Cleaning and gleaning the nailed threads, What would have me do, if anything? Options

[Pat Garvey]

In light of the nearly constant carping from ONE particular member to "cull the heard" of some nailed section(s) posts, I ask several questions:

1. Are there too many posts/threads that should be un-nailed?
2. Who should decide if they are inappropriate to the topic?
3. If, after deemed inappropriate to the thread/forum, should they me simply deleted? Should they be moved to some sort of limbo for aperiod of time before deletion?
4. Should they just be sent to the "limbo" category forever?
5. If sent to "limbo", should the posts be left there indefinitely? There are many anomolies to the early production 914's. These are old cars. Production of the early ones was filled with on-the-spot changes.
6. Many other questions........

Look, I'm just trying to do my job here. I do not know everything about every model produced. I will NOT be the judge of every post. I "moderate". That's all.

In the rare occasion that something is inappropiate I have moved threads.

Last thing I want is for my buds to be p_ssed off at me for my lack of knowledge of every 914 ever produced, in any iteration. Again, my job is to MODERATE.

Guidance please!
Pat

[tod914]

Pat here's a suggestion. Copy the nailed threads. The copy can be left alone with all the discussion in it. At the top of the nailed ones, post a link to the copied thread. Unnail the copied thread. Purge the hell out of the originals. Just use your best judgement, which we all trust, and give us the cliff notes. That way, if someone wants more info, they can goto to the unailed copied thread (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Alot of work, but gives the best of two worlds. Maybe Paul would be willing to assist you? He certianly has a deep knowledge of 914 history and info..

[Pat Garvey]

Good thought Tod, but a lot of work. Still, doable.

Let's here from Naberhaus here.

[Tom_T]

Pat,

While I like Tod's idea of keeping a simplified thread nailed on all topics there now with a link to an unnailed & unadulterated version - and IMHO there should be a few more nailed as well, such as that OEM paints thread which I've suggested before -

.... I do have concerns about losing what may be valuable to somebody else in the sometimes rambling discussion.

What may seem unimportant to you, Tod or I - may indeed be just along the lines of what someone else needs to know, and once it's gone it's gone.

I mean the idle chit-chat types of crud posted can certainly be deleted with no consequences to content, but may offend the poster's &/or other folks sense fo free speech.

Plus it's a huge task to do that to all of those posts, and do you - or does anyone - really want to wade thru the back log of topics/posts today - let alone keep up with it over time!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Really - isn't that one guy you mention - already retired with all sorts of spare time now to wade through the extra posts in these topics!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

... just funnin' ya' P! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Any-hooo ... I'd say let them self police & not edit them - nor reduce any nailed topics, just maybe delete selective posts if there is something inappropriately said, or in bad taste, etc.

Instead, I'd prefer to have you, nuen-verhzen (sp?), Tod914, Tom B. & some of the other O&H resto old hands on here look through the archives of the "regular" topics on O&H & the Garage forums, to pluck out some juicy tid-bits of wisdom on restoring our beloved 914s, which have up until now escaped being nailed!

IMHO that would be time better spent! ... my 2 cents anyway! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Pat Garvey]

G

Pat,

While I like Tod's idea of keeping a simplified thread nailed on all topics there now with a link to an unnailed & unadulterated version - and IMHO there should be a few more nailed as well, such as that OEM paints thread which I've suggested before -

.... I do have concerns about losing what may be valuable to somebody else in the sometimes rambling discussion.

What may seem unimportant to you, Tod or I - may indeed be just along the lines of what someone else needs to know, and once it's gone it's gone.

I mean the idle chit-chat types of crud posted can certainly be deleted with no consequences to content, but may offend the poster's &/or other folks sense fo free speech.

Plus it's a huge task to do that to all of those posts, and do you - or does anyone - really want to wade thru the back log of topics/posts today - let alone keep up with it over time!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Really - isn't that one guy you mention - already retired with all sorts of spare time now to wade through the extra posts in these topics!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

... just funnin' ya' P! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Any-hooo ... I'd say let them self police & not edit them - nor reduce any nailed topics, just maybe delete selective posts if there is something inappropriately said, or in bad taste, etc.

