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> Aerodynamic Aids - What a drag, What’s your drag?
chris914
post Nov 1 2007, 05:30 AM
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Have you made changes to your 914 body or are you thinking of it?

Here are a number of computer models comparing different body modifications to the 914 and the effects that they have on the cars aerodynamic drag.

http://www.cassidy-online.com/porsche914/aerodynamic_aids
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chris914
post Nov 4 2007, 02:41 PM
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I will most likely be sponsoring another student group project spring 2008.

FloWorks software is more complete but also takes more to setup.
http://www.solidworks.com/pages/products/c...osfloworks.html

VisualFoil software is a good basic package
http://www.hanleyinnovations.com/racecarpack.html

Most wind tunnels don’t offer high enough speeds to simulate real word speeds. It’s all about the Reynolds numbers. We have a water tunnel that gives you better Reynolds numbers but still not real world speeds. 100 mph in the tunnel does not equal 100 mph in the real word.

That is why we had the students doing as much testing as they could using our wind tunnel, water tunnel, dye visualization water tunnel, G-Tech meter, and yarn testing to show that the computer analysis would work for the given applications.

The last year’s group looked at as many 914 variations that they could find then came up with several designs of their own. Because there has always been so little information in the 914 community in regards to the overall aerodynamic characteristic of the 914 they have been mostly looking at its drag coefficients. Last years Student Presentation Poster shows what they found. http://www.cassidy-online.com/porsche914/a...aids/index.html

I’m going to have next years group look at the downward effects of the aerodynamics of the 914 and how it performs on larger tracks. Who out there would be willing to have the students come take measurements of their large rear wings in SoCal? I know there is a few out there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The goal would to be 1st to model what is out there then try to design improvement that would be more efficient. I want them to look at how much downward force do you need to keep the 914 stable at high speeds in a straight and how much force do you need to keep the 914 stuck to the ground when cornering.
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grantsfo
post Nov 4 2007, 08:47 PM
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QUOTE(chris914 @ Nov 4 2007, 12:41 PM) *

I will most likely be sponsoring another student group project spring 2008.

FloWorks software is more complete but also takes more to setup.
http://www.solidworks.com/pages/products/c...osfloworks.html

VisualFoil software is a good basic package
http://www.hanleyinnovations.com/racecarpack.html

Most wind tunnels don’t offer high enough speeds to simulate real word speeds. It’s all about the Reynolds numbers. We have a water tunnel that gives you better Reynolds numbers but still not real world speeds. 100 mph in the tunnel does not equal 100 mph in the real word.

That is why we had the students doing as much testing as they could using our wind tunnel, water tunnel, dye visualization water tunnel, G-Tech meter, and yarn testing to show that the computer analysis would work for the given applications.

The last year’s group looked at as many 914 variations that they could find then came up with several designs of their own. Because there has always been so little information in the 914 community in regards to the overall aerodynamic characteristic of the 914 they have been mostly looking at its drag coefficients. Last years Student Presentation Poster shows what they found. http://www.cassidy-online.com/porsche914/a...aids/index.html

I’m going to have next years group look at the downward effects of the aerodynamics of the 914 and how it performs on larger tracks. Who out there would be willing to have the students come take measurements of their large rear wings in SoCal? I know there is a few out there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The goal would to be 1st to model what is out there then try to design improvement that would be more efficient. I want them to look at how much downward force do you need to keep the 914 stable at high speeds in a straight and how much force do you need to keep the 914 stuck to the ground when cornering.


Curious did you model any down force calculations for rear mounted wings at 50 MPH?

Also interested if you would want to give somone challenge of seeing what works best for a 914 without a winshield (ginter screen). I'm thinking of mounting a wing on top of my targar bar as I'm not confident a reat mounted wing will be as beneficial as a wing mounted mid ship.
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chris914
post Nov 4 2007, 11:16 PM
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QUOTE(grantsfo @ Nov 4 2007, 06:47 PM) *

Curious did you model any down force calculations for rear mounted wings at 50 MPH?

Also interested if you would want to give somone challenge of seeing what works best for a 914 without a winshield (ginter screen). I'm thinking of mounting a wing on top of my targar bar as I'm not confident a reat mounted wing will be as beneficial as a wing mounted mid ship.


Not at 50mph. But they did a few big wings.

I added a new bigger picture showing all of the different comparisons.

