preserve your Rubber with this stuff... Options

[Tom_T]

Tom,
Like Pat Garvey I'm a stickler for originality, which has prevented me from driving the pants off my cars. Part of my enjoyment is preserving what I have. You can't believe the positive reinforcement I get when I bring out the 914 and people ask me how long have I've owned the car, or who painted it. When I answer I'm the original owner and took delivery in December of 1975 and "Porsche" painted the car, they simply can't believe it! Nevertheless, most people, either in or out of the car hobby have a hard time grasping the limited driving thing. I try to draw an analogy to owning a boat; you only use it in the summer and on a nice day.

I think you will have a hard time buying this product on your own from CA. You would have to set up an account etc. etc. I can send you a small container from my stash. If you like it I can order a gallon through my company. Just IM me with your shipping address (street address only- no P.O. Boxes). It's about $21.00 a gallon plus shipping to me, plus shipping to you.


Dave

Thanx for the offer Dave, let me check those MSDS later & ask my local printer if they can get it locally, or if it's banned by "The People's Republic of Kaulifornia". (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

As to cars, mileage, use & disuse - no negatives intended, just 2 different philosophies, neither being mutually exclusive - not do either have more or less commitment to originality. Not being a CW/show person in the past, I think what you're talking about is PCA's "Preservation Class" of C'd'E, vs. those of us who weren't a fortunate to get a 914 new, & had to drive our cars as a DD for some time - so we have to "Restore" - both account for a commitment to Originality.

I recall a 914 which George Hussey had to cut out of a basement where it had sat for 20 or more years, which had something like 20k mi on it as "time capsule", & others which are purchased but never driven or very little. IMHO - that's an interesting item for a museum or time capsule, but a waste of a true engineering marvelwhich was made to be driven - at least some.

IIRC - Pat used his 72 914 for many years as his DD, & has had it repainted at least once after she was relegated to "garage queen". Yours with 24k in 35 years is only an average of less than 700 mi per year - which is extraordinarily low unless she was stored for a number of years without any driving. I had a buddy with a new 1970 914-4 with similar rare use & low milage whose RED paint was still showroom fresh, as were the inside of the trunks & fuel tank area which you could eat off of!!!! ....different strokes for different folks.

When my 73 2L is repaired, restored & running again - with a commitment to originality with a few deviations for durability or where NLA (eg: SS HEs, repro bumper top pad, NLA seals, etc.), I intend to (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) it some few 1000 miles per year, but probably well under 5k/yr. For me - looking & polishing & showing my 914 baby is just not enough, without the joy of driving it a bit too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Plus I'm an odd one out in that I've only owned 6 cars in my 57 years life - driving since 15-1/2 in the mid-60's (not counting my parents' cars on which I learned)! If you compare the mileages & years of those cars listed below, you'll see that they too are still considered very low mileage cars, because we keep commuting to an almost non-existent minimum now & were always lower than avereage, even with annual 2-6k XC trips in all of them.

IMHO - that does NOT make myself &/or others whose choose to drive their 914s, 911s & other classic cars as less committed to originality! So keep an open mind to those of us "low life" who choose to driver our "fun-teens"!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[dcheek]

Tom,
Like Pat Garvey I'm a stickler for originality, which has prevented me from driving the pants off my cars. Part of my enjoyment is preserving what I have. You can't believe the positive reinforcement I get when I bring out the 914 and people ask me how long have I've owned the car, or who painted it. When I answer I'm the original owner and took delivery in December of 1975 and "Porsche" painted the car, they simply can't believe it! Nevertheless, most people, either in or out of the car hobby have a hard time grasping the limited driving thing. I try to draw an analogy to owning a boat; you only use it in the summer and on a nice day.

I think you will have a hard time buying this product on your own from CA. You would have to set up an account etc. etc. I can send you a small container from my stash. If you like it I can order a gallon through my company. Just IM me with your shipping address (street address only- no P.O. Boxes). It's about $21.00 a gallon plus shipping to me, plus shipping to you.


