RHD 914, what's value of a rhd 914 Options

[9146-racer]

Hi, I haven't been on here for ages, sorry to have missed you all.
I have just been reading an article on the RHD Crayford cars and really would appreciate a value for one.
My car is a 1969 Crayford, in fact I understand it to be the first one ever.

I've owned it for about 30 years and now am considering parting with it, but what's it worth?

[wonkipop]

my 14 is american sourced from my stay in chicago back in 88-90.
L jet.
which i like.
had twin carbs on my squareback. ok when they were in tune, which was about 5% of the time. solex carbs too - awful. the linkage set up was not the greatest design vw ever came up with. never seen a euro 1.8, there would not be any here. hope they did a better job on the carb linkage than they did on the type 3.

the majority of 14s here are usa sourced, apart from that initial bunch of cars, less than 10, that arrived here in the early 70s. i remember driving the metallic green crayfords car back in the 90s. euro spec 2.0 with djet. it had a lot of get up and go.
i know i'm not supposed to say this, but my impression of it was that it was at least as fast off the line as a standard tune 6 in everyday traffic as i also had a brief drive of the same owners 6 when he first got hold of it. though after he finished with giving it a once over, it was a fair bit fast than a euro 2.0 4. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) what i remember most about the 6 was just how much louder it was in the cabin. i've read elsewhere the euro spec 2.0 4 was a fairly good match for the 2.0 L 6. a lot of down low torque in the 4.
don't rev out as nicely as a 6, or have the great fan scream sound. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

don't think the usa got renault clios.

i'm not disappointed by the XAS tyres/(tires). i have the soft bilsteins on. the car has sway bars front and rear. the 165s make it ride comfortably on the sometimes crappy roads around here without being too soft - they have a lot of compliance in the sidewalls. i went back to skinny tyres because i wanted to recover a different experience of driving. the clio gives me my modern fix. i'm not into originality for display/concourse reasons, don't do that scene, i'm interested in the driving experience of originality.

my third car is a big citroen xm. the "fleet" is all about variety.
i inherited an 08 audi A3 "sportwagen" and had it for a while. i hated the feel of driving it and gave it away it was so bad.

currently i am cutting the rust out of a 94 ford falcon ute. you think a 914 has a hell hole. the fords managed to recreate krakatoa right behind the passenger cab.
i'm looking forward to getting that ute on the road. aussie ranchero (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

[Tom_T]

my 14 is american sourced from my stay in chicago back in 88-90.
L jet.
which i like.
had twin carbs on my squareback. ok when they were in tune, which was about 5% of the time. solex carbs too - awful. the linkage set up was not the greatest design vw ever came up with. never seen a euro 1.8, there would not be any here. hope they did a better job on the carb linkage than they did on the type 3.

the majority of 14s here are usa sourced, apart from that initial bunch of cars, less than 10, that arrived here in the early 70s. i remember driving the metallic green crayfords car back in the 90s. euro spec 2.0 with djet. it had a lot of get up and go.
i know i'm not supposed to say this, but my impression of it was that it was at least as fast off the line as a standard tune 6 in everyday traffic as i also had a brief drive of the same owners 6 when he first got hold of it. though after he finished with giving it a once over, it was a fair bit fast than a euro 2.0 4. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) what i remember most about the 6 was just how much louder it was in the cabin. i've read elsewhere the euro spec 2.0 4 was a fairly good match for the 2.0 L 6. a lot of down low torque in the 4.
don't rev out as nicely as a 6, or have the great fan scream sound. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

don't think the usa got renault clios.

i'm not disappointed by the XAS tyres/(tires). i have the soft bilsteins on. the car has sway bars front and rear. the 165s make it ride comfortably on the sometimes crappy roads around here without being too soft - they have a lot of compliance in the sidewalls. i went back to skinny tyres because i wanted to recover a different experience of driving. the clio gives me my modern fix. i'm not into originality for display/concourse reasons, don't do that scene, i'm interested in the driving experience of originality.

