.

HHHHmmmmmmm........... Now that I think about this. I know absolutely that there is a trick for those carbs. It has to do with intake manifold and some judicious touching up of the carb base. I think ART THRAEN knows the tricks. You may want to touch base with him on your carb stuff.
You can find him here. ACE Automotive

I also kniow a local builder that builds for this class specificaly as well as other classes. I will go by in the next week or so and give him a chat ands see what I can learn from him.

Sounds like fun Brando.....

Do you guys have any sponsorship?

Clayton

[Twystd1]

Brando, we need to go to Jakes and download his brain. I figure we can put some ethanol in his coffee and get him so drunk he passes out. Then all we need is Vulcan mind meld and were set...... Instant type 1 knowledge.

The only problem I see... is finding a Vulcan... And wondering where he keeps all the guns...... Must think about this...

C

[alpha434]

Hehe.



EDIT: nevermind.

[LvSteveH]

A lot of good advice. It sounds more like you're talking about 5-1600 rather than a stock 1600 class. Most of the stock classes would require a swing axle trans and a very, very stockish car. Who are you thinking of racing with?

5-1600 is a great class, but there's nothing stock about it. You are talking about $30k for a competitive car. They are also a real off-road car with tubular rear arms, plenty of shock, etc. They are limited by their short wheelbase and width, and obviously capped out at around 100hp.

If you are talking about the truly stock bug catagories, they are a lot of fun, but the poor little guys take a heck of a beating. The cars don't fare too well either... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[Brando]

Thanks for the input guys. I always appreciate hearing from those who have more experience at anything than me (and that's probably everybody).

We're trying to decide on CORR SPORTSMAN LIGHT BUGGY class (truly stock components on everything except the buggy frame), or CORR SPORTSMAN SINGLE which means stock engine and suspension components, but allows you to move things for the suspension around a bit and go with a different trans, non-stock wheels and non-stock tire sizes.

I think we'll end up in Sportsman Light because of how non-stock the buggy is already. GF's dad has already put non-stock wheels on there, moved the suspension pickup points (stock hardware though) and wants to go with either a regeared bus box or a regeared 901.

We're still waiting, as we still have to pool some funds to get new internals for the case -- cam, lifters and some other goodies.