One messed up build thread. Nothing's gonna be right, I've been neglecting one of my cars. I'm a bad man. Options

[rohar]

So I've been playing with this thing a bit and collecting parts while the wife had me busy rebuilding most of the house. Now that's over and I've got most of the construction debris out of the garage so I thought I'd start a build thread to document whatever progress occurs now that I have time to get to work on this thing.

I fell out of cars for a couple of years while I chased around the country with my career. Tough to build a car while you're moving every 6 months. When we wound up back in Spokane permanently, I bought this chassis as my birthday present. 1975, originally a 1.8. Chassis is pretty clean. I've already installed billet front hubs and redrilled rears at 4x114.4 so I could keep my enkeis from a previous project, they'll probably get powder coated black before this is all over. Also went with the upgraded master cyl and 3" 911 front calipers.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/public.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1302826581.1.jpg)

Only slightly scary rust is in the hell hole. Longs look pretty good and hell hole should be a pretty easy fix. The pic makes it look worse than it feels under a screwdriver. Obviously the batt tray is a bit shot:

(IMG:http://ftdaha.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pxcbo8_qRm_qDebALZgK1eNo5rQv8wqteySoAnLt4MnxxtuJ8BIc4TP6-9gfFSWid1qUhqUgX3fi7mIcfPcm73-GZjsOEn-Wi/P1010059.jpg)

The engine and tranny are out of a 2.8l 12v V6 A4. It seems to fit well after a bit of the trunk was relieved of it's dignity:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/oh1xza.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1302826582.2.jpg)

The throttle comes out the back of the variable runner length manifold so it would stick into the trunk, except it's symmetrical so I should be able to turn it around and gain some space after I grind the power steering pump mounts off the block.

The output flanges on this tranny have a HUGE diameter AND they're offset by quite a few mm. I'm going to stick with stock size CV joints for now and see where that goes. 200ft/lbs shouldn't grenade them immediately. To pull this all together, I had a local guy I've worked with before throw some stainless on the lathe:

(IMG:http://ftdaha.bay.livefilestore.com/y1ppkgXonLknIqta8AInPF-NZz2tGpZigmTQ3jxQVeibDYn6wzACYV40QBs6Cn_BMO17rfXNbuVSLJ72yu_EB70PXnAsVcy8UGt/P1010058.jpg)

A bit heavy, but I intentionally left a bunch of material there in case I have to go to bigger CVs later. Risky move, but I think I'm gonna take it. Too late now in any case.

As you can see, the belt array is directly in line with where the stock cross bar was, and with the audi tranny, the crank (and whole engine) are a bit lower than the stock type IV so motor mounts aren't gonna be as easy as I had hoped:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/public.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1302826582.3.jpg)

The steel for the mounts is in the garage. Tomorrow, I start tackling that problem.

[silver74insocal]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/yikes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/yikes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif) cant wait to see your work. how much does your new drivetrain weight ? good luck!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) DAve

[Mike Bellis]

If you swap to 930 CV's you can adjust the engine forward. They can withstand greater angles over stock ones. Most V8 conversions set the trans back 1.5 inches without problems. Looks like a cool build. look forward to the progress.

[rohar]

If you swap to 930 CV's you can adjust the engine forward. They can withstand greater angles over stock ones. Most V8 conversions set the trans back 1.5 inches without problems. Looks like a cool build. look forward to the progress.

There's different size flanges on the audi trannies. 110mm and then these buggers that are at 114 or some gawdawefull size (my notes are downstairs, I could go find them). With the big flanges, you have to go to adapters as there's just no common spline count axle that'll fit a normal CV that size. This one is going to be lined up perfectly with the axle line. If I move 1 cam vent and turn the intake backwards, I can even put the piece of the trunk I relieved back.

If I was to do this over, I'd measure the output flanges before buying the tranny (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[rohar]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/yikes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/yikes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif) cant wait to see your work. how much does your new drivetrain weight ? good luck!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) DAve

I have no idea. Truth be told it's probably a transitional power plant. The Audi V8s share the bell housing and motor mounts with the v6s. Primary goal is to get the chassis on the Audi platform, then start shopping for a sexy engine (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[okieflyr]

I've got probably 1200 miles including auto-xing and the tail of the dragon on my aluminum adapters so far and they are still holding up running 25" dia sticky tires. Your stainless should outlast everything you put on that car.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[rick 918-S]

Cool, I like the Audi engines. Just becareful shopping for the V8. Don't get one that needs rebuilding or any work. From the reasearch I did there are no bearing sets for Audi V8's. Audi wants to sell long blocks not parts.

[rohar]

I've got probably 1200 miles including auto-xing and the tail of the dragon on my aluminum adapters so far and they are still holding up running 25" dia sticky tires. Your stainless should outlast everything you put on that car.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Interesting. I've been thinking of doing a second set in aluminum. I've got my own backyard foundry so I can cast them and have the machinist finish them up on the cheep. What grade aluminum and thickness are you running? What torque?

He threw me the materials free on this one for a previous favor, so stainless it was!

[rohar]

Cool, I like the Audi engines. Just becareful shopping for the V8. Don't get one that needs rebuilding or any work. From the reasearch I did there are no bearing sets for Audi V8's. Audi wants to sell long blocks not parts.

There's no bearings, rings or any possibility of honing the block. Gotta shop REAL hard to get a good one. A man can dream. In the mean time, I intend to do abhorant things to this poor engine. There's a pair of GT-28s and a megasquirt 3 on the shelf and the engine geometry is terrifyingly close to the 8v engines we spent too much time blowing up in the old hardcoreVW days.