Dave

Thanx for the offer Dave, let me check those MSDS later & ask my local printer if they can get it locally, or if it's banned by "The People's Republic of Kaulifornia". (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

As to cars, mileage, use & disuse - no negatives intended, just 2 different philosophies, neither being mutually exclusive - not do either have more or less commitment to originality. Not being a CW/show person in the past, I think what you're talking about is PCA's "Preservation Class" of C'd'E, vs. those of us who weren't a fortunate to get a 914 new, & had to drive our cars as a DD for some time - so we have to "Restore" - both account for a commitment to Originality.

I recall a 914 which George Hussey had to cut out of a basement where it had sat for 20 or more years, which had something like 20k mi on it as "time capsule", & others which are purchased but never driven or very little. IMHO - that's an interesting item for a museum or time capsule, but a waste of a true engineering marvelwhich was made to be driven - at least some.

IIRC - Pat used his 72 914 for many years as his DD, & has had it repainted at least once after she was relegated to "garage queen". Yours with 24k in 35 years is only an average of less than 700 mi per year - which is extraordinarily low unless she was stored for a number of years without any driving. I had a buddy with a new 1970 914-4 with similar rare use & low milage whose RED paint was still showroom fresh, as were the inside of the trunks & fuel tank area which you could eat off of!!!! ....different strokes for different folks.

When my 73 2L is repaired, restored & running again - with a commitment to originality with a few deviations for durability or where NLA (eg: SS HEs, repro bumper top pad, NLA seals, etc.), I intend to (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) it some few 1000 miles per year, but probably well under 5k/yr. For me - looking & polishing & showing my 914 baby is just not enough, without the joy of driving it a bit too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Plus I'm an odd one out in that I've only owned 6 cars in my 57 years life - driving since 15-1/2 in the mid-60's (not counting my parents' cars on which I learned)! If you compare the mileages & years of those cars listed below, you'll see that they too are still considered very low mileage cars, because we keep commuting to an almost non-existent minimum now & were always lower than avereage, even with annual 2-6k XC trips in all of them.

IMHO - that does NOT make myself &/or others whose choose to drive their 914s, 911s & other classic cars as less committed to originality! So keep an open mind to those of us "low life" who choose to driver our "fun-teens"!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Tom
While I subscribe to the minimal driving/preservation group I am envious of those that have the compassion, fortitude and time to do a complete restoration. And if some custom parts or procedures get added in the process, hey you're the owner, so go for it. I never ever pass judgement on someone's car or how they present it. It's a free country. That being said I am more interested in the originality and history thread- that's why I post on it. Not a knock on the customizers- just not my cup of tea.

Getting back to the Rubber Rejuvenator- If you have any trouble obtaining some, just let me know. I would be happy to help. It really makes the rubber look "original", and you know how expensive NOS or repop pieces go for!

Let me know how you make out.

By the way, I put 10,000 miles on my car the first year I owned it and 14,000 miles since then. That's the result of joining PCA and getting the concours "bug." When you spend 3 months detailing a car, you tend to hesitate to rack up the miles or you will be spending another three months. I know, it's nuts, but it's fun to me.

Dave

[tod914]

Dave, do you think that would work well to clean the factory pvc undercoating in the wheel wells? I tried the Griots rubber cleaner product which worked better than other cleaners, but your's sounds like it might be better yet. If so, put me down for a gallon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) How bad are the fumes with this stuff? Do you need a respirator when using it?
Thanks,
Tod

[dcheek]

Dave, do you think that would work well to clean the factory pvc undercoating in the wheel wells? I tried the Griots rubber cleaner product which worked better than other cleaners, but your's sounds like it might be better yet. If so, put me down for a gallon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) How bad are the fumes with this stuff? Do you need a respirator when using it?
Thanks,
Tod

Tod,
It's not really going to cut something like that, otherwise it would disintegrate the rubber printing rollers that it was designed to rejuvenate. It just removes the oxidized rubber. I suggest posting the question on the PCA national website. Someone must have a better method for easier removal.

Dave

[tod914]

Dave, I was looking at cleaning the rubber on the wells, not removing it. Thanks.

[rhodyguy]

the glycerin is a fine product for helping to preserve the aging seals on our cars and makes installing new seals into chanels and tight spots a breeze. it's legal, relatively cheap, and available at your local Wallgreens in non-supository form, a bottle. the small bottle will last a long time.

k

[dcheek]

Dave, I was looking at cleaning the rubber on the wells, not removing it. Thanks.

