 Aw damnitsomuch! Really?!, Cracks in V8 wheel well cut outs |
|
|
|
Porsche, and the Porsche crest are registered trademarks of Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche AG.
This site is not affiliated with Porsche in any way. Its only purpose is to provide an online forum for car enthusiasts. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners. |
|
|
  |
| aircooledboy |
 Oct 6 2011, 07:41 PM
Post
#1
|
|
Sweet Pea's 1st ride in daddy's "vroom -vroom"  Group: Members Posts: 1,672 Joined: 4-February 04 From: Rockford, IL Member No.: 1,629 Region Association: Upper MidWest  |
Weather has turned to gorgeous fall driving time here in the midwest. My favorite time to drive the teener. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) Stopped to get gas yesterday, and as I was waiting for it to fill I noticed an odd deflection in the metal at the edge of the passenger side cooling cut out in the wheel well. I think to myself "self, you should keep an eye on that and make sure it doesn't turn into a crack like you've heard about." Then I look and see a similar one on the drivers side (see white circles in picture below). Hmmmm. . . Then I look closer and. . . awwww shiat!!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) I see pretty bad cracks on BOTH cut outs (see red circles below).
  |
   |
 
|
| aircooledboy |
Oct 6 2011, 07:48 PM
Post
#2
|
|
Sweet Pea's 1st ride in daddy's "vroom -vroom" Group: Members Posts: 1,672 Joined: 4-February 04 From: Rockford, IL Member No.: 1,629 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Forgive the crappy cell phone pictures, but it was handy.
John made the cut outs bigger than most, and consequently it has been discussed that they may have issues at some point, so I watched them for the first few years I had the car with no problems. I haven't had much time for the teener for the last couple years, so I stopped paying attention. I don't really know how long it took them to develop. The passenger side one is worse, reaching very close to the pinch weld for the gas tank bulkhead. The driver side is shorter. My question is what is the best method to repair. Can I just weld them up, or do I need to stengthen them somehow too? |
|
|
|
| rick 918-S |
Oct 6 2011, 08:00 PM
Post
#3
|
|
Hey nice rack! -Celette Group: Members Posts: 20,457 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Now in Superior WI Member No.: 43 Region Association: Northstar Region 
|
Hi Chris!
I would weld and grind the crack then weld in a brace from the shock towers to the front suspension pickup point. I would also consider welding a brace from the bulk head across the floor pan. I will add a diagram in a minute. |
|
|
|
| aircooledboy |
Oct 6 2011, 08:09 PM
Post
#4
|
|
Sweet Pea's 1st ride in daddy's "vroom -vroom" Group: Members Posts: 1,672 Joined: 4-February 04 From: Rockford, IL Member No.: 1,629 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
|
|
|
|
| rick 918-S |
Oct 6 2011, 08:27 PM
Post
#5
|
|
Hey nice rack! -Celette Group: Members Posts: 20,457 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Now in Superior WI Member No.: 43 Region Association: Northstar Region
|
Excuse my crude drawing skills. The upper drawing shows the cut out. The red is some 4130 tubing.
I'm sure someone has actual photos of a typical bracing. My wheel wells are not cut as high as yours. You getting alot of flex to crack the opening. Attached image(s) 
|
|
|
|
| mark21742 |
Oct 7 2011, 05:36 AM
Post
#6
|
|
Member Group: Members Posts: 162 Joined: 31-August 11 From: pa Member No.: 13,502 Region Association: North East States |
I'm glad to see these drawings! This is almost exactly how I braced mine when I cut all the factory sheet metal out from the front end, I just have a "cage",the torsionbar mounts from and tops of the strut towers infront of the windsheild with just enough sheet metal to hold my new fuel cell.......this setup was quick, easy and strong as hell
|
|
|
|
| Eric_Shea |
Oct 7 2011, 11:44 AM
Post
#7
|
|
PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
I always wonder about those things every time I see them. Kinda confirms my fears.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) at least weld from the shock tower/firewall area down to the front pickup points. Might help if you STOPPED DOING WHEELIES! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
|
|
|
| Tom |
Oct 7 2011, 12:36 PM
Post
#8
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,139 Joined: 21-August 05 From: Port Orchard, WA 98367 Member No.: 4,626 Region Association: None |
Drill a 1/4" hole at the end of the crack to stop the crack from extending, until you get the welding done.