Instead, I'd prefer to have you, nuen-verhzen (sp?), Tod914, Tom B. & some of the other O&H resto old hands on here look through the archives of the "regular" topics on O&H & the Garage forums, to pluck out some juicy tid-bits of wisdom on restoring our beloved 914s, which have up until now escaped being nailed!

IMHO that would be time better spent! ... my 2 cents anyway! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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Good thoughts Tom.

I'm still listening!

Wade in here boys & hirls!

[MDG]

I agree with Tod's idea.

1) Make a copy of them as they stand right now and place that copy into the general forum where are are "discussing" this right now.

2) The 'nailed' version then has all of the superfluous posts edited out leaving the pertinent photos in place. This way it remains a 'reference' source. Period. Only for reference.

3) the FIRST post in each nailed thread is edited to read: For futher discussions, comments, opinions and to ask questions please see the companion thread in the general discussion forum below. You are not asking people to learn brain surgery here; I think our membership will understand how to do this . . .

Then in future any new info and photos deemed worthy by the group can be copied over and placed in the 'nailed' thread by the moderator (only by the moderator).

If someone researching needs a specific reference they can go to the nailed thread to look it up withouth wading through an extra dozen pages of talk. This way, the nailed threads are like chapters in a book. Need info on front trunks? Go to that chapter and look it up; original wheel options? Go check it out . . .

If they cannot find what they are looking for or find they need clarification on a point, they click their mouse, jump down to the discussion and ask. OR if they have new info, maybe a new photo or 10 - they post it in the discussion forum. The moderator can then add this to the nailed forum if it is deemed suitable.

[MDG]

I also agree that I'd like to see the nailed posts be expanded to include even more areas of the car. This can turn into the ultimate source for FACTUAL 914 info. The people collecting and contributing this info aren't writers doing research on a new book idea they have been commissioned to do. This info has been - and will continue to be - based on the accumulated knowledge of hands on experience through decades of ownership by people with a true passion for these cars. The great, the good, the bad and the rusty.

[Tom_T]

I can see problems with having two threads - one nailed & "locked" and one regular & "open" but buried somewhere in the archives - where good information could get lost. Some folks with info to offer may not add a post if they can't find the proper thread or don't want to hunt it down, and those looking may miss needed info. with the duplicate format.

Also, we have to realize that it could be a huge workload for a Moderator to go find the choice posts worth moving to the nailed thread version of each of many nailed topics. That is a large task for a paid full time staff, not to mention guys doing it for fun & love of 914s in their spare time!

After all, it's a volunteer effort as Mod, and not a full time commitment - so a lot of info would be dropped - not to mention Moderators dropping out! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

While a lot of things would be "nice" and "easier" on here - I think we need to be realistic that this is a public forum/bulletin board format with hobbyists & volunteers - and not paid professionals running an auto magazine/publishing website.

As such, sometimes you just have to put up with a little disorder and extra "fluff" in the individual postings & topics overall.

My 3 cents worth..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[tod914]

If the discussion link is posted on top of the nailed thread, it won't get lost. It can be very easily referenced, and further information can be added. With Mike on that, 100%. I don't think Andy and Mark want to give out admin rights to a dozen people, but maybe a couple of people could help out to cut down on the work load. If one topic is done per month, shouldn't take too long to do. People can also go back and self edit their posts too. Just a suggestion (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Not sure how else this can be approached.

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

Yes, I continue to (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead horse.gif)

Photos that don't belong, an inordinate amount of repetitive "quoting" that hampers quick, concise retrieval of information, and discussion that just isn't relevant to the specific area being focused on, all burden the "nailed" threads in their ability to be a useful source of precise, focused, informative, and OEM library of 914 material.

