75 1.8 L-Jet Starting Problems, Faulty Voltage Regulator? Options

[wrightee]

I'm beginning my new project and trying to get my 1.8 started. Seller told me the dual relay was bad, and I've replaced that and the battery. Engine cranks and it fires and sounds like it wants to start but doesn't keep running beyond the initial rumble. I initially heard the fuel pump (before replacing these things), but am not hearing it now, so I'm thinking it isn't getting fuel. I've found the trouble shooting guides on here and will begin to step through these to either confirm a fuel pump issue (my suspect) or hope that it leads me to the right fix.

While checking things, I noticed that the voltage regulator is still warm (couple hours later and its cold outside). Key is out, and it should be cool by now...I'm thinking that if its still warm, it must be drawing power from the battery. Is this normal? Is this an indication of another problem? or potentially related to the non-start? (if there is a short somewhere causing this to draw) any thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

Ed

[Spoke]

It shouldn't be warm. Has the battery been dying between trying to start it?

As long as you have sufficient voltage (12V) on the battery, this wouldn't cause the engine to not start.

Assuming you have original fuel injection, you should hear the fuel pump start for 1.5 sec after turning the car on.

Since it does stumble, it sounds like the fuel pump is doing something. Not saying it is ok but it is active a bit at least.

[jsayre914]

It shouldn't be warm. Has the battery been dying between trying to start it?

As long as you have sufficient voltage (12V) on the battery, this wouldn't cause the engine to not start.

Assuming you have original fuel injection, you should hear the fuel pump start for 1.5 sec after turning the car on.

Since it does stumble, it sounds like the fuel pump is doing something. Not saying it is ok but it is active a bit at least.

the fuel pump will not run when you turn the key on at all. on the 1.8 it will only run when you start cranking.

[jsayre914]

if you want to test the fuel pump. pull the airbox off of that large rubber arm it is connected to. keep the wires on it, turn the key to the on position and stick your hand into the air flow meter opening. when you push the flap the pump should run strong at about 36psi.

that means your dual relay is good.

[wrightee]

It shouldn't be warm. Has the battery been dying between trying to start it?

As long as you have sufficient voltage (12V) on the battery, this wouldn't cause the engine to not start.

I just put a new battery in - the one there was dead, although only 2 years old so I thought it should still hold a charge but did not (after charging out of the car).

I'm sure this is not directly related to the non-start and my title is a bit misleading - I'm just thinking I found something else wrong from this being warm to the touch.

Guess I'll work first on getting it started - then figure out if its charging when running.

[wrightee]

if you want to test the fuel pump. pull the airbox off of that large rubber arm it is connected to. keep the wires on it, turn the key to the on position and stick your hand into the air flow meter opening. when you push the flap the pump should run strong at about 36psi.

that means your dual relay is good.

Thanks, I'll try this quick test tonight!

[ClayPerrine]

That is close, but you should only have about 30 psi. 36 would make it run really rich.

You also need to verify that the fuel pump runs when you are trying to start the car. Pull the yellow wire off the starter, and turn the key to the start position. You should hear the fuel pump run.

Also, there are some double relays out there that are being sold for a 914 that are actually for a VW. One of the electrical contacts is in the wrong place, and the engine will try to fire, but fail to keep running if the VW relay is installed in a 914 1.8L. I can't tell you which one, I am at work and don't have access to my reference list.

[SUNAB914]

In your picture, it looks as though you have a round relay in the wrong place, that upper one is for rear window defrost, you have nothing in the next position. That is for fuel pump or FI, check it in your book. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

[type47]

In your picture, it looks as though you have a round relay in the wrong place, that upper one is for rear window defrost, you have nothing in the next position. That is for fuel pump or FI, check it in your book. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

[7275914911]

I also noticed that. IIRC the LJet did not use those relays. The fuel pump should work without any relays in the FP slot or the PS slot. On my 1.8 Ljet having relays in those two spots caused a rich running condition.

Have you checked the resistor pack?

It should be easy enough to check VR. Test at battery to see if you are getting proper volts

good luck
kp

[ClayPerrine]

In your picture, it looks as though you have a round relay in the wrong place, that upper one is for rear window defrost, you have nothing in the next position. That is for fuel pump or FI, check it in your book. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

Ok.. all you D-Jet guys... get outta the pool!!!!!!

