Price check on isle 5, 1974 914 2.0 Options

[brant]

I do have plenty of experience and the differences are really not major
Shifting for example is easily updated

As a buyer to store a car in a museum or even as a buyer intending to drive a car, the original paint, condition, and originality add more to the value than model year

[brant]

The differences between a 1964 ford cobra and a 1974 ford cobra are significant

A 71 914 and a 74 914 are more about condition than differences

[zambezi]

AH... but it is not a 64 FORD cobra but a 64 AC cobra. Different parent companies.

[brant]

Ok...
I'll give you AC versus Ford...

but what about this:

[speeder]

I'm having a hard time finding an engine serial number, shouldn't it be at base of oil filler? There is nothing.

[dlkawashima]

I'm having a hard time finding an engine serial number, shouldn't it be at base of oil filler? There is nothing.

Yes, the serial number is just forward of the filler neck, toward the car's interior. There should be a vacuum hose that runs above it and has an attachment point just to the driver's side of the number.

[brant]

maybe its a 1.7? the number is in a different place for some

[dlkawashima]

I do have plenty of experience and the differences are really not major

Car & Driver, March 1973:

[brant]

Wow...
I wish I had three early chrome bumper corvettes in my possesion instead of 3 914's.... The same original price equals money in the bank!


I agree a 2.0 is better than a 1.7
but I would take a solid chassis 1,7 that has never been rusted or wrecked over any rusty 73

I can always add sway bars, shifters, or even a 2.0 motor to a 1.7 much easier than fixing rust...

the differences are minor in that they have the same body and same mechanicals

yes there are some special editions, GT's and -6's that are more rare
but of the 100K normal 914's built, there really is amazingly little difference over the years. Same thing with 911's... it all easily bolts in, up, backwards, etc....

as a buyer 1973-74 does nothing for me
and condition does everything


and I don't see the day in our life times where a 1973 normal 914 commands a premium over a 1972 just because of the year (versus equiptment and condition)

I know a 1972 911S commands a premium over a 1977 911, but ..... its not going to happen.

the 1972 911S is rare because it was an S model
neither 72 or 73 914's were really S models.
neither were limited, or had huge HP differences than the other
isn't the 73 914 2.0 factory rated for 9 extra hp over a 1972 1.7?
and what do you bet that the extra 100lbs of weight (including door braces) actually made it no faster.

I like to use and drive cars
and I still choose the one that is most tailored to my tastes and in the best condition... not year.

and if I was purchasing for a museum collection, it would be even more true that I would take a 10,000 original mileage, pristine, perfect condition 1971 with a 1.7 over a worn out 1974 model for the granite display floor

absolutely completely equal condition, miles, records and everything down to the dust settled on top... I'd take the 1973-74 over a 72 just to save myself the work of bolting things on/off. but thats not how it works and I don't see multiple thousands of value in one year over the other.

[dlkawashima]

isn't the 73 914 2.0 factory rated for 9 extra hp over a 1972 1.7?
and what do you bet that the extra 100lbs of weight (including door braces) actually made it no faster.

I'd bet a lot that the opposite was true, actually. R&T test results from back in the day show that the 1.7 was over 3 seconds slower to 60 mph than the 2-liter. And note that R&T reported the 2-liter was running poorly during the tests, so perhaps the difference was even greater (though I doubt R&T could have matched the times laid down by C&D ..... R&T's times were always slower).

Road & Track, April 1970 (914 1.7-liter):



Road & Track, February 1973 (914 2-liter):


Car & Driver, March 1973 (914 2-liter):

[brant]

the high compression 1.7 was I believe 92hp
the 2.0 from 1973 I believe was 100hp


maybe I'm off a couple.. but it wasn't much difference really
and certainly not the original $3K price difference

nice, your own scan's from the magazines show
1.7 at 85hp
2.0 at 91hp


hooray for 6hp!

hey I'm not debating that the 2.0 is a better motor
and the chassis of a 2.0 is a better chassis with sway bars


but they have the same chassis
the same brakes
the same nearly everything

and its easy to change a motor, change a motor mount, change a shifter.....
its not easy to fix a rusted out piece of crap, versus a good chassis

buy the best chassis
don't buy the best year

[dlkawashima]

They still reported horsepower in SAE gross in 1970. 1973 horsepower ratings are SAE net. Look at the 0-60 mph times ..... enough said.