There are , what?, 17 #%@*& on wheels & tires. We ought to be able to show excellent, clear photos of the handful of wheels that the 914 was equipped with on two pages. One or two posts should define the very few tire sizes that were original to the car. If we feel a discussion is warranted about the fitment of later tire choices (and I believe it is necessary) it should be a separate thread and not have the implication that the fitment of, say, a 185/70 is an acceptable substitute for a 155 X 15 (my personal feeling here re:155s.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif) ).

Attached is just a small sample of what is on the nailed threads, and shouldn't be.....

[Pat Garvey]

Yes, I continue to (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead horse.gif)

Photos that don't belong, an inordinate amount of repetitive "quoting" that hampers quick, concise retrieval of information, and discussion that just isn't relevant to the specific area being focused on, all burden the "nailed" threads in their ability to be a useful source of precise, focused, informative, and OEM library of 914 material.

There are , what?, 17 #%@*& on wheels & tires. We ought to be able to show excellent, clear photos of the handful of wheels that the 914 was equipped with on two pages. One or two posts should define the very few tire sizes that were original to the car. If we feel a discussion is warranted about the fitment of later tire choices (and I believe it is necessary) it should be a separate thread and not have the implication that the fitment of, say, a 185/70 is an acceptable substitute for a 155 X 15 (my personal feeling here re:155s.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif) ).

Attached is just a small sample of what is on the nailed threads, and shouldn't be.....

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blowup.gif)
I repeat my offer to turn pver moderation of this forum to you, so you can clean it up. Too many hours required for me, unless a system can be come up with so other's feelings are not hurt (which, in turn, wouls arouse wrath on ME). I'm done with being the bad guy, and am not running for poilitical office!

Give me a system, where everyone is happy, and I'll try it.

[Tom_T]

Attached is just a small sample of what is on the nailed threads, and shouldn't be.....

Paul - I do think that the current options for new tires of original fitment are appropriate in the nailed thread - no need to make folks look further, since we're talking about a resource for current restorations & preservation.

Also, the 185/70VR15 Michelin XWX was indeed a Porsche factory option available new on our 914s - both /4 & -6 - so IMHO it is appropriate to be in there nailed as well (Bowlsby's site options page lists it & IIRC the factory option M-code was included at my post on tire sizes).

I personally knew a guy when I was in college who ordered his `73 914-2.0 with those tires new from the factory, along with his 99 customer match or 98 special Porsche color paint & Beige interior combo (don't recall which his color metallic blue was - but a freaking beautiful 914!).

I'll try to get some time to go into the nailed topics & clean-up my threads, as I see that the crappy bent up bumper there is mine, so I'm as guilty as anyone! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

BTW - I do now have a nice shiny freshly restored & rechromed rear bumper, but the hunt goes on for a 73-75 front! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Pat - if you see any of my post-edited ones in the near future with just plain ole nuttin but "EDIT" or "PLEASE REMOVE" etc., then feel free to delete it completely with no hard feelings Pal! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Tom_T]

OK Pat, 3 hours later I've gone through all of my posts in the various O&H nailed threads & marked those which an Admin/Mod can remove completely as: "EDITED - DELETE" and trimmed down a few others with editing.

However, I did leave in posts dealing with clarifications on the topic at hand, adding information to the subject (e.g.: factory spec docs., etc.), and sources for current replacement tires, & Concours acceptance, etc. Paul & some others probably still won't be satisfied with that.

I feel that these nailed threads should not only give information on what WAS original 35-40 years ago, but also about what IS accepted now & how to get there or as close as possible TODAY with available tires, finishes, etc.

Now that SirAndy has increased the size of pix we can post, while I was doing the editing out, I also went in at nailed "The few, the rare..." topic & added the pix of my buddy Jerry's mostly original 71 914/4, with notes on where things are changed from strictly factory original, as you'd asked me to a long time ago (last year).

If you or anyone else sees any other changes from original which I may have omitted, just send me a PM about it/them, and I'll add it or clarify for you by PM - so as to not clutter up that topic any more than necessary.

