Type IV rebuild cost break down, literally, specifically... Options

[Gint]

I'd like to see where the $$$ are spent for a Type IV rebuild. Looking for a complete price break down listing of each of the individual parts (or group of parts, ie. pistons) , machining, labor (if necessary), etc...

Someone has to have done a complete listing of costs during their rebuild. But I've never seen one on this site.

[Jake Raby]

The type IV has many inherent design flaws, and if it weren't required by many racing associations it would have been put to pasture long ago.

I could not disagree more.

Perhaps this statement would have some merit if ONLY the 914 could use the engine, but thats not the case today and hasn't been.

Most all development of this engine has been done for OTHER applications, like the Type 1 conversion, 356 and 912 as well. Most everything we have developed has been FOR another application and just happens to be equally beneficial for the 914 (in most instances).

The Type 1 may have a huge aftermarket following, but that has also been it's down fall since everything bought for the TI is made in China, with at best bottom flor level quality when compared to the majority of TIV parts made in the USA or Germany. Who gives a damn if parts are available if most of them are pure junk and compromise the engine as soon as they are installed?

This year we have created 17 TI performance engines (Just finished a twin plug 1915 for Herbie Blash of FIA fame) on top of the 25 TIV engines we completed. We work with both foundations and there is no comparison between the two.

The amount of Type 4 DTMs we have sold this year is in the triple digits, that means over 100 TIV engines were converted for use in something other than a 914 this year using our cooling/ conversion system alone.

Most everything we offer for the 914 is made possible by the dozens of engines being converted weekly all around the world. Don't base the current state of type 4 usage on just the 914-

This year we have sold at least one engine or engine kit to be assembled on every Continent except Antarctica and the only states we didn't populate with a kit or turn key at least once was Montana, South Dakota and Lousiana. I have a possible sale in Louisiana pending)

(Don't think for a minute this engine isn't popular, I have the statistics to suggest otherwise, because I love numbers and keep records on everything for purposes most would never understand.)



This post has been edited by Jake Raby: Nov 22 2008, 01:24 PM

[Chris Hamilton]

The Type 1 may have a huge aftermarket following, but that has also been it's down fall since everything bought for the TI is made in China, with at best bottom flor level quality when compared to the majority of TIV parts made in the USA or Germany. Who gives a damn if parts are available if most of them are pure junk and compromise the engine as soon as they are installed?

That's bullshit, and you know it. Does anyone offer anything like the claudes buggies competition eliminator heads for the type IV?

I can go to any number of suppliers, like Gene Berg, Autocraft, and Pauter for type I performance parts, where I'm not seeing hardly that level of support for the type IV. There is also a great deal of parts available from claudes buggies for engine accessories, such as the $150 1 5/8" header system for my type 1 which would cost well over a grand for any type IV car.

[Jake Raby]

The Type 1 may have a huge aftermarket following, but that has also been it's down fall since everything bought for the TI is made in China, with at best bottom flor level quality when compared to the majority of TIV parts made in the USA or Germany. Who gives a damn if parts are available if most of them are pure junk and compromise the engine as soon as they are installed?

That's bullshit, and you know it. Does anyone offer anything like the claudes buggies competition eliminator heads for the type IV?

I can go to any number of suppliers, like Gene Berg, Autocraft, and Pauter for type I performance parts, where I'm not seeing hardly that level of support for the type IV. There is also a great deal of parts available from claudes buggies for engine accessories, such as the $150 1 5/8" header system for my type 1 which would cost well over a grand for any type IV car.

If I thought it was bullshit I would not have posted it- its a fact.

Autocraft has made TIV heads in the past, Pauter still does and so does Scat with their split port heads. In Europe Engine Plus also offers something similar. I also have a couple of options that flow the same or better than a set of CE heads at full prep and if the price comparison is made at equal levels of prep its almost the same.. The prices advertised in the mags are usually "base models" and much cheaper than full prep.

And remember the C/E head only has SIX cooling fins and none of those surround the exhaust port. What good does making power do if the engine becomes heat soaked and that power level can't be maintained? Please compare apples to apples, but thats impossible with the Ti Vs TIV battle. I know because I have been fighting that battle for 15 years.

The TI stuff is dirt cheap because of volume... and the fact that hardly any of it is made in the USA, or Germany. Its all coming from Brazil and Mexico, and of course China and it's distributed generally by companies with low quality standards and sold to others that generally are also expecting low quality. Today the majority of TIV parts are made in the USA or Europe and remain excellent quality.

For every 1 TIV thats on the road, there are 100 Type 1s and thats been the way it has been forever, since the engines were new.... That can't be changed.

Today a much more streamlined group of Enthusiast exist that want something that can't be bought in a catalog for a dirt cheap price, thats why the majority of those I deal with are north of 50 years of age and are tired of playing the games. They have been around long enough to know that quality and low price don't go together and they are ready to just drive their damn car without worrying about issues that could pop up on a cross country drive..

Jake, I give you a heads-up that calling people "smart asses" will get you a reaction, so you up the ante to "ugly" smart asses? Why do you want to provoke a fight?

Never heard that figure of sepeech before?? if someone is a smart ass, I don't give a damn what they look like- I treat them all the same.

At any rate, maybe a smart ass won't pop up- maybe my statement kept them at bay... they usually pop up by now!

Didn't mean to piss anybody off.