Yes, you can change the engine, the gearbox, the seats, the dash ..... everything really to match the '73 2-liter. But it just reinforces the fact that the '73 2-liter was a significant improvement over the early cars, which was the point the OP was trying to make.

[brant]

I believe the comment was that there were "MASSIVE IMPROVEMENTS"

I agree there were some improvements
but as I stated... no reason to think that a 1973 car is worth significantly more $ than anyother year

and condition trumps year...

I think all of my comments are directed at the OP's "MASSIVE IMPROVEMENTS" comment


its not that many changes
it can be done in one day by one person...


I hope the OP keeps the car and enjoys it
gets back into his youth if you will
I hate to see someone pick up a car for a song and flip it with no real attempt to remember how much fun these cars are.

[boxsterfan]

<begin running joke>
What if it is a 73-74 2.0L and is yellow? I hear the yellow cars are even faster.
<end running joke>

I'm with ya on the chassis for non concourse type cars. I'll take a rust free chassis of any year over a rusty 2.0L. Besides, take the rust-free 74 1.8L, convert to a /6 and the car is worth way more than a 2.0L /4 (primarily due to parts). However, IMHO if it is an original survivor 73-74 2.0L (original paint, motor, etc...) it will be worth even more than a converted /6 someday.

[dlkawashima]

Also, FWIW, I owned this Marathon Blue 2.0 car in 1976 that never existed according to 914 magazine ads I've seen from the time. My car had no appearance group, (painted sail panels and bumpers), with plain steel wheels and hubcaps. But it was definitely a 1973 914 2.0 with center console, gauges, etc.

the ads I've seen all reference the 2.0 cars having appearance group, Fuchs alloys, etc. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

That's probably a late '73 2-liter with the sport group package, order type code 473744 or 473764. It's the only 2-liter, other than the Limited Editions, that didn't have vinyl on the sail panels.

Look here on Jeff Bowlsby's Model Numbers page: http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/ModelNumbers.htm

[JeffBowlsby]

"...and condition trumps year..."

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

[speeder]

I believe the comment was that there were "MASSIVE IMPROVEMENTS"

I agree there were some improvements
but as I stated... no reason to think that a 1973 car is worth significantly more $ than anyother year

and condition trumps year...

I think all of my comments are directed at the OP's "MASSIVE IMPROVEMENTS" comment


its not that many changes
it can be done in one day by one person...


I hope the OP keeps the car and enjoys it
gets back into his youth if you will
I hate to see someone pick up a car for a song and flip it with no real attempt to remember how much fun these cars are.

1) WTF is talking about buying rusted-out, POS cars?? Not me, that's for sure. I know that condition is the number one consideration in a 40 yr. old car. I want the best model in the best condition. I have a '74 2.0 with a;most zero rust and no accidents in a great color. That should settle that.

2)Yes, you can "change the engine/trans and suspension components and build a 914 2.0 clone out of an earlier car. Why on earth would you want to? These are not exactly $600k '73 911 Carrera RSes, are they? You can just buy the best one on earth for relatively small money, less than the cost of a new Kia turd hauler. These cars are around, not rare but not common either. I'll concede that good, unmolested 2.0 cars are somewhat rare and bring good $$.

3) Maybe "massive" was the wrong word. "significant" would not be, though. When you are talking about 2 seconds off of a 0-60 time or 1/4 mile in what was an underpowered car to start with, and the sweetest type 4 engine ever built, it changed the car. Add in the better shifting trans, ( a real weak spot in the car previously), and the tighter suspension+ new forged rims, etc., it's a case of bunch of small things being greater than their sum. Again, IMO, but also in auto journalists opinion and the market's opinion today.

4) As for what I should do with my car, I do not need nor did I ask for advice. I'll do whatever suits me, either sell it/keep it/restore it/whatever. The purpose of this thread is to put a value on it and help me decide. That's the only deciding factor this week. I will not be going backwards in my Porsche collection this year, I can assure you that. And I'll buy a mint '73/'74 2 liter 914 one day, and pay the going rate for it.

