HEADS!..New Castings , Replacement performance heads?, Anybody have any info on this company or their products? Options

[brer]

I saw type 4 heads on his site last year, year before maybe, but have yet to see a pair or actually hear of someone running them. There was some talk on Samba regarding them at one point and some speculation he was having new castings made, but no one has volunteered any first hand experience.

If anyone is actually using a set speak up!

[bobhasissues]

The price for the L5 and L6 heads don't seem bad compaired to everyone else on new heads!

Mike,
Please reveal who is "everyone else" that sells new T4 heads. I only knew of DRD & Hoffman offering new heads. Someone else posted about DRD heads last spring (I tagged DRD in my favorites at that time), but there were not a lot of responses to that thread.
It would be great if Len would chime in and contribute a comparison, but until he does, here is what I notice related to DRD vs. Hoffman:
Hoffman LE180 has plugs relocated to match the Porsche 2.0 spec heads, no mention of that with DRD.
LE180 has new/improved seats & guides, and stainless valves.
LE180 has Porsche 2.0 spec combustion chambers, DRD says reshaped chambers.
DRD L5 says new valves, L6 says stainless valves.
Looks like DRD L5 prices start at $1300 due to the "<" next to the price, so finished heads may be substantially more.
DRD L5 or L6 look to be really nice heads, but they don't appear to be 2.0 replicas like the Hoffman LE180 (& LE190? if still available).
It would be great if someone could find out all the facts about DRD and their options though.

[brer]

The price for the L5 and L6 heads don't seem bad compaired to everyone else on new heads!

Mike,
Please reveal who is "everyone else" that sells new T4 heads. I only knew of DRD & Hoffman offering new heads. Someone else posted about DRD heads last spring (I tagged DRD in my favorites at that time), but there were not a lot of responses to that thread.
It would be great if Len would chime in and contribute a comparison, but until he does, here is what I notice related to DRD vs. Hoffman:
Hoffman LE180 has plugs relocated to match the Porsche 2.0 spec heads, no mention of that with DRD.
LE180 has new/improved seats & guides, and stainless valves.
LE180 has Porsche 2.0 spec combustion chambers, DRD says reshaped chambers.
DRD L5 says new valves, L6 says stainless valves.
Looks like DRD L5 prices start at $1300 due to the "<" next to the price, so finished heads may be substantially more.
DRD L5 or L6 look to be really nice heads, but they don't appear to be 2.0 replicas like the Hoffman LE180 (& LE190? if still available).
It would be great if someone could find out all the facts about DRD and their options though.

Pretty much any VW head shop can order the new castings last i checked, its more a question of what preparation you would like done and who has stepped up with a market offering.

I can order new castings and and have the spark plugs relocated and 2L chambers cut for about $1400 without ordering from these two suppliers if I really wanted to.

Its just a matter of who you trust and who can do the job to your standards.

[HAM Inc]

I don't make a habit of commenting on competitors work, at least not when it comes to specifics. Though I have not seen to much of Darrens work, I have spoken to him on the phone and he is a very nice guy, and seems pretty knowledgeable.

I do know that there are other competent machinist out there, for that I am grateful as I already have more work than I can do, (for which I am also grateful).

The problem is finding one who is willing to work with used T4 castings and deal with ALL of the issues they present, (from previous hack work, to cracks, to damaged sparkplug threads, worn or eroded exhaust gasket surfaces, butchered ex stud bosses, not to mention all of the routine work they require) without either ignoring the issues or doing patch work.
Even a competent machinist will "max out" his commmitment to "value added service" at a point typically short of that required by most used T4 heads. Over the years I have seen a steady parade of heads that had just been picked up by my new customer from some shop or another (some from a popular West Coast shop, not DRD) that had issues not dealt with or work that was questionable to the owner, so he shipped them to me to straighten things out.

That is why I stoppped working with used T4 heads. I found that I was going to have to raise my prices again to keep them profitable if I intended to keep my commitment to shipping truly ready to install heads.