First job is to get it running stock, we'll see where it goes from there.

[raw1298]

This is the start of a great build. Looking forward to the updates! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[okieflyr]

I've got probably 1200 miles including auto-xing and the tail of the dragon on my aluminum adapters so far and they are still holding up running 25" dia sticky tires. Your stainless should outlast everything you put on that car.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Interesting. I've been thinking of doing a second set in aluminum. I've got my own backyard foundry so I can cast them and have the machinist finish them up on the cheep. What grade aluminum and thickness are you running? What torque?

He threw me the materials free on this one for a previous favor, so stainless it was!

Well mine were made by a friend of a friend at a helicopter parts machine shop.
All I could get from him, was that the forged slug material was normally machined for rotor parts. I don't know the thickness off hand, but I did share the specs with you awhile back. I'm working with 205hp and 230tq. The torque is coming in around 1700-1900 rpm so they are hanging tough.

[rohar]

I've got probably 1200 miles including auto-xing and the tail of the dragon on my aluminum adapters so far and they are still holding up running 25" dia sticky tires. Your stainless should outlast everything you put on that car.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Interesting. I've been thinking of doing a second set in aluminum. I've got my own backyard foundry so I can cast them and have the machinist finish them up on the cheep. What grade aluminum and thickness are you running? What torque?

He threw me the materials free on this one for a previous favor, so stainless it was!

Well mine were made by a friend of a friend at a helicopter parts machine shop.
All I could get from him, was that the forged slug material was normally machined for rotor parts. I don't know the thickness off hand, but I did share the specs with you awhile back. I'm working with 205hp and 230tq. The torque is coming in around 1700-1900 rpm so they are hanging tough.

Crap, you're right. I've got those numbers buried away somewhere. I'm barely into this build and I've already forgotten more than I remember. Probably not a good sign.

The torque is in line with what I'm headed for so that's a good sign. You're running 100mm CVs though aren't you?

[okieflyr]

Yep, type 4 inners and outers.

If your going bigger on power some day, you'd might as well consider the 110mm and only have to do it once. The part I'm not crazy about is the distance of the inner joint from where the flange exits the trans. In the loooong run, the torque forces that far out on the output shafts may take it's toll on the bearings and seals.
Ideally I'd like to have been able to swap Boxster output flanges, but it appeared that the box would have to be opened up, and that was not something that would come easy or economical for me. I do have a Quaiffe diff installed too...

[rohar]

Yep, type 4 inners and outers.

If your going bigger on power some day, you'd might as well consider the 110mm and only have to do it once. The part I'm not crazy about is the distance of the inner joint from where the flange exits the trans. In the loooong run, the torque forces that far out on the output shafts may take it's toll on the bearings and seals.
Ideally I'd like to have been able to swap Boxster output flanges, but it appeared that the box would have to be opened up, and that was not something that would come easy or economical for me. I do have a Quaiffe diff installed too...

There's enough meat left on these adapters to go 110 later. I had the bolt holes put in the "wrong" place so if I needed it later I could redrill them for 110 later half a rotation off and cut a new centering ring. I kicked around the boxster flanges too, came to the same conclusion. Just wasn't worth it. If I paid retail for the steel, price would have been about $350 for the adapters. A bit less than a Kennedy kit and it's in hand in a week. Never seen Kennedy do that (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) BTW, I need you to PM me your address. I've got something for you for sending me the dimensions.

Quaiffe comes later. The wife's given me one heck of a budget, but there's only so much time in the day.

[rohar]

Ok, I'm two days behind where I wanted to be. Started cutting steel for the motor mounts, pics to follow shortly. I keep forgetting how much time it takes to cut steel if you have any attention to detail...

[okieflyr]

Bump..

Are you sparking anything up yet? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welder.gif)

[rohar]

Bump..

Are you sparking anything up yet? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welder.gif)

It's been like three years since I've done any serious welding. It was obvious from my performance today. I managed to bang out most of the cross bar, but there's some little pieces that still need to be done. I'll push them out tomorrow.

Pics tomorrow because I'm too damned tired to remember how to upload pics.

[rohar]

Some pics and progress from sunday. Had to roll the engine out from under the car to get more measurements for mounting so I figured I'd take a better look into the hole of hell:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/oh1xza.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1303140506.1.jpg)

Looks like I'm gonna get off easy there. Once the motor mounts are finished, I'll start cleaning it up.

While the engine was out of the car, I pulled everything I don't need. No more power steering or AC. It might be a bit tricky to find a new rout for the serpentine. I'll probably end up running the tensioner on the wrong side of the belt. Oh, and turning the manifold backwards isn't an option. May have to call a budy of mine and work up a custom CF manifold.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/oh1xza.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1303140506.2.jpg)

And the cross bar is almost finished. It'll mount in the stock crossbar location with rubber mounts on the ears. I'm not using the stock audi mounts as it makes it real tough to get all the tubing in properly. It'll make much more sense when I get the diagonals that attach the engine to the bar finished.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/public.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1303140506.3.jpg)

[rohar]

Slow going... Yesterday I managed to get the cross bar finished and mounted in the chassis. It doesn't look quite like the above pic anymore. I've only rolled the engine under the car, dropped the chassis on it to do some measurements, only to lift it and roll the engine out about 10 times.

Thinking I'm gonna spend the day fighting the rusted batt tray and seeing what I can do about cancer treatment underneath.

[rohar]

WOOT! Front motor mountage, and I think I left enough room for that V8 I'll find years from now:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/oh1xza.bay.livefilestore.com-9685-1304274197.1.jpg)

I know, about time! My welding skills aren't what they used to be.