AX racing on street tires - loud is good?, pushin the limits and lookin for more |
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AX racing on street tires - loud is good?, pushin the limits and lookin for more |
Chris Pincetich |
Jul 18 2007, 06:44 PM
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#1
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B-) Group: Members Posts: 2,082 Joined: 3-October 05 From: Point Reyes Station, CA Member No.: 4,907 Region Association: Northern California |
I gotta stick to the tires I have now for 2007 due to AX class points and my budget.
I have 195/50 Dunlop 2000 Sport (I think) on 15x6" alloy rims. I got these because I was worried about fitment of 205s and never guessed I'd becaome an AX addict. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif) These tires seem to get more slippery as they warm up. As a result, I end up fish taling a bit. I tend to 180 slide about once a day, and can keep the back end from swingin around 90% of the time. Some times I mash the brakes, turn in fast, get about 10-20 deg fish tail, and hook up heading right for the next apex. YEAH it feels great and I hear the tires squeel. Other times I have a smoother approach and lots of squeel all through the arc of the turn. Sometimes I'm smooth and don't hear the sqeel. With so many turns adding up to my time, it is tough to tell which approach is fastest. I don't feel like I kill any speed on my little slip slide and hook up and when I watch others it looks fast as long as the tail isn't swingin out wide. My AX book (with the 911 on the cover) talks about the friction circle, and I think I need more info here. It says that pushing the limit up to the grip release is fastest, and then hints that sometimes going a little outside the cirlce is fastest. Losts of allusions to pushing the limits but no "one size fits all" explanation. Is this loud sqeelin approach as good and fast as it feels, or am I just enjoying the ride and going slower than I could? At what point in the friction circle are my street tires making the squeel noise? Is the soft compounds in DOT-R and slicks too soft to resonante and make the squeel noise? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I started dropping PSI this year - from 32-34 down to 24-26 PSI at the last race. Still well on the tread, not rollin over to the tread wear line. Is this extra side wall flex good? I think so!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif) I know most of youz guyz had humble beginnins like me and my rustored 1.7 914 so enlighten me on the finer points of maxing out my street tires! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) |
Chris Pincetich |
Jul 19 2007, 11:02 AM
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#2
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B-) Group: Members Posts: 2,082 Joined: 3-October 05 From: Point Reyes Station, CA Member No.: 4,907 Region Association: Northern California |
I usually measure the pressure at the start of the day - BUT the one day I dropped from 30s down into the 20s to try it out it was in the middle of my runs so the pressures were "hot".
I'll definitely go back to 30s on the PSI with all this input (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Where and when does a little fish tail/oversteer make for the fastest line on an AX course? Early apex to a short straight? At entry to a hairpin 180? I'm hoping to not give up my fun little slides, just use them at the right time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif) |
jhadler |
Jul 19 2007, 02:18 PM
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#3
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Long term tinkerer... Group: Members Posts: 1,879 Joined: 7-April 03 From: Lyons, CO Member No.: 529 |
Where and when does a little fish tail/oversteer make for the fastest line on an AX course? Early apex to a short straight? At entry to a hairpin 180? You're just starting out. Right now, at the base of the learning curve, oversteer is NOT your friend. It will only be slower than driving a clean line. When you've got a more experience under your belt, you'll know where the best place to be loose is, and where it pays to be tidy. Just for reference, a slalom is the best place to have a loose car, it also the hardest place to control a loose car, and still turn good times. And when I say loose, I don't mean tail hanging out, tires smoking, I mean just a -little- loose. You can be loose, and blazingly fast, if you know how to handle it. And you can be loose, and slower than dirt because you're always having to back out of the gas in order to reel it in. Loose looks cool. And loose is fun. But only when everything is JUST right (driver -and- car), is loose actually fast. Keep the tail end behind you, and you'll find your times drop, and your skills will improve. -Josh2 |
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