My Rotary to suby swap! The saga begins page 6, Test fitting the suby- Intake flip issues? Options

[JRust]

I have a friend in Corvallis who is a rotary guru and seasoned autocrosser. Let me know if you want a connection to explore.

A local guy hell yeah I want his contact info! I will definately give him a call. Just what I need (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

[jsaum]

www.atkinsrotary.com

[JRust]

Is that a heater core bolted to the engine bar?

Sorry that pic with the fan is from the front trunk. It's the backside of the radiator. I just was reaching under with my camera for a picture. So you really can't tell where it is. I plan to get it in the air saturday & will get some better pics. Radiator has hard lines running under the car.

[Rand]

I have a friend in Corvallis who is a rotary guru and seasoned autocrosser. Let me know if you want a connection to explore.

A local guy hell yeah I want his contact info! I will definately give him a call. Just what I need (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

Cool. I emailed contact info. He may be able to help you get that thing rebuilt on a budget. If nothing else, I think you guys will enjoy talking.

[RJMII]

If nothing else, I think you guys will enjoy talking.

yeah, Jamie definitely enjoys talking!

[Mike Bellis]

Atkins is expensive! I know they do good work but Here is a link to the guy down here...

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/pts/2030722944.html

[JRust]

Jaime (old school) has a guy down there who will do it right for very reasonable. Still seeing what my new local guy may be up for. I've got a line on a used motor in LA pretty cheap that came out of a running car. I am going to probably pick it up. It is at the least a good core. If it checks out & works I may throw it in while I fix the other. Or I may just get it pulled apart & rebuilt with some port work. Be nice to get it road worthy while building a motor though (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[JRust]

I just bought a used 13b from a 88 rx-7 off ebay. Didn't have any pictures & the guy hadn't sold anything on ebay before. Hopefully I don't get totally hosed. Only into $335 so I won't get to screwed. I did use paypal so I should be okay. Just have no idea what will come with the motor (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) . It was cheap so I figured what the hell. Worst case I can at least pull it apart to get a feel for these motors (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) . Best case the motor is good & I can throw it in my car (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

[Lennies914]

Jamie, there's a guy down here that has a 13b on a engine stand. He wants $100 for it and that includes the stand. Another in San rafeal for $300 on CL and I think that one included a spare core motor. I know you don't want a stock pile of them but I also know how often you buy 914's (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[JRust]

Jamie, there's a guy down here that has a 13b on a engine stand. He wants $100 for it and that includes the stand. Another in San rafeal for $300 on CL and I think that one included a spare core motor. I know you don't want a stock pile of them but I also know how often you buy 914's (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)




(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) That was pretty damn funny. You know if they were close I might consider them. The one for $100 on a stand is tempting. I do need to make a trip to CA sometime in the near future. Have a 5-lug suspension waiting for me in the San Fran area. Just want to have multpile reasons for heading down to make it worthwhile. Still I have 2 13b motor's now. That should hold me over for a bit (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[Rotary'14]

I just bought a used 13b from a 88 rx-7 off ebay. Didn't have any pictures & the guy hadn't sold anything on ebay before. Hopefully I don't get totally hosed. Only into $335 so I won't get to screwed. I did use paypal so I should be okay. Just have no idea what will come with the motor (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) . It was cheap so I figured what the hell. Worst case I can at least pull it apart to get a feel for these motors (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) . Best case the motor is good & I can throw it in my car (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Jaime, I want your rotary experience to be a good one, I know a thing or 2 about these engines and I've stayed at a Holiday Inn before. As I told you in the PM I sent, you need an early 13b. You will have to change a bunch of stuff to get the 88 motor into your car. The intake will not bolt up, the engine mounts are in the wrong place, the counter weight on the flywheel will have to be changed, the rotor housings will not work with your streetport. You should be looking for an earlier 13b (pre 1984) to take advantage of all the stuff you have. You gotta be careful,, 13bs come in different flavors just like T4s.

-Robert

[JRust]

Jaime, I want your rotary experience to be a good one, I know a thing or 2 about these engines and I've stayed at a Holiday Inn before. As I told you in the PM I sent, you need an early 13b. You will have to change a bunch of stuff to get the 88 motor into your car. The intake will not bolt up, the engine mounts are in the wrong place, the counter weight on the flywheel will have to be changed, the rotor housings will not work with your streetport. You should be looking for an earlier 13b (pre 1984) to take advantage of all the stuff you have. You gotta be careful,, 13bs come in different flavors just like T4s.

-Robert

So what are you trying to say Robert? LOL! Damn I thought 88 was an early I thought the 13b went to 91 or so. It's all good I'll just get it to pull it apart. At least I can learn with it. Besides it being the wrong motor for me anyway (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) . I thought pre 84 was the 12a motors. Okay so not the first time I have been confused (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif) . So what specific year should I be looking for?? Is there anything in the 88 motor I might be able to use on the rebuild of mine?

