'73 Resto & Suby 6 Conversion, or a primer on "How to convert your 914 to a Subaru 3.0" Options

[Runman07]

I would look into an act clutch and pressure plate, they make awesome clutches

[messix]

It looks like the engine is rubber mounted and the tranny is not.... is that correct?

that will be trouble, both need to be mounted solid or isolated mounts, not mix and match.

[Runman07]

The Trans is on a mount. Its the black thing underneath the rear of the trans

[Chris H.]

I think Troy's point is the fact that one end of the cradle might have a soft mount and one end might be directly bolted to the chassis. Keep in mind we also have engine mounts in the middle attached to the engine.

Kent what are you doing for cradle mounts? Front, back, or both? I'm actually worried about the opposite. I have 911 mounts at the front and rear as well as the stock mounts on the engine. Might be too soft. If so I can remove the front cradle mounts I guess.

[76-914]

I think Troy's point is the fact that one end of the cradle might have a soft mount and one end might be directly bolted to the chassis. Keep in mind we also have engine mounts in the middle attached to the engine.

Kent what are you doing for cradle mounts? Front, back, or both? I'm actually worried about the opposite. I have 911 mounts at the front and rear as well as the stock mounts on the engine. Might be too soft. If so I can remove the front cradle mounts I guess.

I'm running front and rear factory rubber mounts in their original position i.e. the bottom of the engine and tranny. I don't know why your cradle has those front extensions unless Ian discovered a weakness in that design or maybe it's a material difference. They certainly won't hurt anything. I used 4130 1.5" .095"wall which I felt was substantial. My motor mount receivers are different from his also so he may have transferred some of that load to those front mounts. Time will tell. Maybe mine will fall off someday. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Chris, does your clutch disc have 4 lg springs only or 4 lg spg's with small spgs inside the lg ones for a total of 8?

[Chris H.]

Chris, does your clutch disc have 4 lg springs only or 4 lg spg's with small spgs inside the lg ones for a total of 8?

I'm sure your mount is fine. Ian designed his mount so it could be used with any Subie engine...maybe that's why it's different. Fits great I must say.

I don't know on the clutch...already installed it about 3 months ago. It's a different kit than yours with a thicker pressure plate. I'm not gonna worry about it though...if it rattles I'll buy one from Subaru I guess. Seems like the worst that could happen is the disk gets chewed up. If I happen to separate the engine and trans anytime soon I'll check for you.

Edit:

This is the kit I bought. If you look REALLY close you can see 2 sets of springs for a total of 8...whew! Good news there. Gripforce on e-bay seems like a good outfit.

Clutch kit

[Zaney]

Everything looks great and very familiar!

A little bird dropped me a question about this time in my build regarding the trans mount clearance. If this part of the cradle is not the lowest point then, disregard my nosiness.

Feel free to ask about any details that were not listed in any of the Suby builds here, especially Strawman! Geoff is very helpful!

Cheers!

Nate (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

[76-914]

Chris, does your clutch disc have 4 lg springs only or 4 lg spg's with small spgs inside the lg ones for a total of 8?

I'm sure your mount is fine. Ian designed his mount so it could be used with any Subie engine...maybe that's why it's different. Fits great I must say.

I don't know on the clutch...already installed it about 3 months ago. It's a different kit than yours with a thicker pressure plate. I'm not gonna worry about it though...if it rattles I'll buy one from Subaru I guess. Seems like the worst that could happen is the disk gets chewed up. If I happen to separate the engine and trans anytime soon I'll check for you.

Edit:

This is the kit I bought. If you look REALLY close you can see 2 sets of springs for a total of 8...whew! Good news there. Gripforce on e-bay seems like a good outfit.

Clutch kit

I finally quit obsessing over it and took your advice. Ordered a KB03 this AM. I'll let you know when it gets here. BTW, all those chatter posts are on AWD systems. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

Everything looks great and very familiar!

A little bird dropped me a question about this time in my build regarding the trans mount clearance. If this part of the cradle is not the lowest point then, disregard my nosiness.

Feel free to ask about any details that were not listed in any of the Suby builds here, especially Strawman! Geoff is very helpful!

Cheers!

Nate (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

Nate, I think I can speak for Chris (and others) as well when I say thanks to you, Geoff, Bob and et al for looking over our projects. We need all the help we can get. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) I'm confused though. Were you pointing out that my cradle needs to attached to the firewall also or that I run the risk of tearing my trans mount off? As things sit presently, my oil pan is about 1.5" lower than the cradle. I may have to attach a skid plate to the cradle to rectify but that will be addressed later.

[Chris H.]

Kent, on the clutches I think the issue was definitely related to 4WD HARD DRIVING and also some cheap kits that were probably not supposed to be used with a Subie. EXEDY makes clutches for other cars and they might just need 4 springs.