Tod,
Are you talking about the seam seal?

Dave

[tod914]

Dave, the black undercoating that was applied to the car. It's on the entire undercarrige and on the wheel wells. Looks like the factory option product. I assume it is.

[ME733]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) ...well guys... it,s been several months since I found and started using "titanium."..silicone treatment...which I still recommend. amazingly MY PAINT has not fallen off,discolored, or attracted flys. The rubber is getting softer,and the tires still look great. maybe my technique of application ...which excludes dribbling it everywhere, and using it as a polishing agent for the paint has something to do with it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[dcheek]

Dave, the black undercoating that was applied to the car. It's on the entire undercarrige and on the wheel wells. Looks like the factory option product. I assume it is.

Tod,
You better post the question on what to use with the PCA website, or contact John Paterek. The rubber rejuvenator I'm talking about is more for soft rubber like door seals etc. Undercoating is pretty hard, especially after all these years.

Make sure you post what you come up with, for the rest of us.

Dave

[gasman]

For me, I use Mother's Back to Black. It makes my 76 big bumpers look brand new. I took my time rubbing it in, rubbed it off and a week later did it again.....

[Tom_T]

Tom
While I subscribe to the minimal driving/preservation group I am envious of those that have the compassion, fortitude and time to do a complete restoration. And if some custom parts or procedures get added in the process, hey you're the owner, so go for it. I never ever pass judgement on someone's car or how they present it. It's a free country. That being said I am more interested in the originality and history thread- that's why I post on it. Not a knock on the customizers- just not my cup of tea.

Getting back to the Rubber Rejuvenator- If you have any trouble obtaining some, just let me know. I would be happy to help. It really makes the rubber look "original", and you know how expensive NOS or repop pieces go for!

Let me know how you make out.

By the way, I put 10,000 miles on my car the first year I owned it and 14,000 miles since then. That's the result of joining PCA and getting the concours "bug." When you spend 3 months detailing a car, you tend to hesitate to rack up the miles or you will be spending another three months. I know, it's nuts, but it's fun to me.

Dave

Thanx Dave, I'll let you know on the rubber rejuvenator stuff if I dead-end out here.

BTW - I'm not a "customizer" & am putting my 73 2L back to the was it was when it left the factory, including "recreating" the set of Fuchs alloys, fog lights & center console/gauges which had been removed by the dealer &/or OO/PO before I got it in 12/75.

However, once I fix it up - I do plan to drive it more than a couple of hundred miles a year to CW shows, & may even show it a few times myself "before it gets too dirty", as I'm not one to spend 3 months a year detailing a car never to use it.

I've always liked the 914 because it gets more "smiles per mile" than most cars, esp. in sunny SoCal!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

That's all I was saying, that those who drive their 914s a bit more than you can also be equally committed to originality - they're not mutually exclusive. I also agree with the posting here in O&H, and do so mostly here myself.

[Tom_T]

Dave, the black undercoating that was applied to the car. It's on the entire undercarrige and on the wheel wells. Looks like the factory option product. I assume it is.

Tod, the factory undercoating was PVC & very rare, and MAY show on the COA - if PCNA's records are correct & if the persong doing the COA reads the codes correctly. You can check it visually & tactily to confirm, as well as MAYBE with your COA.

I thought mine may have been the factory undercoating, but when a PCNA Feild Tech Mgr (Rick Perkins) was out here this past week checking mine for the recalls & COA problems. He's an old timer around the 914s in the original days, plus had restored a 74 2L himself in the early 90's - so he knows them better than most with Porsche today.

We were able to confirm that mine was a dealer or other aftermarket undercoating by finding small areas of overspray of the coating where the factory wouldn't have done it that way. In my case it was traces on the 2 rubber air cooling redirection flaps just forward of the engine on the underbody.

So check around yours to look for the telltale signs of it being done after the car was assembled, to tell if it was factory or aftermarket/dealer, as well as if it's a wax based or rubberized material, as the PVC has/had a different "feel" to the material (mine is more rubbery as well).

However, for the strict/purist CWs out there - this is another area where I will undercoat it again for the peace of mind alone, after sinking all these resto $$$$$$s into rust repairs etc. on mine! ....cheap insurance IMHO, just like the stainless heat exchangers!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[dcheek]

For me, I use Mother's Back to Black. It makes my 76 big bumpers look brand new. I took my time rubbing it in, rubbed it off and a week later did it again.....

