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> 914 1.7 Knocking Sound -- New Here, First Post, Horrible knocking coming from the motor
UberElectricEagle
post Sep 20 2009, 07:20 PM
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Greetings. I am new to the Porsche world and I purchased a 1972 914 1.7 about a month ago. It's a pretty nice car over all, but I think the motor, or part of the motor, might be toast.

When I purchased it, it badly needed a muffler. The knocking noise was harder to notice and sounded more like an exhaust leak over the horrible sound of the lack of a working muffler. The car seemed to run decent even with the poor exhaust and the price was good so I bought it. I just wanted a decent car over all that I could drive around for fun on sunny days before the winter gets here. It came with stainless heat exchangers I installed and I installed a really nice dual muffler from Dave at Triad.

When I fired it up with the new muffler, I really noticed the knocking when I drove it since the all the exhaust leaks were now sealed up and I wasn't wearing ear plugs. At idle it's not too bad, but once I get going, the knocking is very noticeable. It's odd too, because it's not real consistent under power in motion.
To me it sounds like the noise is coming from the #1 cylinder. I think the cylinder is providing no power, because when I take the wire off the cap, there is really no change in performance. (I put a video link of the horrible sound below.)

Any advice on where to go from here would be great. My gut feeling is telling me the motor is going to have to come out. If I'm going to do all that, I might as well put a 2.0 liter in or ????? I'd even settle for just a solid running motor with some minor upgrades to make it a little quicker. Any advice on what route to take on a good used motor would be great. I guess A motor that runs on 4 cylinders would be an upgrade. Thanks for your help, a mildly depressed Sam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5JhEd7SUH4...re=channel_page Attached Image
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VaccaRabite
post Sep 24 2009, 06:44 AM
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Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put money on it.

What kind of carbs are they? Weber IDF? Sorry if you posted that info, but I am getting dressed for work and don't have time to re-read the entire thread.

Find a good diagram for the type of carbs that you have, and blow out the #1 idle jets with compressed air after giving it a good squirt of carb cleaner. Clean the spark plug. Put everyhting back together and try it again.

If you are making 140# compression, I think you are in really good shape there. If you can borrow a leak tester, it is still a good thing to do.

I still think its easy/cheap stuff. POSITIVE WAVES! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When winter comes, consider pulling and rebuilding the carbs. If you have IDFs it will cost you about $70 (shipping included) for the kits and a few hours of your time.

Fresh rebuild is ~#150 compression. Over 130 is great compression. 130-100 is happy diving compression. 95-100 is start looking for rebuild parts compression. under 95 - pullit and start over time.

Also, you want to have compression in all 4 be ~the same.

AND, compression is just 1 part of the story. You really should do leak down too. You can have good compression, but still have crap leakdown. It sounds weird, but I had 115# compression @45% leak on my #1 cylinder. It lead to a full rebuild, as I discovered my case was collapsing at the cylinders and had to be fixed.

But, really. 140#, I think you are going to be just fine once you get fuel flowing.

Could you take and post a picture of the top end of your engine bay, so we can see your carb set up?
Zach
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UberElectricEagle
post Sep 24 2009, 04:35 PM
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QUOTE(Vacca Rabite @ Sep 24 2009, 05:44 AM) *

Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put money on it.

What kind of carbs are they? Weber IDF? Sorry if you posted that info, but I am getting dressed for work and don't have time to re-read the entire thread.

Find a good diagram for the type of carbs that you have, and blow out the #1 idle jets with compressed air after giving it a good squirt of carb cleaner. Clean the spark plug. Put everyhting back together and try it again.

If you are making 140# compression, I think you are in really good shape there. If you can borrow a leak tester, it is still a good thing to do.

I still think its easy/cheap stuff. POSITIVE WAVES! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

When winter comes, consider pulling and rebuilding the carbs. If you have IDFs it will cost you about $70 (shipping included) for the kits and a few hours of your time.

Fresh rebuild is ~#150 compression. Over 130 is great compression. 130-100 is happy diving compression. 95-100 is start looking for rebuild parts compression. under 95 - pullit and start over time.

Also, you want to have compression in all 4 be ~the same.

AND, compression is just 1 part of the story. You really should do leak down too. You can have good compression, but still have crap leakdown. It sounds weird, but I had 115# compression @45% leak on my #1 cylinder. It lead to a full rebuild, as I discovered my case was collapsing at the cylinders and had to be fixed.