Definitely appreciate all the help from everyone. Every time I need an answer from certain Subaru sites I am reminded of how genuinely helpful this community is. I would not be able to do my swap without you guys.

Nate, your trans mounts are thicker at the top than mine, which would solve my clearance problem. Thanks for the example. I will shim them for now but will probably weld some more steel on the top of the plate to lower the cradle a bit (winter project).

[Zaney]

Chris, does your clutch disc have 4 lg springs only or 4 lg spg's with small spgs inside the lg ones for a total of 8?

I'm sure your mount is fine. Ian designed his mount so it could be used with any Subie engine...maybe that's why it's different. Fits great I must say.

I don't know on the clutch...already installed it about 3 months ago. It's a different kit than yours with a thicker pressure plate. I'm not gonna worry about it though...if it rattles I'll buy one from Subaru I guess. Seems like the worst that could happen is the disk gets chewed up. If I happen to separate the engine and trans anytime soon I'll check for you.

Edit:

This is the kit I bought. If you look REALLY close you can see 2 sets of springs for a total of 8...whew! Good news there. Gripforce on e-bay seems like a good outfit.

Clutch kit

I finally quit obsessing over it and took your advice. Ordered a KB03 this AM. I'll let you know when it gets here. BTW, all those chatter posts are on AWD systems. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

Everything looks great and very familiar!

A little bird dropped me a question about this time in my build regarding the trans mount clearance. If this part of the cradle is not the lowest point then, disregard my nosiness.

Feel free to ask about any details that were not listed in any of the Suby builds here, especially Strawman! Geoff is very helpful!

Cheers!

Nate (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)

Nate, I think I can speak for Chris (and others) as well when I say thanks to you, Geoff, Bob and et al for looking over our projects. We need all the help we can get. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) I'm confused though. Were you pointing out that my cradle needs to attached to the firewall also or that I run the risk of tearing my trans mount off? As things sit presently, my oil pan is about 1.5" lower than the cradle. I may have to attach a skid plate to the cradle to rectify but that will be addressed later.

If the cradle would take the scrape rather than tail mount then no worries. The way mine was situated the Suby mount would take the brunt of a blow. So, that is why I used the 911 mounts at the stock positions with the trans stubs mounts to the case itself.

Hope it clarifies my nosiness (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Looks great!
NAte

[76-914]

I installed the new clutch



and TO bearing. Must admit that "pull clutch thing" threw me a curve ball at first.



But before I slapped the drive train back into the car for another fit I did something I'd wanted to do since I began bouncing this cradle design around in my head. First I retired this contraption. They will be re-purposed in a welding station.



And did this. $24 worth of casters, scrap piece of DOM & 2" angle. It's a dream to move around the shop and no worries about tipping over, either.









But I saved the best part for last. Watch how fast and easy the install back into the car goes. After rolling the assm under the car (with the wheels on the car) I line up front left mount and place the floor jack under the cradle



Raise it 2" or until the wheel falls out






Then the bolt is slid back thru with a large washer to mate against the factory bracket and spread the load. BTW, both the bolt and washers are re-purposed from the old rear mounts. The nut with a smaller diameter fat washer are started from above but not tightened. One down



Repeat on the right side. Two down







Back to the tail and just like the sides it's jacked up 2" but after the wheel falls out the receiver is removed from the tranny and the rear mounts are fastened to the old rear receivers as shown in an earlier post here. After the rears mounts are tightened I go back and finish tightening the fronts.








And it's a good thing that I went with gas struts for the lids because this brace that contained the 2 torsion rods for the old truck lift ended up dead center of the TB throat. I'll grind 'em down later but that spot might get a trim anyway. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)





Plenty of clearance up front



This is the Carrot in Front of the "yours truly" Donkey. Just seeing it sitting there should keep me motivated. I believe the cradle is finished short of paint and a few weld tabs for the shifter or exhaust system.

[euro911]

Cool (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

There's no front cross member under the engine? The mounts being aft of the engine's centerline are adequate? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Chris H.]

See now you're just showing off...slow down Kent! I almost caught up! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

Looks great and it will be nice when you have to drop the engine. So easy.

[76-914]

Cool (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

There's no front cross member under the engine? The mounts being aft of the engine's centerline are adequate? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Adequate? Adequate! There's no adequate in 914's. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif) Actually your correct. No front cross member. When I pull the tranny I need to brace the front of the engine because it is totally front heavy w/o it. In it's factory configuration there is a support attached from top center of the tranny to the firewall.

[AfricanHijinx]

I love that mount

[76-914]

See now you're just showing off...slow down Kent! I almost caught up! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

Looks great and it will be nice when you have to drop the engine. So easy.