L-Jet is a completely different animal, and it does NOT use ANY relays on the relay board, and it does NOT have the 2 second fuel pump run when turning on the key.

The double relay under the battery handles all of the L-Jet power requirements. There is a 12v feed line from the battery to it, and at the relay board end there is an additional yellow wire with a female spade connector that hooks to either of the rear two connections on the relay board FI plug. The engine harness does not have the wihte wire for the Aux air regulator, and it does have an extra multi pin plug for the double relay.

Have you pulled the yellow start lead from the starter and turned the key to the start position? If you did, did you hear the fuel pump running? This is important. If you don't hear the fuel pump running, the car will never start, because it doesn't get fuel when cranking.

[zonedoubt]

Also, there are some double relays out there that are being sold for a 914 that are actually for a VW. One of the electrical contacts is in the wrong place, and the engine will try to fire, but fail to keep running if the VW relay is installed in a 914 1.8L. I can't tell you which one, I am at work and don't have access to my reference list.

Bosch # 332-514-120 11-prong type. You have to trim some plastic off the bottom to fit the 914 connectors.

[type47]

Also, there are some double relays out there that are being sold for a 914 that are actually for a VW. One of the electrical contacts is in the wrong place, and the engine will try to fire, but fail to keep running if the VW relay is installed in a 914 1.8L. I can't tell you which one, I am at work and don't have access to my reference list.

Bosch # 332-514-120 11-prong type. You have to trim some plastic off the bottom to fit the 914 connectors.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=101642

[jsayre914]

That is close, but you should only have about 30 psi. 36 would make it run really rich.

I just tested mine with the Bosch book. I am certain the pressure does read 36 with the car off and the pump running. It drops to 28-30 when the car is running


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[jsayre914]

what about the old test light trick? Put a test light between the ground wire and the neg battery terminal. Pull the fusses front and back and see if the light comes on. If it does you have a unfused short. (danger) if it is off start putting the fusses back one at a time and watch for the light.


i just did this with my mercedes, to find the short. new batterys die very fast

[wrightee]

Also, there are some double relays out there that are being sold for a 914 that are actually for a VW. One of the electrical contacts is in the wrong place, and the engine will try to fire, but fail to keep running if the VW relay is installed in a 914 1.8L. I can't tell you which one, I am at work and don't have access to my reference list.

Bosch # 332-514-120 11-prong type. You have to trim some plastic off the bottom to fit the 914 connectors.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=101642

Thanks to all for the assistance - I'm sure I'll track this down soon - BUT, the voltage regulator short I believe is now the primary battle. It drained the brand new Optima battery put in last night to 0 volts today (24 hrs later)... This is my weak(est) area (tracking/fixing electric stuff). Since my regulator was warm to the touch after installing the new battery - do I suspect this is bad and replace it, or are is there a sequence of things I start checking to track a possible short. In the mean time, I need a charger, so I can have some juice to track...I thought I had one left over from my boating days, but it probably went with the boat...

[underthetire]

Also, there are some double relays out there that are being sold for a 914 that are actually for a VW. One of the electrical contacts is in the wrong place, and the engine will try to fire, but fail to keep running if the VW relay is installed in a 914 1.8L. I can't tell you which one, I am at work and don't have access to my reference list.

Bosch # 332-514-120 11-prong type. You have to trim some plastic off the bottom to fit the 914 connectors.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=101642

Thanks to all for the assistance - I'm sure I'll track this down soon - BUT, the voltage regulator short I believe is now the primary battle. It drained the brand new Optima battery put in last night to 0 volts today (24 hrs later)... This is my weak(est) area (tracking/fixing electric stuff). Since my regulator was warm to the touch after installing the new battery - do I suspect this is bad and replace it, or are is there a sequence of things I start checking to track a possible short. In the mean time, I need a charger, so I can have some juice to track...I thought I had one left over from my boating days, but it probably went with the boat...

I think-and hopefully someone else will confirm or deny..if a diode fails in the alternator this might happen?