#770 (912E) Project thread *Tangerine Cooling System installed!) Options

[Bulldog9]

Long drive from Pomona. even with a good running car. You were prob very relieved when you got to 512. Weird your car is eating brackets. I don't have any more of them.

Not sure either, I think the reason the lower broke this time is because the upper bracket came loose and caused the lower to crack? I found a lower one on ebay, but may explore some other options. I will head over to the Hangers and Machine shops this week and see what the metal shop can work up for me. They can fabricate almost anything, and have all kinds of high strength steel parts. Hmmm, maybe even repurpose a bracket or piece of metal off an AH64 or CH47. That would be cool ;-)

[Bulldog9]

Thanks for the kind words. I know that feeling I've spent the last 5-6 years looking over this and PP forums with others and have been blown away at peoples work. I'm a total newbie,and my work is passable for a hobbyist, but not professional. But I've done most all myself except for the pain and heads, and I'm happy!

Not sure what Porsche was thinking with the 912E but it makes sens to use the core 914 engine. They did use a different FI system and I think a few other changes but it is basically a low content 1976 911S with the reworked 914 motor.

Steve,

Regarding your 912 thread on the 914 board:

I have really enjoyed watching you restore your beautiful 912e. Like many of the 914 restoration threads here on the World, I am gobsmacked by the quality of your work, attention to detail, and of course the stunning result.

So I'm very happy that you took the time to start and post on your thread. If my reading of history is correct, that engine in your 912 was supposed to go into a 914 but the 914 program got killed so Porsche stamped out a couple thousand 912e's to use up the engines. So the 912e is kinda a rear engine 914???

So thank you for your thread.

[Bulldog9]

Pulled the fan shroud off today to do the R&R of the Upper ALT bracket bolt, looks like the threads stripped out of the aluminum which caused the bracket to come loose. I was able to find another bolt long enough to go all the way through the housing and I put a nut at the top. Sucker isn't coming off ever..... That should take care of the upper bracket which is I think the culprit both times. First time the original bracket bent and broke because it had nothing to bolt to at the lower end. On Stock 912E's the alt bracket runs in an arc from the fan housing down to where the header and muffler attach. Because I am using the Tangerine Exhaust this is eliminated. The bracket I got from Kevin (Rhody Guy) is off a 914 and is much sturdier.







I think I need a new Alternator Pulley, mine is eating the fanbelts super fast because of how pitied it was.

I think I also figured out the problem with the lower bracket. The square end on the carriage bolt is longer than the bracket, and when tightened would bottom out on the alternator and didn't pull the bracket tight to the alternator, just the bolt. This I think created stress on the bracket and movement of the alternator. I used a step drill and widened the hole enough to let the squared section of the bolt slide inside the hole and now the bracket is pulled tight to the alternator front and back. I also used a flat file to smooth the surface of the housing where the bracket bolts up.






Wasn't too bad only 3 hours to R&R the whole deal & go for a 120 mile drive. Would have gone farther but I forgot my wallet and almost ran out of gas lol. Put 465 miles on the tank of gas, most of it spirited driving. All seems good, but the breaking point has been about 1500 miles. I think I have it this time, with a new solid and bolted tight upper mount, smoothed lower bracket mounting area. Fingers Crossed.

Nice to see no leaks from the crank seal or oil pump, so it looks like my leak is the bottom engine seam.... Oh well, its only a drip here and there.


The Second Bracket, both breaking the same way in 3 pieces. Is this a common failure on these engines? The original was broken when I pulled the engine apart. I took extra care to make sure the brackets were lined up so the alternator moves freely across its range of motion so no binding or odd stressing of the brackets. I also have some of my Apache Mechanics making me a bracket out of some kind of steel they say wont break, but hopefully won't need it for a while.

[rhodyguy]

Nice fix! I have a pulley for you. Give me a call.

[Mueller]

How is she running?

Why the Dell 36's? How did you pick that size if you don't mind me asking?

[Bulldog9]

How is she running?

Why the Dell 36's? How did you pick that size if you don't mind me asking?

Car is running great.

I went with the Dell 36's because I got them for a great deal..... Dell 36's flow like Weber 40's, and are a good option for driveability, solid midrange performance in a 2056. They give up some ultimate HP/Dyno HP #'s to the 40's but not enough to make a difference unless you drive at redline all the time.

[rhodyguy]

Smooth on the bottom end. When Steve left my house, 0 carb racket and no drama.

[Mueller]

How is she running?

Why the Dell 36's? How did you pick that size if you don't mind me asking?

Car is running great.

I went with the Dell 36's because I got them for a great deal..... Dell 36's flow like Weber 40's, and are a good option for driveability, solid midrange performance in a 2056. They give up some ultimate HP/Dyno HP #'s to the 40's but not enough to make a difference unless you drive at redline all the time.