my third car is a big citroen xm. the "fleet" is all about variety.
i inherited an 08 audi A3 "sportwagen" and had it for a while. i hated the feel of driving it and gave it away it was so bad.

currently i am cutting the rust out of a 94 ford falcon ute. you think a 914 has a hell hole. the fords managed to recreate krakatoa right behind the passenger cab.
i'm looking forward to getting that ute on the road. aussie ranchero (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

Wonki -

I gave you the USA specs so you could see the numbers for yours from Chicago.

Yes, both Djet & Ljet EFI were & are far less of a PITA than multi-carbs - geesh "Synchronizing Battles" & rejetting for altitude - what a royal pain! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

So I was happy to get my `73 2L with EFI & no worries! I'd looked at MGB/MGC, Fiat 124 Spyder & Coupe, Alpha, TR4, 4A & TR6, big Healy 3000, & Sprites/Sprigets, etc. as alternatives - but the 914 won out for me back in 1975!

You're speaking to the choir as another 73 2L H4 owner myself, about a well tuned 73-74 914-2.0 in either USA 95 HP or Euro Spec 100 HP out performing in traffic, standard road use, etc. - against a standard tuned 914-6 (which used the `69 911T 120 HP USA 2.0L H6 - detuned to 110 HP for the 914-6).

"The secret is in the sauce" as they used to say - the "sauce" being that the 2L H4 had more TQ & at lower RPM than the -6, and its HP was better at lower rpm - until the -6 got spun-up. The -6 would pull out ahead at the top end, but not in traffic nor city streets where it can't get wound up.

And there are tuning tricks that the old hands know to make the stock 73-74 914-2.0 perform as well as the 914-6 & 911T/L (in standard USA Spec) - including swapping in the Euro P&C/Heads for a tad more power - especially once they got 89 octane mid-grade unleaded here in the USA for the 8.0 CR Euro spec, so that you'd test okay for California Smog.

Fortunately I've been going to an Austrian born & trained, 914 specialist since 1969, from the SoCal Porsche Dealers late 1960s - early 70s, then his own shop since 1972 - who knows them extremely well, including all of the tricks. I started going to him in 1975 to PPI a couple dozen 914s 70-75.

I had also tried the 75 & 76 2Ls new at dealers, but was unimpressed, as you can tell from the chart above - especially with California smog equipment & Crapalytic converter dropping them from 88 HP to about 80-82 HP IIRC (dealers had a 1 page insert in the 914 brochure noting the lower HP & TQ for the Calif 75 & 76 2L).

Your Michelin XAS 165/80HR15 or their XWX 185/70VR15 are my top choices for reshodding my 914 when the resto/renno/repairs are done.

I've also looked at some classic look Blockley 165/80VR15 & 185/70VR15 with the SP57 & XWX style dogbone tread - but don't know if I can get them here in the States - & OZ may have them.

https://www.blockleytyre.com/product/165vr15

https://www.blockleytyre.com/product/185-70vr15


The above & below tire options are for others reading & needing 914 tires in OE styles & brands.

There are also Pirelli Cinturato Classic tires in the USA & UK (& probably OZ & NZ too) -

https://www.cinturato.net/pirelli-classic-tyres.html

USA - Lucas Tires Long Beach in SoCal:
https://www.lucasclassictires.com/Pirelli-Collection_c54.htm

UK - Longstone Tyres:
https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirelli-collezione.html

There are also several other tire dealers selling vintage tires from Michelin, Pirelli, etc. - so google the size &/or maker &/or type that you want, in order to find the best dealer, location & price for you all.