Tom |
|
|
|
| aircooledboy |
Oct 7 2011, 02:14 PM
Post
#9
|
|
Sweet Pea's 1st ride in daddy's "vroom -vroom" Group: Members Posts: 1,672 Joined: 4-February 04 From: Rockford, IL Member No.: 1,629 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Because I don't want to kill my 901, I'm usually reasonably gentle on the launches, but after that, I have been known to drive her pretty hard from time to time. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) The last turn onto my road is about a 75 degree left turn going from a 55 mph to a 55 mph with great visability in all directions. I just LOVE to hit that bad boy at about 65 with nobody around. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) Its just too damn much fun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) Might be the source of my woes here though. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)
I can probably get them welded up this weekend just to get me through the rest of the teener season IF I can do it without pulling the gas tank. What do you guys think, can I get way with that or am I asking for (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blowup.gif) . (IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif) |
|
|
|
| JRust |
Oct 7 2011, 02:15 PM
Post
#10
|
|
914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 6,307 Joined: 10-January 03 From: Corvallis Oregon Member No.: 129 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
|
Besides the bracing I like using a weldable metal mesh. Get something heavy duty & it should strengthen the area plenty. It also shouldn't restrict the air flow through them.
|
|
|
|
| rick 918-S |
Oct 7 2011, 09:17 PM
Post
#11
|
|
Hey nice rack! -Celette Group: Members Posts: 20,457 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Now in Superior WI Member No.: 43 Region Association: Northstar Region
|
Ya, you should be able to weld that. If you have it use a wet blanket over the tank incase you get the sparks flying. Get a piece of 3/4 or 1" copper tubing and hammer it flat. Clamp it to the wheel side as a back up strip. You won't chase the crack by blowing holes as you weld.
|
|
|
|
| Mike Bellis |
Oct 8 2011, 12:12 AM
Post
#12
|
|
Resident Electrician Group: Members Posts: 8,345 Joined: 22-June 09 From: Midlothian TX Member No.: 10,496 Region Association: None
|
I have air vents that big with no signs of cracking. Water cooled for 5-10 years. I would be worried of some other soft spot in the front end causing too much flex. Bracing will help but find out which factory spot welds are no good. Many stress crack like that form at sharp corners. Your corners look rounded. Red flag for me.
|
|
|
|
| 76-914 |
Oct 8 2011, 07:41 AM
Post
#13
|
|
Repeat Offender & Resident Subaru Antagonist Group: Members Posts: 13,501 Joined: 23-January 09 From: Temecula, CA Member No.: 9,964 Region Association: Southern California
|
QUOTE(rick 918-S @ Oct 7 2011, 08:17 PM)  Ya, you should be able to weld that. If you have it use a wet blanket over the tank incase you get the sparks flying. Get a piece of 3/4 or 1" copper tubing and hammer it flat. Clamp it to the wheel side as a back up strip. You won't chase the crack by blowing holes as you weld. Shit. I never knew that! I luv the University of 914's. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif) |
|
|
|
| aircooledboy |
Oct 9 2011, 04:39 PM
Post
#14
|
|
Sweet Pea's 1st ride in daddy's "vroom -vroom" Group: Members Posts: 1,672 Joined: 4-February 04 From: Rockford, IL Member No.: 1,629 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Boy, nothing like welding a little sheet metal to remind me this welding business is harder than it looks. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif)
Here are some real picture of the cracks. They both start at the exact spot where the arc of the corner transitions into the straight cut. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)   You guys aren't getting any after pictures. I have to have some pride. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Rick, I'm not sure how I'm gonna make your idea fly. Mr. radiator covers the the front torsion bar pick up. I could probably run the bottom piece all the way to that spot, but the angle bracket would only get about 1/2 front to back before I run into the radiator.  Mark, have you got a picture of your design? |