Oh I think you are ahead of me Chris. Anything that's gone quickly is a result of others previous endeavors, including you. Less research time=more build time. The roll around cradle makes it so fast and easy that I don't hesitate to R&R as needed. I think I have about $150.00 +/- $10 in materials including the wheels. Now if you add in the bender, tube notcher and bi metal hole saws your looking at about $350 to make one. There is no doubt that it is easier to buy one but none were available and this helped offset the cost of my welding equipment. Any of you locals are welcome to make the 2 bends necessary on my bender, should the bug bite you.

I love that mount

Thanks. One of my ideas actually worked. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[ruby914]

Kent,
I love the casters idea (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
When I get back to working on my car, I was going to look into a support attached from the tranny to the firewall. Maybe you can pave the way. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[jimkelly]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

[JStroud]

Nice engine cradle, the wheel setup is brilliant (IMG:style_emoticons/default/first.gif)

Definitely have to copy that design when I get ready to build mine.
You guys are way ahead of me....I'm still trying to get my shop done so I can get started.

Nice job Kent, keep the details coming. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Jeff

[76-914]

Kent,
I love the casters idea (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
When I get back to working on my car, I was going to look into a support attached from the tranny to the firewall. Maybe you can pave the way. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Sorry I'm late getting back with you guy's. Hey Mike (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif) , you do realize that you are one of the MAIN reasons I got into this. Not sure whether to (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif) you or (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grouphug.gif) you, yet. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) Just kidding. I did take a quick look at that and the first ? that came to mind is why? It is only about 2" aft of the engine mounts so it isn't to add support when the tranny is out?? Given the bolt thru it was horizontal I doubt it was for torsional control?? Was it there to spread the weight load? If it were attached to the trunk wall what reinforcements would be needed?? Your thoughts?

Nice engine cradle, the wheel setup is brilliant (IMG:style_emoticons/default/first.gif)

Definitely have to copy that design when I get ready to build mine.
You guys are way ahead of me....I'm still trying to get my shop done so I can get started.

Nice job Kent, keep the details coming. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Jeff

Hey thx Jeff. You might want to go .125" wall if you go DOM. BTW, that was one 10' piece of tube. I cut it a little close as I had 2.5" left over when finished! Next time I won't cut it as close as it took too much effort (you know, that double and triple checking your measurements (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) ). I could have used a little more cushion when constructing it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

So I better post something up so I don't have to call myself out on "The Slackers Thread". I really don't have (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif) to show as I have been trudging thru this maelstrom known as a wiring harness. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) There aren't enough joint's in the world to take the edge of this job. So I (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif) with it until I begin to feel my sanity slipping away then move onto something trivial. Or should I say something less demanding? Simple suits me well. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

So as a diversion I'm falling back to something else. This is one of those items. The slave (is that politically correct?) cylinder needed another 5/8" clearance so....
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welder.gif)





A flat panel would have made things a bit easier. This cover will need to be removeable to inspect/service the banjo fitting.





And as it turns out the starter needs a bit of room also. Even after I asked Bob which one would clear I still end up with a clearance issue. The good thing is if it takes a (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif) I won't have to worry about another one fitting if it happens in BFE. And before I get flamed for the elongated access remember that the engine/tranny combo is up and then slid forward, so it is necessary.



Rather than pontificate I'll just run some pic's past ya and you can use yer imagination or ask a question if ya have 'em.













This littl POS consumed 4 hr's of my day, after all was said and done. I couldn't be any slower if I tried. I had to go over it twice to fill any pin holes as I didn't want this piece rusting out soon.











After all that I ended up with this gap which I corrected with a tab welded in place. I'll show that in the next few days. It's primed, in place and already covered up as the trunk is converted back to the cat motel. Yea the little bastards sleep in the trunk but they do their business outside and whilst me neighbors have rodents we have none. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

So after a few more stints in the wiring asylum I soon found another item that required my attention (just don't make me go back to wireworld. BTW, I stole this idea from Bob (bigkat). I had laid out what I thought to be the correct location for the pump assembly then a little voice said better double check that so I went thru the threads and noticed that Bob had his centered a bit more than mine. I had fixated upon installing it upon a flat surface and almost ruined a good tank. After looking at Bob's install it occurred to me that the criteria was where the pick up is located! DUH (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chair.gif) This is why you will see one drawing imposed upon another. The piece of wood held in place by the cleco side clamps is there to position the compass upon. By looking straight down the filler neck w/ a plumb bob I established the location of the reservoirs rim. By sticking a tape inside the reservoir I determined the diameter. Rather than bisecting a segment in the circle to locate center I just split the compass and worked off the edge of the circle. Once I felt OK about my location it was just a matter of figuring the offset in the pump itself and flipping the pickup sock 180'. I'll need to build a step onto the base of the cover to accommodate the offset on the tanks surface but that's another day.











and the $$$ shot