But, really. 140#, I think you are going to be just fine once you get fuel flowing.

Could you take and post a picture of the top end of your engine bay, so we can see your carb set up?
Zach

I ran some spray carb cleaner down the carbs while it was running. No change in #1. 1/2 side carb increased idle when I sprayed carb cleaner in. 3/4 side bogged down when sprayed in. Does this mean anything special?

I might be crazy, but I swear for 10 to 20 seconds about a minute after I started all this cleaner spraying while it was running, It seemed that the noise went away. But it was right back and I'm not sure if I'm making it up or not.

I did have black oil spatter (like it was forced out with pressure) on the ground under the inner driver's side half of the motor. just left of center. This was odd because the oil in the motor that leaks out on the ground is pretty clean.

I don't really know where to go from here.

What's the correct type or the best kind of pressure tester to have? Mine is pretty old and just has a rubber nipple that I have to hold down in the spark plug hole. I don't even think it will reach #2 spark plug hole. Is there one that threads in like a spark plug and has some reach to it or an hose or extension? I'm ignorant in this area, or most areas I guess.
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Posts in this topic
UberElectricEagle   914 1.7 Knocking Sound -- New Here, First Post   Sep 20 2009, 07:20 PM
Vacca Rabite   Hey Sam, :wttc: !! Before you pull the mo...   Sep 20 2009, 07:35 PM
Pat Garvey   Hey Sam, :wttc: !! Before you pull the m...   Sep 20 2009, 07:44 PM
type47   BYW - to the owner - welcome to the mayhem! ...   Sep 21 2009, 11:57 AM
Rand   [quote name='Vacca Rabite' post='1216532' date='S...   Sep 21 2009, 12:53 PM
UberElectricEagle   Thanks for the encouragement. I don't know ...   Sep 21 2009, 02:16 PM
UberElectricEagle   Thanks for the welcome. I'd be happy with th...   Sep 21 2009, 02:04 PM
UberElectricEagle   Hey Sam, :wttc: !! Before you pull the mo...   Sep 21 2009, 01:58 PM
x6in6flames6x   :wttc: nice to see another PNW teener. and zach p...   Sep 20 2009, 07:42 PM
Rod   welcome. Do a valve train check first. Shame the...   Sep 21 2009, 03:43 AM
UberElectricEagle   welcome. Do a valve train check first. Shame th...   Sep 21 2009, 02:11 PM
underthetire   I agree with Zach. Maybe roll the pushrods to che...   Sep 21 2009, 12:48 PM
Cupomeat   If you like the wheels, keep them as they are the ...   Sep 21 2009, 02:16 PM
Cupomeat   Just one more thing of encouragement, that doesn...   Sep 21 2009, 03:10 PM
Vacca Rabite   Hah! I did not even see the youtube clip. An...   Sep 21 2009, 04:34 PM
JazonJJordan   :lol4: Haha! Zach's brother drives a tank...   Sep 22 2009, 11:25 PM
ME733   :popcorn: First things FIRST....BASIC THINGS FIRST...   Sep 22 2009, 09:07 AM
ME733   :popcorn: One ADDITIONAL THOUGHT...whenever you pu...   Sep 22 2009, 09:32 AM
r_towle   valve train tune up carbs adjusted   Sep 22 2009, 12:37 PM
Cupomeat   Any update?, Inquiring minds WANT to know!   Sep 22 2009, 02:49 PM
UberElectricEagle   Any update?, Inquiring minds WANT to know! I...   Sep 22 2009, 03:11 PM
UberElectricEagle   Any update?, Inquiring minds WANT to know! Che...   Sep 22 2009, 08:03 PM
Rand   Here's hoping for something as simple as a bad...   Sep 22 2009, 10:27 PM
Cupomeat   Wow, I have never seen such a fouled plug. Looks ...   Sep 23 2009, 12:09 PM
UberElectricEagle   Wow, I have never seen such a fouled plug. Looks...   Sep 23 2009, 06:55 PM
Cupomeat   Wow, I have never seen such a fouled plug. Look...   Sep 23 2009, 09:39 PM
UberElectricEagle   [quote name='UberElectricEagle' post='1217925' da...   Sep 23 2009, 11:32 PM