Wonki - your Citroen XM is nice too, with the Maserati motor! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
///////

[wonkipop]

my 14 is american sourced from my stay in chicago back in 88-90.
L jet.
which i like.
had twin carbs on my squareback. ok when they were in tune, which was about 5% of the time. solex carbs too - awful. the linkage set up was not the greatest design vw ever came up with. never seen a euro 1.8, there would not be any here. hope they did a better job on the carb linkage than they did on the type 3.

the majority of 14s here are usa sourced, apart from that initial bunch of cars, less than 10, that arrived here in the early 70s. i remember driving the metallic green crayfords car back in the 90s. euro spec 2.0 with djet. it had a lot of get up and go.
i know i'm not supposed to say this, but my impression of it was that it was at least as fast off the line as a standard tune 6 in everyday traffic as i also had a brief drive of the same owners 6 when he first got hold of it. though after he finished with giving it a once over, it was a fair bit fast than a euro 2.0 4. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) what i remember most about the 6 was just how much louder it was in the cabin. i've read elsewhere the euro spec 2.0 4 was a fairly good match for the 2.0 L 6. a lot of down low torque in the 4.
don't rev out as nicely as a 6, or have the great fan scream sound. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

don't think the usa got renault clios.

i'm not disappointed by the XAS tyres/(tires). i have the soft bilsteins on. the car has sway bars front and rear. the 165s make it ride comfortably on the sometimes crappy roads around here without being too soft - they have a lot of compliance in the sidewalls. i went back to skinny tyres because i wanted to recover a different experience of driving. the clio gives me my modern fix. i'm not into originality for display/concourse reasons, don't do that scene, i'm interested in the driving experience of originality.

my third car is a big citroen xm. the "fleet" is all about variety.
i inherited an 08 audi A3 "sportwagen" and had it for a while. i hated the feel of driving it and gave it away it was so bad.

currently i am cutting the rust out of a 94 ford falcon ute. you think a 914 has a hell hole. the fords managed to recreate krakatoa right behind the passenger cab.
i'm looking forward to getting that ute on the road. aussie ranchero (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

Wonki -

I gave you the USA specs so you could see the numbers for yours from Chicago.

Yes, both Djet & Ljet EFI were & are far less of a PITA than multi-carbs - geesh "Synchronizing Battles" & rejetting for altitude - what a royal pain! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

So I was happy to get my `73 2L with EFI & no worries! I'd looked at MGB/MGC, Fiat 124 Spyder & Coupe, Alpha, TR4, 4A & TR6, big Healy 3000, & Sprites/Sprigets, etc. as alternatives - but the 914 won out for me back in 1975!

You're speaking to the choir as another 73 2L H4 owner myself, about a well tuned 73-74 914-2.0 in either USA 95 HP or Euro Spec 100 HP out performing in traffic, standard road use, etc. - against a standard tuned 914-6 (which used the `69 911T 120 HP USA 2.0L H6 - detuned to 110 HP for the 914-6).

"The secret is in the sauce" as they used to say - the "sauce" being that the 2L H4 had more TQ & at lower RPM than the -6, and its HP was better at lower rpm - until the -6 got spun-up. The -6 would pull out ahead at the top end, but not in traffic nor city streets where it can't get wound up.

And there are tuning tricks that the old hands know to make the stock 73-74 914-2.0 perform as well as the 914-6 & 911T/L (in standard USA Spec) - including swapping in the Euro P&C/Heads for a tad more power - especially once they got 89 octane mid-grade unleaded here in the USA for the 8.0 CR Euro spec, so that you'd test okay for California Smog.

Fortunately I've been going to an Austrian born & trained, 914 specialist since 1969, from the SoCal Porsche Dealers late 1960s - early 70s, then his own shop since 1972 - who knows them extremely well, including all of the tricks. I started going to him in 1975 to PPI a couple dozen 914s 70-75.

I had also tried the 75 & 76 2Ls new at dealers, but was unimpressed, as you can tell from the chart above - especially with California smog equipment & Crapalytic converter dropping them from 88 HP to about 80-82 HP IIRC (dealers had a 1 page insert in the 914 brochure noting the lower HP & TQ for the Calif 75 & 76 2L).