I don't want to sound dramatic, but the quantity of quality used castings flowing into my shop has really declined in the last two years. I still prep used heads fro racers, as we are required to use O.E. castings, but it really is a drag having to spend hours of casting repair and cleaning up details before I can get down to the business of making some power out of the darn things.

I put a tremendous amount of effort into ensuring that each pair of heads that leaves my shop are the best offering anyone can buy anywhere on the planet. That includes a lot QC work on each operation and constant attention to details, plus ongoing tweaking of designs and flowbench work.
As all of you are well aware this does not come cheap. I'm sure that most of you in the market for heads have developed sticker shock when seeing how much a pair of new HAM heads runs. I don't blame anyone for that. I wish the raw materials weren't so expensive, just as I wish the original castings were heartier and the supply of quality used castings deepers. But such is life.

I am very proud of the fact that I have yet to hear anyone complain that they felt they didn't get what they paid for when they purchased a pair of my heads. I don't mean for this to sound like a sales pitch. I just wanted to let the members hear my feelings on the subject at hand.

[904svo]

I have a set of the RS heads that Len did. It is quality work!!!!!!
For the money you spend on rebuilding a engine its Worth it to
buy new heads and not try to used old rework heads which the
valve seat may fall out while running.

Just my $.02 Its money well spent!

[Speedster Mike]

Len,
You definately are the top authority in Type IV heads. You've been doing them a long time. I must say In my book you are a class act guy! ....You took time to talk to me about my type IV head issues in the past. You were very informative and helpful. You are the best ! ....that's why I called. Unfortunately I can't afford to do anything right now because of my budget. Of course that's my problem not yours. I know your products are the best available or Jake would not use them. Both of you guys are top shelf , I have Never heard anyone ever complain about your work or products....I know you stand behind what you do....You only do it once and you do it right. I like that....alot. I'm like anyone else who just doe'snt have alot of doe to throw at a project....We finally realize we just don't have the funds to do it the way we would really like to so we start looking for some way to salvage the project. That's me and probably a lot of other guys too. I hope I did'nt ruffle any feathers here......I did'nt mean to. You guys are Great!. I just asked if anybody had any experience with DRD Racing and their Type IV new casting performance heads. It looked like a good product....You never know till you ask....right! I did call the company and talked to Darren. He also is a really nice guy and he had nothing but really good things to say about you and Jake. Understand I am and was not trying to pick at you or Jake or anyone else for that matter in relation to price or product. I do hope one day I can do business with you guys. Thanks again for your time.

Mike

[Jake Raby]

I have nothing but good things to say about Darren at DRD. If you go that route I'd have him give a written commitment to a "worst case" shipping date for the heads as delivery has been my only issue with him, but that was on a pair of Type 1 heads.

Darren has prepped one single pair of T4 heads for me back in 2005, based on AMC castings.

Just spend your money wisely and think about what you will do if what you buy doesn't work out for some reason, always plan on worst case scenario.

[Speedster Mike]

Thanks Jake!.....That's good advice. I appreciate you guys!

[Speedster Mike]

I saw type 4 heads on his site last year, year before maybe, but have yet to see a pair or actually hear of someone running them. There was some talk on Samba regarding them at one point and some speculation he was having new castings made, but no one has volunteered any first hand experience.

If anyone is actually using a set speak up!

Anybody?

[bobhasissues]

Actually $1300 for the L5 heads should be fine for a stock 2.0 engine with carbs or the 2056cc or the 2270cc stroker motor .....sounds like a fairly decent price considering what you would pay for a performance rebuild with old castings....what do you guys think? I'm going to give them a call tomorrow!

So Mike, Did you get heads from DRD?

[Speedster Mike]

Actually $1300 for the L5 heads should be fine for a stock 2.0 engine with carbs or the 2056cc or the 2270cc stroker motor .....sounds like a fairly decent price considering what you would pay for a performance rebuild with old castings....what do you guys think? I'm going to give them a call tomorrow!