[billh1963]

1) WTF is talking about buying rusted-out, POS cars?? Not me, that's for sure. I know that condition is the number one consideration in a 40 yr. old car. I want the best model in the best condition. I have a '74 2.0 with a;most zero rust and no accidents in a great color. That should settle that.

2)Yes, you can "change the engine/trans and suspension components and build a 914 2.0 clone out of an earlier car. Why on earth would you want to? These are not exactly $600k '73 911 Carrera RSes, are they? You can just buy the best one on earth for relatively small money, less than the cost of a new Kia turd hauler. These cars are around, not rare but not common either. I'll concede that good, unmolested 2.0 cars are somewhat rare and bring good $$.

3) Maybe "massive" was the wrong word. "significant" would not be, though. When you are talking about 2 seconds off of a 0-60 time or 1/4 mile in what was an underpowered car to start with, and the sweetest type 4 engine ever built, it changed the car. Add in the better shifting trans, ( a real weak spot in the car previously), and the tighter suspension+ new forged rims, etc., it's a case of bunch of small things being greater than their sum. Again, IMO, but also in auto journalists opinion and the market's opinion today.

4) As for what I should do with my car, I do not need nor did I ask for advice. I'll do whatever suits me, either sell it/keep it/restore it/whatever. The purpose of this thread is to put a value on it and help me decide. That's the only deciding factor this week. I will not be going backwards in my Porsche collection this year, I can assure you that. And I'll buy a mint '73/'74 2 liter 914 one day, and pay the going rate for it.

A bit testy aren't you? Relax..it's just the internet.... where everyone has a 12" dick, everyone is a millionaire and everyone looks like Brad Pitt.

As far as value...well...you can look through this site all day long and see sold cars. A '73 or '74 2.0 that is PROVEN to have no rust, is in excellent running condition, has very good paint and interior will sell for $7 to $10K on the East Coast. Naturally, as you approach concours level value goes up significantly. A documented LE in similar condition will sell for more...maybe $1K to $5K more depending on how far it has been changed from original.

West Coast prices tend to be a little less due to the availability of less rusty cars and more supply in general.

[914werke]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

You come here to a forum of enthusiasts and proclaim that that you scored a sweetheart deal & the first thing you do is want advice on how much the car might be worth so you can flip it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)

Wadd'ya expect, Take a chill pill

[speeder]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

You come here to a forum of enthusiasts and proclaim that that you scored a sweetheart deal & the first thing you do is want advice on how much the car might be worth so you can flip it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)

Wadd'ya expect, Take a chill pill

I did? Hmmm...must be even more senile than I thought. Can you direct me to that post, where I told all of you that I "scored a sweetheart deal"? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

I did allude to that on the Pelican thread, thought only in response to a question of what I paid. Wish I had not now, it's no one's business. I have 20k posts there and we know each other, I was simply showing-off my latest car find. BillH decided to "help me out" and link that thread to this one, whatever.

As to "flipping", I've almost never sold a car immediately after buying it and never a Porsche. I've owned 6 or 7 Porsches and over 100 other vehicles in this lifetime. That said, there is nothing wrong with flipping something to buy something else, or just because it was a smoking deal and could not be passed up. I have not offered the car for sale to members of this forum, (yet), nor to anyone else. I am still deciding what to do with it.

Inquiring about its value here seemed like a good idea since this is the biggest concentration of 914 geeks online. And don't take that the wrong way, I'm a complete geek and I've never stopped loving the 914 since it came out when I was 10 years old and the hot airline stewardess on our block had one. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

WHat I expected was a bunch of guys and gals who really know 914s including keeping up with the latest market trends. I could tell you what any 911 is worth down to the penny in what region but I'm eons behind when it comes to 914s.

My response was directed only at brant, who is probably cool but seems like he got to the bar three hours before the rest of us and want's to argue about the differences in 914s. It's asinine but just the kind of thing that internet forums thrive on, and I took the bait. Sorry for that. The book on 914s is a relatively short one, as Porsche stories go, and there is no mystery about the development history of the cars.

I appreciate any relevant info on what I might have and what it might be worth. If I do pass it on to someone else, I'd rather do it through enthusiast channels such as this board than on eBay. That is all. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)