[Rotary'14]

If you want to use your 88 motor in your car,,,
You will need an 86~88 automatic counterweight. If the motor you bought is from an automatic car, you might have that already. if not you can buy one (the kennedy flywheel attaches to the auto counterweight) You need to locate an 84~85 GSLSE front cover, the old style engines mounted to the car from the front cover, 86 and later they moved the engine mounts. The GSLSE front cover also has the correct oil metering distributor you need to match up with the 88 oil injection system. You can use your current front cover off your dead engine, but it's not the best, either way you need to swap the front cover. You also have to swap you oil pans, because it depends on which front cover you use. You can buy adaptor plates that would change the stud pattern of the intake to match your current intake set up. or just buy a new intake manifold (not cheap).

If you were to buy another engine,, you want a 1974~1983 13B 4port, with one of these engines, all the stuff you have sitting on your "dead" motor will swap over with minimal fuss.

-Robert

[JRust]

Now I am really lost. I thought the 13b was 2nd gen & started in 1986? All the rx-7s I see pre 86 have the 12a motor? Is there somewhere that has a breakdown of which motors came in which cars

[charliew]

Ahhhh a new learning curve experience. I was told the rotary was a really heavy motor for it's power potential.

[Rotary'14]

Now I am really lost. I thought the 13b was 2nd gen & started in 1986? All the rx-7s I see pre 86 have the 12a motor? Is there somewhere that has a breakdown of which motors came in which cars

copied from wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_Wankel_engine

1975–1980 Mazda Cosmo AP
1974–1977 Mazda Rotary Pickup
1975–1977 Mazda Roadpacer
1973–1978 Mazda RX-4
1975–1980 RX-5

-Robert

[Rotary'14]

Ahhhh a new learning curve experience. I was told the rotary was a really heavy motor for it's power potential.

Rotary engines are "dense" all the weight is centralized into a beer keg sized lump. I think the power to weight ratio is pretty damn good N/A (but the newer aluminum 4 bangers do have good ratios too) and when you turbo them, they make insane power and insane heat.

-Robert

[charliew]

I always like the rpms of the rotarys but remember the gas guzling of the little rotary pickups of the early ones.

So will 4000.00 build a complete 250 hp na rotary? or would that hp level need a turbo?

[Mike Bellis]

I always like the rpms of the rotarys but remember the gas guzling of the little rotary pickups of the early ones.

So will 4000.00 build a complete 250 hp na rotary? or would that hp level need a turbo?

For 4K you coule buy a JDM 20B turbo rotary. 285hp, 290 Ft Lbs. And run it stock with no mods. With minor tweaking, you can get 400hp and still be reliable. JDM stuff is different than US engines slightly.

A 250hp NA rotary is pretty radical to squeeze that much HP. You can get almost that much hp from a stock 13B turbo. With minor tweaking get to 250hp, no problem. But a 250hp NA wont be a great dd street motor. When you port them to get that much hp it does two major things. 1)impacts idle quality ans speed. 2) reduces low end torque and rasies HP in upper rpms. Street porting is all you want to do to a daily driven car.

I had a stock (almost) 13B in my VW Bus Chop Top. It was around 165hp and hauled ass. It sounded wicked! I will be doing this conversion to my 914 at some point. I need to get rid of my V8 first. I will be going turbo, just not sure which one. My goal is 300-350hp. Very doable and still reliable. If I go with a 20B, I'll leave it mostly stock.

[Rotary'14]

I always like the rpms of the rotarys but remember the gas guzling of the little rotary pickups of the early ones.

So will 4000.00 build a complete 250 hp na rotary? or would that hp level need a turbo?

Yes I believe you can build a 13B with 230~250 at the motor, with that budget. These engines are called Bridge Ports. They have a lumpy idle that sounds pretty cool to me. You can get away with running a Weber 51 IDA (modified 48) or a Holly 650 double pumper. IF you go FI, your drive-ability will be much better but peak HP won't change too much. Hell I read that Racing Beat has built a 300 hp N/A race engine called a Peripheral Port that they have dyno sheets for. You might not like how it idles because it's pretty high strung. Bridge ports and Peripheral ports don't like to be muffled. Street ports can tolerate some mufflers.

Racing Beat
http://www.racingbeat.com/FRrotary.htm

Mazdatrix (more affordable)
http://www.mazdatrix.com/

Atkins (I don't know too much about them)
http://www.atkinsrotary.com/

some rotary discussion about max N/A hp
http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=420260
http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=40...age=1&pp=15

cool sound from the bridge port, the sound may sound tinny, but the lope is there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCwJ0YheHMQ...feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WUSLunulHE

my apologies to the "purist" out there, but why are you reading this thread?

-Robert