Poll F/S by Lurkers Options

[914itis]

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=201098

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=147916

[Tom_T]

Hey Paul & others,

I initially made the same mistake thinking that "Lurkers" were not members on here, but was corrected by Gint or one of the other admins.

In fact Lurkers are members who have not posted a reply or topic anywhere yet. They can have posted a gazillion FF ads in cars, parts, etc. (maybe under member vendors too) - and none count toward getting them off of the Lurker tag.

Most Lurkers & many members do not know this, & so don't go post an intro topic in the Garage.

IMHO the tag "Lurker" is misleading, and a poll to pick a better name would be more appropriate, than trying to penalize a new person on this website. I understand that Andy & the admins wanted to distinguish between members who contribute by posting in the other forums, but some who post there don't contribute per se in many cases anyway,

IMHO offering parts, products, cars, etc. is a contribution too, to those in need of them! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

How about "No Post Newbie" or "Raw Newbie" or something less nefarious than "Lurker"? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Spoke]

I routinely will not buy from any "low post count" seller. That's my decision.

There are some guys who "find" a 914 stash somewhere and just want to get rid of the stuff. They need to have an outlet to do so. As the old saying goes, buyer beware.

[JRust]

Yeah it can be annoying when people who have no intention of being a member. Are only registering to sell parts. Problem is adding an arbitrary number just encourages those people to post nonsense to get to their count. I think it really just needs to be a buyer beware. I personally tend to not buy from someone with a 0 post count. I'd rather support the guys on the site who sell stuff to fund other 914 stuff. Or have just built up extra parts while building their 914. There are some of these guys who are members but just don't like the internet much. So they come on to see whats going on but really don't reply to threads. I think it is all on the buyer. I would love to see a max post in the For sale threads. Like you can't have more than 3 on the page at a time. Encourage people to post multiple items in one thread instead of individual threads for each thing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[Tom_T]

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=201098

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=147916

Okay, I looked at these links above in more detail, & had read them when they first came out.

These two links reference topics & member post threads about problems with specific members - Lurkers or otherwise - who have been bad & less than upfront with their dealings.

This problem is not limited to only new non-forum-posting members (Lurkers), but also includes a few longer term members with more "official topic post counts" & higher tag ratings - even some well over 50 posts.

It really is a matter of reporting & policing problems with sellers &/or member vendors who don't perform as promised, misrepresent items, etc., and allow those posts & topics to remain & get worked out, or serve as a warning to others - without getting closed down, which only serves to help & protect the offending seller/vendor.

Unfortunately in some cases, those who complain about problems with long term & better known members who are sellers &/or member vendors, get shut down & silenced by the masses by overwhelming posts attacking or contradicting the person with a problem &/or closed by the admins.

Listen - anyone can make mistakes, not fulfill their obligations business-wise, blow-off &/or piss-off customers from here, & we shouldn't suppose that the long term folks nor anyone else selling is always perfect or right.

So we all should really not be so ready to enforce group protectionism when this happens, and allow those folks with seller/vendor problems to voice their concerns & problems on here - of course after &/or in conjunction with trying to work it out by PM, email, phone, etc. with the problem person.

I'm not saying to post problems in topic threads as the first or only step - folks should try directly with the seller/vendor off line, but certainly as a part of a follow-up or part of the process to seek resolution.

And folks on this board shouldn't assume that the complaining party hasn't done something privately yet when they do post in a topic, but guide & confirm that they try to do so - rather than blasting them with those "...well I've never had a problem with 'x'....!" - since that helps neither the party to resolve the problem.

Okay - off my IMHO soap box now... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[SirAndy]

I routinely will not buy from any "low post count" seller. That's my decision.

There are some guys who "find" a 914 stash somewhere and just want to get rid of the stuff. They need to have an outlet to do so. As the old saying goes, buyer beware.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

There are the "flyby" sellers who just want to get rid of a car or some parts and move on.
Then there are the "anti social" sellers who are just not into the whole online forum messaging thing.

There are plenty of reasons why we should allow people to sell their parts and services who otherwise do not participate in the site.

For example, Roger Sheridan has only posted maybe 3 times here but i have no problem what-so-ever with him offering his services and parts here.
He's a good guy. I would hate to see the good guys leave because we have some minimum post count rule.

On the other hand, if you don't know a seller and they have a low post count, you *should* be careful.
Ask around. Talk to them. Listen to your gut ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[Tom_T]

I routinely will not buy from any "low post count" seller. That's my decision.

There are some guys who "find" a 914 stash somewhere and just want to get rid of the stuff. They need to have an outlet to do so. As the old saying goes, buyer beware.

Or a person who is selling a family car who won't/can't keep it, so sees no reason to post, & those with more limited internet access & skills/experience.

There was that nice Marathon Blue "grandpa's 73 914-2.0" that recently sold to Germany for $20k, where the estate required it to be sold. That guy was a "Lurker" & seemed honest & straight forward too.

So let each exercise due caution as you did, and allow them to come here to post FS - rather than evil-bay, which is an even bigger blind risk. I usually will try out a vendor first, before buying any big ticket or multiple items from them.

And Spoke, I won't even go into what a rough season our Stillers had, what with injuries, close losses, etc.! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

[Tom_T]

I routinely will not buy from any "low post count" seller. That's my decision.