What is the consistency of Back to Black? Solid, liquid, spray?

Dave

[ME733]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Tom and others....I asked the question some time ago, about ..WHAT is the best UNDERCOATING that I could apply , hopefully out of rattle cans, and no one answered. I was hoping to detail up my original undercoating and have it blend to the extent possable. additionally I was hoping it would be somewhat pliant/ compliant and not dry hard as a brick......thanks for any insight, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[dcheek]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Tom and others....I asked the question some time ago, about ..WHAT is the best UNDERCOATING that I could apply , hopefully out of rattle cans, and no one answered. I was hoping to detail up my original undercoating and have it blend to the extent possable. additionally I was hoping it would be somewhat pliant/ compliant and not dry hard as a brick......thanks for any insight, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Try this product from Wurth:

https://shoponline.wurthusa.com/wurthusa/se...alog/group.jsp/

Dave

[dcheek]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Tom and others....I asked the question some time ago, about ..WHAT is the best UNDERCOATING that I could apply , hopefully out of rattle cans, and no one answered. I was hoping to detail up my original undercoating and have it blend to the extent possable. additionally I was hoping it would be somewhat pliant/ compliant and not dry hard as a brick......thanks for any insight, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Try this product from Wurth:

https://shoponline.wurthusa.com/wurthusa/se...alog/group.jsp/

Dave

[tod914]

Dave any product like back to black, you would NOT want to use on YOUR bumper covers. It's good for ones that are faded and oxidized. More of a dye type product I believe. The Griots tire dressing would work well for you. It's a very low gloss finish that is not sticky like other tire products. You can get it in their rubber cleaning kit. Their tire/rubber cleaner worked the best on my silver car's pvc factory undercoating. I'll use it again on the red car being you think that print product roller cleaner isn't suiteable. I tried Steve's 409 suggestion and several other products as well. Griots required a fraction of the effort and achieved the best results. Followed it up with the tire dressing and it looked brand new. No road grime stuck to it either. I'll do some before and after on the red car with it. Won't be till closer till Spring time though.

[Pat Garvey]

For the 1975 and '76 owners with the impact bumpers, I use a product called Turtlewax Blacktop. Looks like show polish, and is no longer made. This is the only product that I've found to work on those type bumpers. I recall someone in the past trying real black shoe polish with poor results. If anyone has a product currently available, I would appreciate a heads up, as my supply of Blacktop is almost gone.

As far a rubber treatment, I remove all the dirt and oxidation with a printing supply product called "Rubber Rejuvenator" from Prisco. We use it to clean and treat rubber printing press rollers. This is not available in any store- only from a printing supplier. I can provide the information for those that are interested. It's not cheap, and you have to buy a gallon but, I've used it on 50 year old rubber, and when you're done, it looks brand new. Then I treat with Griot's Garage Vinyl and Rubber treatment. While it's better than Armorall I'm still looking for the perfect dressing.

Dave

Dave,
I use the Turtle Wax stuff too. For years!

But, there must be something contemporary to replace it. Still have ONE unopened can. Hmmm, maybe I should put it up for auction.... NOT.

Aside from the jokes, lets remember that these bumper tops are not pure rubber. The rubber content is minimal, so preservatives need to match the content. It's not the cleaning that's important (to a degree), it's the preservation. Quite frankly, the Turtle Wax things is just a dressing, though it protects for a good period. The Griot product is pretty good, but only after you strip away the years of other products. Then, after Griot treatment, it looks smeared. In my case, probably because of years (many) use of the Turtle Wax product.

I'm still searching for the answer. Maybe it's new tops. A certain aftermarket supplier on this forum had manufactured "new" bumper tops & they may be the answer. I bought a front one (though I didn't need it), and it is far superior to the original piece. So, I bought a rear too. Nice thing about these bumper tops is that the internal metal is now stainless. Last you should need to buy & they are dead on!
Pat

[tod914]

Pat I had very good luck with their tire dressing product when using the applicator that came with it (foam pad). Requires a very minute amount to avoid the smears. If you use too much of the product, you'll defenitly get them.