So Mike, Did you get heads from DRD?

Still haven't pulled the trigger on head purchase....but I have to make a decision soon. My biggest problem is the money thing!...I have a budget. Any advice?

[Borderline]

I bought a set of heads from DRD and they look great. I'm having other issues with the engine, but so far I am happy with the heads. He even relocated the plugs to the 2.0L location and included it in the $1500. Last time I looked the Raby prices were over $2K.

[Speedster Mike]

Bill,
When did you order them and how long did it take to get them in your hands? Good quality? Everthing that you had expected? Thank for the info!

Mike

[Speedster Mike]

Bill,
When did you order them and how long did it take to get them in your hands? Good quality? Everthing that you had expected? Thank for the info!

Mike

Update: 11/12/2011.....Hey guys I had forgotten about this thread....last input was on june 7th 2010. I did finally make a decision.....I saved up my money and bought the L5 heads from Darren at DRD Racing in California. They were everything he said they would be.....He does great work and he also relocated the plugs and reshaped the combustion chambers to the 2.0 specs. Got performance dual Valve springs and stainless steel valves.....all the good stuff! He also matched my intake ports to my heads for no extra charge!

Mike

[tornik550]

I'll add a little bit to this conversation. First, I have had various work done by drd. They have alway been great. I recently had some work done and I was shocked by how quickly the work was done.

Second, in the past I have had bugpatch do work for me. The work was always great and Don was very helpful. When I was looking for heads, like many of us I couldn't find good cores and I couldn't spend +2000 on new heads. I knew that don does a fair amount of work on t4 heads. He has a CNC machine and developed a program to match 2.0 combustion chambers CNC cuts ports. He has the flow data to back up his claims of increased flow. IIRC it is compared to stock heads and not competitors. He made me a set using AMC castings which are converted to 2.0 chambers. Plugs relocated, new seats, guides, etc. Mine has new 44/38 valves. I know there is some debate about 38 or 36 mm valves. He can make you whatever size you want.

I am in no way connected to bugpatch. I am just posting this as a happy customer. I should say that, as my other posts clearly show, I am far from an expert.

I am typing this on my phone so I will try to post pics later.

[tornik550]

Here are some pics of my Bugpatch Heads-

[TJB/914]

Here are some pics of my Bugpatch Heads-

I purchased Raby & Len's LE-180 heads for my 2.0 liter engine and completely satisified with the quality and performance. I researched long & hard before making my decision. I know it's a money decision, but cylinder heads & cams are key eliments in a rebuild. I like my Raby #9550 cam & Len LE-180 head decision.
BTW: I noticed the heads shown above by tornik550 do not have the (3) exhaust studs that you get with Len's heads. Photo's of my LE-180 Raby/Len Heads. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif)

Tom

[silver74insocal]

oh pretty pictures!! anyone got flow data? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[lonewolfe]

I'll add a little bit to this conversation. First, I have had various work done by drd. They have alway been great. I recently had some work done and I was shocked by how quickly the work was done.

Second, in the past I have had bugpatch do work for me. The work was always great and Don was very helpful. When I was looking for heads, like many of us I couldn't find good cores and I couldn't spend +2000 on new heads. I knew that don does a fair amount of work on t4 heads. He has a CNC machine and developed a program to match 2.0 combustion chambers CNC cuts ports. He has the flow data to back up his claims of increased flow. IIRC it is compared to stock heads and not competitors. He made me a set using AMC castings which are converted to 2.0 chambers. Plugs relocated, new seats, guides, etc. Mine has new 44/38 valves. I know there is some debate about 38 or 36 mm valves. He can make you whatever size you want.

I am in no way connected to bugpatch. I am just posting this as a happy customer. I should say that, as my other posts clearly show, I am far from an expert.

I am typing this on my phone so I will try to post pics later.

How much were your heads from Bugpatch?

[TheCabinetmaker]

I'm betting part of the price difference between Bugpatch and Len is not plugging and drilling for the 3 bolt intake?