There are some guys who "find" a 914 stash somewhere and just want to get rid of the stuff. They need to have an outlet to do so. As the old saying goes, buyer beware.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

There are the "flyby" sellers who just want to get rid of a car or some parts and move on.
Then there are the "anti social" sellers who are just not into the whole online forum messaging thing.

There are plenty of reasons why we should allow people to sell their parts and services who otherwise do not participate in the site.

For example, Roger Sheridan has only posted maybe 3 times here but i have no problem what-so-ever with him offering his services and parts here.
He's a good guy. I would hate to see the good guys leave because we have some minimum post count rule.

On the other hand, if you don't know a seller and they have a low post count, you *should* be careful.
Ask around. Talk to them. Listen to your gut ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Great advice Andy!

[Rand]

I initially made the same mistake thinking that "Lurkers" were not members on here...
In fact Lurkers are members who have not posted a reply or topic anywhere yet.

I think that speaks to Paul's point exactly. If someone hasn't contributed anything at all to the garage or anywhere else on the forum, then they are not part of this community. They are only here to sell there warez, and they haven't built any foundation of trust among us yet.

In most cases, the people who end up being slimeball sellers are those who haven't been part of the community. Forcing people to be a part of the community first builds inherent accountability and weeds out the highest risk rip-off types.

[sfrenck]

Buyer beware. I think the community gets good deals from the occasional lurker selling parts and that shouldn't be taken away from us. What's the difference between a lurker selling a part and buying something from a guy you've never met before in a parking space at Hershey?

No paypal is the online deal breaker for me.

By all means, if you get screwed by someone post and let us know.

[Dr Evil]

Just because many douche bags are lurkers does not mean that all lurkers are douche bags.

[billh1963]

I have bought from zero post people a couple of times. Only one transaction was dicey...that was with porscheparent from a year ago Porscheparent parts thread

I was lucky...I think others may not have been so lucky!

I will continue to buy; albeit, with caution!

[jsayre914]

I will be responsible with my own money, I would much rather purchase stuff here, and have lurkers be able to list the stuff, than combing ebay and other websites looking for it.

All are welcome, be careful.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Spoke]

And Spoke, I won't even go into what a rough season our Stillers had, what with injuries, close losses, etc.! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Arrg!

You had to bring up the Steelers. I went to the Chargers and Bengals games - both losses. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)


Back to the topic: I did buy a $40 part from a lurker with 0 posts once. It looked like a good deal so I "interviewed" him through PMs. Turns out he found parts in grampa's garage and was just selling off the parts. Was a nice guy and the sale went well.

[Mark Henry]

Just because many douche bags are lurkers does not mean that all lurkers are douche bags.

Is that a ying/yang thang?

Scammers wreck my chi bro!

[houdan914]

Yeah it can be annoying when people who have no intention of being a member. Are only registering to sell parts. Problem is adding an arbitrary number just encourages those people to post nonsense to get to their count. I think it really just needs to be a buyer beware. I personally tend to not buy from someone with a 0 post count. I'd rather support the guys on the site who sell stuff to fund other 914 stuff. Or have just built up extra parts while building their 914. There are some of these guys who are members but just don't like the internet much. So they come on to see whats going on but really don't reply to threads. I think it is all on the buyer. I would love to see a max post in the For sale threads. Like you can't have more than 3 on the page at a time. Encourage people to post multiple items in one thread instead of individual threads for each thing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Maybe I'm missing the obvious, but I would think this site is for information that we can all benefit from. Who really cares if you have been a member for 10 years or 10 minutes.

There are many very smart owners out there who may be new to the 914 ownership club. Could be others who don't own one but sincerely want to help themselves by helping others.

That's not a bad thing from my perspective. Any other way and we are a bunch of judgmental premadonnas.

It's already looking like this site is growing into a place the people administrating this are judging content and making personal judgements on what can or cannot be said.

Feels like 5th grade girls club sometimes. Maybe they are just that much smarter... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)

Sorry....no offense intended.

[DBCooper]

If you notice the list of people online at any given time there are a LOT of names of people who you haven't seen post. Sometimes it isn't obvious, but there are a lot of knowledgeable people here, and a lot of people with a really low tolerance for BS. That combination can be intimidating for a lot of new people, who will watch and learn for a long time before they post.... or never post at all. Doesn't mean they aren't part of the community, just that they're quiet about it. I'd hate to think someone who is really interested in the cars isn't allowed to buy or sell just because he's been shy.

[SirAndy]

It's already looking like this site is growing into a place the people administrating this are judging content and making personal judgements on what can or cannot be said.

You try herding several hundred rabid cats for more than 10 years and then we'll talk ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[Mark Henry]

It's already looking like this site is growing into a place the people administrating this are judging content and making personal judgements on what can or cannot be said.

You try herding several hundred rabid cats for more than 10 years and then we'll talk ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Hey!!...I resemble that remark (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Meow.

[Dr Evil]

It's already looking like this site is growing into a place the people administrating this are judging content and making personal judgements on what can or cannot be said.

You try herding several hundred rabid cats for more than 10 years and then we'll talk ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Hey!!...I resemble that remark (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Meow.

I have not been too bad for quite some time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)