Your Michelin XAS 165/80HR15 or their XWX 185/70VR15 are my top choices for reshodding my 914 when the resto/renno/repairs are done.

I've also looked at some classic look Blockley 165/80VR15 & 185/70VR15 with the SP57 & XWX style dogbone tread - but don't know if I can get them here in the States - & OZ may have them.

https://www.blockleytyre.com/product/165vr15

https://www.blockleytyre.com/product/185-70vr15


The above & below tire options are for others reading & needing 914 tires in OE styles & brands.

There are also Pirelli Cinturato Classic tires in the USA & UK (& probably OZ & NZ too) -

https://www.cinturato.net/pirelli-classic-tyres.html

USA - Lucas Tires Long Beach in SoCal:
https://www.lucasclassictires.com/Pirelli-Collection_c54.htm

UK - Longstone Tyres:
https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirelli-collezione.html

There are also several other tire dealers selling vintage tires from Michelin, Pirelli, etc. - so google the size &/or maker &/or type that you want, in order to find the best dealer, location & price for you all.



Wonki - your Citroen XM is nice too, with the Maserati motor! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
///////

no the xm does not have the maserati motor. only the older SMs from the 70s have that.
xms come later after citroen sold off maserati (or was that peugeot buying citroen and forcing them to discard maserati, a very tortured financial history).

early xms had what is called a PRV V6. an early version of that went in the deloreans!
volvos too. an odd firing PRV V6. citroen xms got the later even firing PRV V6. but the last of the line/late xms have a V6 that was shared with renault/puegeot and the renault clio V6. a 24 valve motor with 200 HP. what i have. it hauls ass as they say in the states, but does not look like it should. hydraulic suspension is of the later evolved kind - does not wallow about, corners dead flat. a scary car to work on and maintain, everyone steers clear of them. why i have it.

we get all the tyres in aus you mention above. the pirelli cinturatos seem to be what all the early 911 guys and alfa guys are buying up. i have heard they are pretty good and very sticky.

i have the NO branded XAS = tubeless. i did not think you could get them tubeless and had discounted them as an option, then about the time i went to get the car shod i was told they were a new offering so i took the plunge.

thanks for all the info above. pleased to know that my subjective opinion/unreliable memory driving a 2.0 4 was not necessarily out of whack.

[Tom_T]

i have the NO branded XAS = tubeless. i did not think you could get them tubeless and had discounted them as an option, then about the time i went to get the car shod i was told they were a new offering so i took the plunge.

thanks for all the info above. pleased to know that my subjective opinion/unreliable memory driving a 2.0 4 was not necessarily out of whack.

Thanx for the XM clarifications Wonki - it still sounds like a fun car.

I too was discounting the prior tube-type XAS, and was leaning to XWX, Blockley or Pirelli in that order for tubeless options (or Vredstein Sprint+).

From what I've been told by the Michelin Techs ate our Porsche Club events (pre-COVID) - you're correct that the earlier release of the XAS was the tube-type, then the Porsche N Spec came out as tubeless as required for that era Porsche tires.

I've been putting this OE sizes tire/tyre info in here for all member coming across it, & yesterday had a chance to update it into the O&H Forum's nailed "Wheels & Tires" nailed topic for those looking for various flavors of the OE 155SR15 (/80) for 1.7L & 1.8L 914/4s, 165HR15 (/80) for 914-6 & 914-2.0 (/4), or 185/70VR15 upgrade/factory option tires for all models/MYs.

After 20018-10 the availability of those OE tire sizes went very thin up until recently here in the States, but now they're coming back with all sorts of Budget to high end, performance & period correct tire choices, from what I found in researching for that up date - with a plethora of choices from $50-ish up to $300+ each.

For those looking for tires - see post #387 -
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...4857&st=380

Cheers Mate! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
///////