All of this and I still can't shift into first., Pemisssion to shoot myself, sir! Options

[r3dplanet]

If it it were possible to strangle myself I would have done it.

Over the past couple of months I've been trying to put my car back together. It came to me a long-term project but its slowly turning into something great.

Over the past week I've been driving it around and its really getting close now.

Except for the part where it's merciless to shift. Specifically, its a little hard to shift into just about any gear (enough to create a blister after one day of around town driving). But the main problem is that I can't get it to shift into first gear unless I nudge the car in another gear prior. For example, coming to a stop in second and shifting into first when the car has almost zero speed. Sometimes at a stop light I can shift into reverse or second and then into first, but this only works 50% of the time. Plus, I'm nervous as hell about keeping my foot on the clutch at red lights because I imagine the clutch cable snapping right then and there.

This is what I've done in the Great Do-Over of The Past Year as far as related work goes:

(1) A Dr. Evil transmission rebuild clinic + bonus ring gear reversal after the fact.
(2) A full Jwest Engineering linkage replacement including the linkage at shift console along with new bushings, u-joints, and what-not. All of this seems very smooth to me.
(3) a Rennshift sport shifter
(4) new engine mounts
(5) new transmission mounts from Wevo
(6) new clutch cable
(7) proper clutch adjust. Free play at the pedal a bit over an inch before it begins to engage.

The clutch tube seems intact. When the girlfriend pushes the clutch pedal the tube doesn't move. It's a little crappy looking at the body but it certainly seems to be intact.

I'm not sure if its the clutch itself. I doesn't slip out of gear and it pulls really well once in gear. No scorched potholder smell.

I've been all over the place with shifter adjustment. I'm pretty happy with the adjustment in that I can adjust it too far forward or aft, and it seems to be happy where it is. Reverse and fifth are the easiest gears to get in to. Apologies for ending the previous sentence with a preposition.

One other thing, the hotter the car and the day become, the harder it is to shift into any particular gear. Fourth gear becomes the hardest after first.

I've searched around in the forums but it seems like I've already done what I'm supposed to do in comparing my case to others. Maybe my car demands further sacrifice of some sort.

I'm all f-ing ears if anyone has some solid ideas for me. The car is staying put until I can crack this.

Thanks,
Marcus

[underthetire]

Honestly, it sure sounds like your clutch cable is too loose. I'm no expert, but it helped a bunch on my car.

[r3dplanet]

Too loose? Unless I'm unsure what you mean, I don't think that the clutch cable will adjust much further out. The clutch already engages pretty rapidly from the top of the pedal.

But you're right in that it feels like if I had more to pull it would be easier to shift. I just don't think there's any left to tighten.

How was your situation?

Honestly, it sure sounds like your clutch cable is too loose. I'm no expert, but it helped a bunch on my car.

[rwilner]

When you rebuilt the trans, did you use the 2nd-5th dog gear on first?

[rwilner]

also, what trans fluid did you put in the box? if you still have the bottles, post a pic of the label.

[rhodyguy]

have you cleaned the underside of the shifter? the springs get loaded with crap and will restrict the action of the Reverse Lock Out Plate. inspect the shift lever for excessive wear at the the RLOP contact point. check out the RLOP too. the edge that presses against the lever should be nice and straight with 0 signs of a wear curve.

ensure you have the cable clevis @ the pedal connection set to the correct distance. illustrated on pgs 70/71 section 5 of your haynes.

k

[crash914]

cable could be wrapped around fuel lines...

[McMark]

I've seen shift linkages that hit the engine mount bar and caused trouble shifting into certain gears. Check the basics first, then look deeper if you don't find the problem.

[edwin]

Can you select first with the engine off?
Good way to check if the clutch is tight enough is to put in first and hold clutch in while cranking. If it is much slower to crank over than if it were in neutral with no clutch then you probably have the cable too loose.
I had trouble with selecting first and reverse was sometimes a bit clunky and it turned out to be the clutch tube wandering inside the tunnel as well as the firewall. Pain to fix but great result.
Cheers
Edwin

[Cap'n Krusty]

cable could be wrapped around fuel lines...

Not likely, they're 3" apart.

The Cap'n

[Richard Casto]

About to go mow the grass, so this is a quick reply...

1. I think everyone is asking about clutch disengagement as you are reporting problems in all gears. One cause of that is power still going through the transmission as you try to shift.

2. It would be good to get a list of what was done at the transmission clinic. I also would be curious to hear regarding the 1st gear synchro hub (rebuilt using a used 2nd-5th part?)

3. As Rich mentions above. What oil are you using. Particularly "slick" lubricants result in shifting issues. Porsche synchro design requires some friction to work. This is one reason that synthetics are NOT recommended regardless of those who say they use synthetics with no problems.

4. It may be difficult to say unless you have been able to compare to another 914 transmission, but what level of effort is required if you shift it manually through the gears directly at the shift console?

Richard

[Dr Evil]

Does it grind going into reverse? If yes, the cable is too loose.

If no, I still think you need to check this. You likely need to put a spacer on the threaded end so you can tighten further. It is often that cables have not enough thread to tighten.

I have a whole article with graphics on how to trouble shoot this, but the link in my sig is no longer working. PM me your email and I will send it to you.

[Dr Evil]

I have just discovered that I can load the PDF here.

[r3dplanet]

All -

I'm stoked about the fabulous responses. Thanks a million.