Pat - a thought - maybe the best idea would be to just ask others to do what I did, and edit out their chit-chat & superfluous posts themselves, which then you or an Admin can delete completely. AFAIK the original poster cannot completely delete their own posts, otherwise I would've done that for you as well.

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

What I don't understand is why we (the O&H guys) have to make it so difficult for both seasoned, long term forum members and (especially) "newbies" who have just come aboard and are looking for how their particular 914s should look to return them to OEM configuration. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Pretend with me here for a minute......say you just bought a nice, but modestly modified 1972 914/4 and you want to know what you need to change/fix/replace to make it look original. Where are you going to look? Multiple "Nailed" threads that may or may not have the information (especially photos) that pertain to your specific model year? Frustration may very well set in after scrolling through multiple pages of just one thread and not finding what you need to know. Now our information seeker needs to go to the next nailed thread and scroll through another series of pages, hoping to find information in that thread.
And on, and on, and....

And then there is the very good"The few, the rare.." thread, but do our forum members even think to look there? And if they do, once again, scroll, scroll, scroll, with no guarantee that this thread will have the info that they are seeking.

Why is it so hard to have the nailed threads comprised of specific model years, consisting of photos and concise information with regard to that specific area displayed in the photos. A format that I have tried to illustrate with my recent 1970 "inspection" of my own car is the type of thread which I believe would serve the purpose of this O&H Forum best.

The very recent post by Tom with regards to the 1971/4, and the numerous photos of Pats' extremely original '72/4 could both be excellent starting points for their respective model years.

..........just sayin'.

Paul

[Tom_T]

Paul,

There is no reason why they couldn't be organized by MY, but then you've just culled each of the current nailed threads' topics into one per MY list that the person needs to scroll, scroll, scroll through to find say: bumpers, or whatever.

They're still scrolling through a ton of info per MY or per Area of the car/systems. Both have pros & cons, & both will be unwieldy as the data base grows for each sub-heading or topic of nailed threads.

If they're organized by MY, then you see everything on hand at that time for a particular MY - and some of that is repetitive (i.e.: some items apply to more than one MY), but you get no sense of what happened historically in the development of the 914s over time by component or system across MYs - such as bumpers, and how to identify if your 75 has backdated bumpers, for instance.

Whereas as currently organized by component of the car across all MYs you do get that sense, but then have to visit several topics for everything on your particular MY 914.

In my case for example, it was critical to ascertain that EVERYTHING option/group-wise was included on ALL USA early 914-2.0s marketed here as "914Ss" - which I wouldn't have necessarily gotten out of a 73 MY only nailed topic (but maybe it could have).

I don't know who started organizing, but I suspect they did it the way their brain thinks & works, so now there is a huge body of work organized with one filing system, and you want it under a different filing system. Neither is wrong or right, better or worse IMHO - but it is what we have to date to work with, and will take a huge effort to reorganize things - in addition to culling out the chit-chatty posts like I spent several hours last night doing for mine (maybe I'm just a bigger offender).

I just don't think it's all practical in a volunteer effort like this. JMHO! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

[Pat Garvey]

Still taking this all in.

We'll see who has the right "plan".

So...I'm watching, waiting & not commenting, unless I have a more brilliant idea.

[dlkawashima]

I don't know if this is even possible but can we have subtopics off a main topic? I used my mad photoshop skillz to help show what I mean.

[Pat Garvey]

I don't know if this is even possible but can we have subtopics off a main topic? I used my mad photoshop skillz to help show what I mean.

Hmmmm.

Kinda like this idea. Some would wish to expand to other areas too. Could just work. Lotsa work, but I like.

[tod914]

Great idea Dave. Might as well do that for "the few" too. Subcats. with the owner's name maybe?

[Tom_T]

Great idea Dave. Might as well do that for "the few" too. Subcats. with the owner's name maybe?

Year & Model & Engine would be most important at "The few...." sub-cats
- owners name maybe in the "B" part of the title?