http://www.cassidy-online.com/porsche914/a...aids/index.html
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Posts in this topic
chris914   Aerodynamic Aids - What a drag   Nov 1 2007, 05:30 AM
TeenerTim   Interesting but the 2006 report doesn't addres...   Nov 1 2007, 08:31 AM
BahnBrenner914   :agree:   Nov 1 2007, 09:48 AM
jd74914   They 2007 report says that they tested CFD models ...   Nov 1 2007, 09:53 AM
sean_v8_914   the flow path is the relevant info.   Nov 1 2007, 09:59 AM
chris914   Over the past three years, three different student...   Nov 1 2007, 01:46 PM
TeenerTim   Now if they could determine the optimum height, su...   Nov 1 2007, 02:27 PM
Joe Ricard   Please steer your students to test something like ...   Nov 1 2007, 02:52 PM
wbergtho   The only time aerodynamic aids will make an appre...   Nov 1 2007, 03:08 PM
chris914   The only time aerodynamic aids will make an appr...   Nov 1 2007, 03:49 PM
jhadler   The only time aerodynamic aids will make an appr...   Nov 1 2007, 05:38 PM
Joe Ricard   Our slowest courses are 50 MPH. I'm keeping ...   Nov 1 2007, 03:38 PM
BahnBrenner914   This has got me thinking of my ME/Aero senior desi...   Nov 1 2007, 09:25 PM
alpha434   Mr Hadler is definitely correct. It's simple ...   Nov 1 2007, 11:26 PM
Air_Cooled_Nut   So does anyone have EQUATIONS that one could plug ...   Nov 2 2007, 11:21 AM
chris914   So does anyone have EQUATIONS that one could plug...   Nov 2 2007, 12:34 PM
Air_Cooled_Nut   ...http://www.amazon.com/Aerodynamics-Hp1267-...72...   Nov 3 2007, 02:52 PM
Mike914   I'd like to see some studies done on the airfl...   Nov 2 2007, 12:27 PM
jhadler   ...so should I remove, keep or reverse the little ...   Nov 2 2007, 12:37 PM
Mike914   ...so should I remove, keep or reverse the little...   Nov 5 2007, 02:39 PM
jhadler   Actually NO fan anymore, the motor just has alumi...   Nov 5 2007, 02:47 PM
Mike914   Uhm... First off, no fan equals no engine... Just ...   Nov 6 2007, 07:39 PM
alpha434   Frontal profile X Cd = Drag Efficiency Wind speed...   Nov 2 2007, 12:46 PM
kwales   Hunhhhhhh?????? Chris, according to you "th...   Nov 2 2007, 07:54 PM
URY914   I'm getting in on this thread a little late, b...   Nov 2 2007, 08:12 PM
Twystd1   Yea... Those wings "MUST" be just for t...   Nov 2 2007, 08:19 PM
URY914   There is a ratio for a wing's height to its de...   Nov 2 2007, 08:21 PM
alpha434   Ken. That statement was half-joke. But only half. ...   Nov 3 2007, 12:31 AM
Twystd1   Chris................... Be nice dammit. Da old ...   Nov 3 2007, 01:46 AM
d914   ok, jumping in, no areo background and for the neo...   Nov 3 2007, 07:57 AM
Joe Ricard   My wing was not cheap and it is NOT a "RICER...   Nov 3 2007, 08:56 AM
d914   didnt mean it as a shot, just alittle toward styli...   Nov 3 2007, 09:15 AM
sean_v8_914   my wing a ling your wing a ling, won't you pla...   Nov 3 2007, 11:03 AM
Air_Cooled_Nut   ... those HUGE wings do work at lower speeds but ...   Nov 3 2007, 02:47 PM
Mikey914   I agree, the wing must be suited for the applicati...   Nov 3 2007, 11:48 AM
chris914   The real solution would be to have a variable ca...   Nov 3 2007, 01:03 PM
alpha434   The real solution would be to have a variable c...   Nov 3 2007, 01:58 PM
Mugs914   Early race car wings were actuated by the brakes....   Nov 3 2007, 08:46 PM
Mugs914   Just a few somewhat random thoughts to add to the ...   Nov 3 2007, 12:28 PM
Mugs914   Another couplea thoughts: Airplane wings operate ...   Nov 3 2007, 01:21 PM
Headrage   You know what they say: The bigger the wing, the ...   Nov 3 2007, 08:56 PM
Mugs914   You know what they say: The bigger the wing, the...   Nov 3 2007, 09:24 PM
alpha434   Well... You're right about the "no downfo...   Nov 3 2007, 09:57 PM
grantsfo   I love amatuer aerodynamic discussions. Anyone ...   Nov 3 2007, 11:16 PM
jhadler   I love amatuer aerodynamic discussions. Anyone...   Nov 5 2007, 11:46 AM
BahnBrenner914   Alright, reading through all this stuff is really ...   Nov 4 2007, 12:30 PM
chris914   I will most likely be sponsoring another student g...   Nov 4 2007, 02:41 PM
grantsfo   I will most likely be sponsoring another student ...   Nov 4 2007, 08:47 PM
chris914   Curious did you model any down force calculations...   Nov 4 2007, 11:16 PM
jd74914   Chris, have you ever used Fluent? Some guys here a...   Nov 4 2007, 08:58 PM
chris914   Chris, have you ever used Fluent? Some guys here ...   Nov 4 2007, 11:20 PM
sean_v8_914   like Mugz said...random thoughts... from an amateu...   Nov 5 2007, 12:11 AM
sean_v8_914   Elise, Exige Enzo too.   Nov 5 2007, 12:12 AM
jd74914   One more question. It says in the 2007 piece that ...   Nov 5 2007, 12:58 AM
chris914   One more question. It says in the 2007 piece that...   Nov 5 2007, 04:27 AM
kwales   Hey! Thanks for the big shot of the different...   Nov 6 2007, 08:23 PM
kwales   OK boys, I'm priming the pump.... Here is 2 ...   Nov 6 2007, 08:40 PM


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