Here are some answers to your great questions:

1. Reverse is easy to get into. It does not grind at all. In fact, its the easiest gear of all.
2. I double checked to make sure that the clutch cable and the throttle cable are not binding.
3. The oil I'm using is Castrol 80-90W GL-5, exactly what is says in the manual and right in line with what Dr. Evil suggests in terms of straight up dino oil instead of synthetic. I added it just a couple of weeks ago.
4. As for the 2nd and 5th cogs, I honestly can't remember. It was over a year ago in Tacoma and I had a steep fever during the session. What I do remember is that the Dr. asked why I even brought it in to rebuild because it looked really good inside. We changed one part for the hell of it.
5. Edwin - with the first gear selected and my foot on the clutch pedal fully depressed, the starter sounds just like it always does - zippy and happy.
6. General note: with the car in the air, its much easier to shift into the gears.


Here are some photos of what the clutch position looks like at rest and then fully depressed:
(I promise the car is cleaner than this)

This is the clutch at free play:



And this is the clutch fully depressed:




I've also made another discovery:

At the shift console, I've noted that when I have reverse, second, or fourth gear selected the T-joint where the rear shift bushing attaches smacks right into the bracket. Like it wants to go another few mm. Even so, reverse, 2nd, and 4th gear seem solid once selected. Seen in this photo:



The converse is that when first, third and fifth are selected there's a 1/4" gap when fully engaged:



I'm going back out right now to disconnect the linkage and see how easy it is to select gears right at the console. WIll report back shortly.

-marcus

[r3dplanet]

Super awesome. But I can't download it. It keeps failing at different points in transit. I'll pm you with my real e-mail address.

I have just discovered that I can load the PDF here.

[Dr Evil]

Sent to you.

With what you describe, the non-stock shift setup you have there is causing you issues as it is not aligned correctly. If you could move the shift point 1/8" all your problems would go away as both sides would engage at the stops rather than hitting the stop on one side (R/2/4) and leaving a gap on the other (1/3/5). Since this is non-stock, it is a bit hard for me to be exact on how to do this without having hands on, but if you get the concept, you can fix this.

Are your roll pins in your shifter console rod (the one that goes into the case) tight with no play?

The only idea I have to fix this is to move the stops back about 1/8".

[r3dplanet]

I see what you're thinking. The good news is the roll pin seems quite secure.

I took the day to sort pull everything apart and put it back together. The shifting works well enough at the console without the linkage connected. I took the shifter apart, cleaned it, re-lubed it, and put it back together.

After a do-over today it still shifts exactly the same except for the part where 4th is easier to get into because of the stupid seat belt bolt. I've examined that before but it still bound up a little. Added a washer, and no more binding in 4th

That part that I'm confused by is that if the bracket were keeping 1/3/5 from fully engaging, one would think that this side (the forward side) would be where there's a lack of free space. But it has a good 1/4". It makes more sense for r/2/4 to not fully engage because that's where there's no gap. Unless not having enough free spaced on the aft (1/3/5) side of the bracket is keeping me from getting a perfectly centered adjustment.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

Sent to you.

With what you describe, the non-stock shift setup you have there is causing you issues as it is not aligned correctly. If you could move the shift point 1/8" all your problems would go away as both sides would engage at the stops rather than hitting the stop on one side (R/2/4) and leaving a gap on the other (1/3/5). Since this is non-stock, it is a bit hard for me to be exact on how to do this without having hands on, but if you get the concept, you can fix this.

Are your roll pins in your shifter console rod (the one that goes into the case) tight with no play?

The only idea I have to fix this is to move the stops back about 1/8".

[rwilner]

Dumb question as I am sure you thought of this, but are the set screw stops on your rennshifter backed off fully?

If it were me troubleshooting, I'd start eliminating things. If you still have your stock shifter, pop it back in. If the gear engagement feels the same then it's likely the linkage or the clutch since you said the gears engage easily at the box.

[r3dplanet]

Good thinking. The stop screws are all backed off. But I'll go see if I can find the stock shifter and see what happens.

Dumb question as I am sure you thought of this, but are the set screw stops on your rennshifter backed off fully?

If it were me troubleshooting, I'd start eliminating things. If you still have your stock shifter, pop it back in. If the gear engagement feels the same then it's likely the linkage or the clutch since you said the gears engage easily at the box.

[r3dplanet]

Okay. I popped the original shifter back into place. It was certainly much easier and I think it's because it has a bit more leverage than the Rennshifter.

Notes:

With the stock shifter in place, its still hard to get into first, but not as hard. When shifting into first there's a bit of free travel and then a tight, bound up resistance and if it can get past that then it will slip all the way into first. Normally you can shift up until it gets hard but it never makes it past that hump. Does that make sense?

I adjusted the clutch further in but I'm afraid to adjust it any further. It already feels pretty tight now. Can some explain or post where the shifter lever on the gearbox ought to be when its fully engaged?

Otherwise, I'm noticing very minor resistance in the other gears also. Like there's a little bit of tightness before it drops into gear fully. Its far less pronounced with the stock shifter but its still there. I think that its first gear where you really notice. Now I think that it might be a system-wide issue instead of just first gear.

Clutch? Is there some way to measure or know without dropping the gearbox?

I don't think that the Rennshifter is the problem. Instead, I'm coming to the idea that the Rennshifter simply amplifies the issues because of trouble elsewhere. So I think the Rennshifter is alright. While its easier to get into gear, its clear that its just a leverage issue. The stock shifter is quite vague. But hey, I was able to zip around my neighborhood and really enjoy the car for perhaps the first time. In 3-4 years, I might have run through one tank of gas.

-marcus

Dumb question as I am sure you thought of this, but are the set screw stops on your rennshifter backed off fully?

If it were me troubleshooting, I'd start eliminating things. If you still have your stock shifter, pop it back in. If the gear engagement feels the same then it's likely the linkage or the clutch since you said the gears engage easily at the box.