|
|
|
| mark21742 |
Oct 9 2011, 05:32 PM
Post
#15
|
|
Member Group: Members Posts: 162 Joined: 31-August 11 From: pa Member No.: 13,502 Region Association: North East States |
I hope to get back out to the garage in a few hours....I'm not finished with it, but I'll take and post a few closeup pics for you
|
|
|
|
| mark21742 |
Oct 10 2011, 06:59 PM
Post
#16
|
|
Member Group: Members Posts: 162 Joined: 31-August 11 From: pa Member No.: 13,502 Region Association: North East States |
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i283.photobucket.com-13502-1318294783.1.jpg)
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i283.photobucket.com-13502-1318294783.2.jpg) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i283.photobucket.com-13502-1318294784.3.jpg) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i283.photobucket.com-13502-1318294784.4.jpg) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i283.photobucket.com-13502-1318294785.5.jpg) I hope this helps! A |
|
|
|
| strawman |
Oct 10 2011, 10:34 PM
Post
#17
|
|
Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 881 Joined: 25-January 08 From: Los Osos, CA Member No.: 8,624 Region Association: Central California
|
Hey mark21742, I'm no engineer, but I believe you'll need to triangulate the suspension fore-aft points (i.e., the lower points that the A-arm connects). If you don't provide a solid link between those points, your lower fore-aft connection is a moving part. And since your diagonals are not straight (i.e., bends near the top and bottom), there could be some movement of that "hypotenuse" that connects the upper strut point and the forward A-arm mount.
YMMV, Geoff |
|
|
|
| mark21742 |
Oct 11 2011, 04:25 AM
Post
#18
|
|
Member Group: Members Posts: 162 Joined: 31-August 11 From: pa Member No.: 13,502 Region Association: North East States |
QUOTE(strawman @ Oct 11 2011, 12:34 AM) Hey mark21742, I'm no engineer, but I believe you'll need to triangulate the suspension fore-aft points (i.e., the lower points that the A-arm connects). If you don't provide a solid link between those points, your lower fore-aft connection is a moving part. And since your diagonals are not straight (i.e., bends near the top and bottom), there could be some movement of that "hypotenuse" that connects the upper strut point and the forward A-arm mount. YMMV, Geoff Exactly, I just ran out of tube steel lol by the time I got another twenty foot I had jumped over to one of my other projects for the weekend. I wanted to fit the new fuel tank before I ran my lower rails, and use the lower rails as the fuel tank mounts too.....I'm going to run one front to back from the front torsion mounts into the floor braces, and one stair up and down from the lower brace to the upper brace along the strut tower, then a diagonal from front lower to rear lower.....I plan on cutting and fitting these tonight |
|
|
|
| charliew |
Jan 23 2012, 09:29 AM
Post
#19
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,363 Joined: 31-July 07 From: Crawford, TX. Member No.: 7,958 |
I think I would go to the trouble of putting a piece of 1/8 sheet across the top over the opening over the crack after is is repaired if you can't get the diagional brace in. How does the door gap look at the lower front? I think the crack is from the twist from side to side as much as a sag condition. The one crack looks like it is trying to overlap some. If you weld it as it is sitting it may close up more as the metal melts so maybe jack it up under the dooor to see if it opens up and just raise it till it's not under stress before welding it. Without braceing it will probably just recrack along the edge of the weld as the original metal has now been heated and is softer than it was and the weld is harder and thicker than the metal was. Have you added stiffer bars or is it bottoming out from being lowered?
Edit: I forgot this was a older thread but it is a good topic. |
|
|
|
|
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:
|
Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 15th May 2024 - 03:37 PM |
Invision Power Board
v9.1.4 © 2024 IPS, Inc.