ME733   Well...140 psi does not indicate a blown piston, o...   Sep 24 2009, 12:46 AM
Rod   Interesting. 140 is fine ;) Take the carb off ...   Sep 24 2009, 02:31 AM
Vacca Rabite   Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put mo...   Sep 24 2009, 06:44 AM
UberElectricEagle   Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put mo...   Sep 24 2009, 02:47 PM
UberElectricEagle   Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put m...   Sep 24 2009, 04:35 PM
UberElectricEagle   Your idle jets are clogged for #1. I'd put m...   Sep 30 2009, 02:23 AM
r_towle   If you are getting fuel to number 2, you will get ...   Sep 24 2009, 03:25 PM
Chicken   no spark on # 1 or no open of exhaust valve, bad, ...   Sep 24 2009, 03:51 PM
UberElectricEagle   no spark on # 1 or no open of exhaust valve, bad,...   Sep 24 2009, 04:05 PM
Vacca Rabite   D'oh. You have exceeded my knowledge area. I...   Sep 24 2009, 07:29 PM
UberElectricEagle   D'oh. You have exceeded my knowledge area. ...   Sep 24 2009, 09:09 PM
Gint   Can anyone explain why the idle on the driver...   Sep 25 2009, 08:20 AM
Spoke   More likely that the driver's side carb or ca...   Sep 25 2009, 11:17 AM
type2man   You might have a dropped valve seat. That would ex...   Sep 24 2009, 08:39 PM
Rod   So you have spark, fuel and compression? Pleas...   Sep 25 2009, 07:42 AM
Vacca Rabite   If you are going lean on #2... Okay, lean is bad....   Sep 25 2009, 07:58 AM
Vacca Rabite   One more thing. the really black spots could be ca...   Sep 25 2009, 08:34 AM
UberElectricEagle   One more thing. the really black spots could be c...   Sep 25 2009, 10:46 AM
Geezer914   If one carb is feeding 2 cylinders, how can one cy...   Sep 25 2009, 11:58 AM
Vacca Rabite   If one carb is feeding 2 cylinders, how can one c...   Sep 25 2009, 01:22 PM
UberElectricEagle   If one carb is feeding 2 cylinders, how can one ...   Sep 25 2009, 02:51 PM
Rod   Or as two posts above it's a manifold or gaske...   Sep 25 2009, 02:31 PM
UberElectricEagle   Or as two posts above it's a manifold or gask...   Sep 25 2009, 02:43 PM
Rod   Yes but it would be making a very different noise....   Sep 25 2009, 02:50 PM
UberElectricEagle   Yes but it would be making a very different noise...   Sep 25 2009, 02:58 PM
Rod   [quote name='Rod' post='1218572' date='Sep 25 200...   Sep 25 2009, 03:05 PM
Rod   If the side with the problem is running lean, the...   Sep 25 2009, 02:54 PM
UberElectricEagle   If the side with the problem is running lean, th...   Sep 25 2009, 03:01 PM
Spoke   Try the carb cleaner spray on the outside of all t...   Sep 25 2009, 03:05 PM
UberElectricEagle   Try the carb cleaner spray on the outside of all ...   Sep 25 2009, 03:09 PM
stugray   Just a WAY shot in the dark..... have you checked ...   Sep 25 2009, 04:03 PM
UberElectricEagle   Just a WAY shot in the dark..... have you checked...   Sep 25 2009, 07:23 PM
Jax914   You pulled the rocker covers, but did you check th...   Sep 25 2009, 05:41 PM
UberElectricEagle   You pulled the rocker covers, but did you check t...   Sep 25 2009, 07:21 PM
UberElectricEagle   Probably will be the last progress report because ...   Sep 26 2009, 03:35 PM
Rod   Agreed, those compressions aren't great. tak...   Sep 30 2009, 05:54 AM
tat2dphreak   did you see this over at the pelican site? http:/...   Sep 30 2009, 10:35 AM
UberElectricEagle   did you see this over at the pelican site? http:...   Sep 30 2009, 06:00 PM
Vacca Rabite   Wow, what a difference in compression. NOW things...   Sep 30 2009, 09:41 PM
UberElectricEagle   Wow, what a difference in compression. NOW thing...   Sep 30 2009, 09:57 PM
Vacca Rabite   Wow, what a difference in compression. NOW thin...   Sep 30 2009, 10:20 PM


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