Thanks!

Your build has been somewhat inspirational for me.

Mike

[Bulldog9]

Smooth on the bottom end. When Steve left my house, 0 carb racket and no drama.

You still need to drive my car, would love to get some feedback.

[Bulldog9]

Thanks!

Your build has been somewhat inspirational for me.

Mike

Mike, it's funny. I look at my car and project and while I love how it turned out, I am like 'meh' is good (other than paint which is excellent) for a hobbyist project, could be better and is nothing like some of the projects I see here and in PP resto threads. So I appreciate the kudos. It's been a dumb stumble and shot in the dark through most of it, but God honors fools and fear has been burned out of me so I just went for it. I still want to finish the interior with new/better quality tan leather, just dont want to spend the $$........

[porschetub]

How is she running?

Why the Dell 36's? How did you pick that size if you don't mind me asking?

Car is running great.

I went with the Dell 36's because I got them for a great deal..... Dell 36's flow like Weber 40's, and are a good option for driveability, solid midrange performance in a 2056. They give up some ultimate HP/Dyno HP #'s to the 40's but not enough to make a difference unless you drive at redline all the time.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) too many go big thinking bigger is better ....funny thing is we don't drive a 5000 to 5500 rpm that much ,a good midrange power is very rewarding.

[Bulldog9]

8000 mile update.

Just turned 8000 miles on #770 rebuild and all is going well. Here are a few observations.

1. The 911 Chassis on the 912E is very comfortable, solid ride, and cruises beautifully and effortly at 75-80 mph. It only has a front roll bar so the real tight twisties give some body lean, but I really like the ride quality so I am leaving it alone. But I must say............... This is the first car (including my E36 M3) I can take through the turns as fast as I can take in my motorcycles, and it does it almost effortlessly. The balance is perfect, with a full tank I am 52/48, with 1/2 tank is 50/50. No idea what it is with a driver, but the car is just AMAZING...... The Rebel Racing suspension and Sachs shocks with stock torsion bars and sway bar is sweet. Supple, responsive, and solid as a rock.

2. The Motor is running perfectly. Starts right up, solid idle, pulls straight to redline, great midrange, and most importantly is docile, smooth and responsive when driven normally. Very little oil burning, maybe a quart every 2000 miles. Fuel mileage is averaging 26mpg, when just on highway/cruising/trip my wife and I got 33mpg, loaded with luggage two people and 70-75 mph highway.

3. When driving aggressively and returning from an off throttle situation, if I feather the gas it will go lean for a second or two, so I need to get deeper in the pedal. I may switch to larger accel jets in the future but this is the only driveability issue fixed by changing my driving style.

4. I didn't do a good job with the top and bottom case seals. The front and back and crank/cam plugs & seals are good, but my top and bottom seams weep a little oil, as do 1-2 of the cyls where they make with the case. It's not bad, and amounts to Very little drip, but the seams are wet with oil. Oh well.............

5. I've eaten 3 alt brackets and 5 belts...... I think I have the brackets straightened out, but need to swap out the alternator pulley, it is pitted and just eats away at the belts.

6. Air/oil temps. This may be a matter of TMI, but I track oil temp in 2 locations, the sump on the stock gauge, and post my external oil cooler with a PLX, and also the Cylinder Head Temps on a VDO. In normal driving, mix of hills and flats, and legal speeds the motor is spot on for oil and cyl head as far as temps. When driving aggressively, or in over 90 degrees outside, it is a tug of war between good head temps or good oil temps. If I drop down a gear, especially in the mountains and long hills, the Head temps are good, but the oil temps spike and get close to max. If I keep the revs down, higher gear, the oil temps stay low, but head temp spikes and gets close to max. Though my external oil cooler is not in a clear path of direct air, it is in an open space. I think a solution will be a cooler mounted fan that I can manually turn on and off. I ran 2 extra wires to the front when I had the car apart so will wire in a micro switch in my accessory gauge cluster to power a fan and see what this does.

7. Oil pressure. I've noticed when entering hard cornering that the oil pressure drops if the oil is not full. Even a 1/2 qt low can trigger this. Hopefully the tuna can thing will fix this. Because of my external oil cooler, I try to stay 1/2 a qt over full as the cooler is higher than the sump and drains back into the sump. If I keep the level full, it rarely happens, but MAN what a scare to get the oil light when you are hard on the throttle in a 75MPH sweeper!

8. I swapped out the dead dino oil with swepco in the gearbox and it made an immediate improvement that seems to be getting better. Smoother shifting, better downshifting and syncro engagement, but still get a little complaint from 1-2 and 2-3 upshifts. Only 2-300 miles so far, but everytime I drive it feels better. Still not perfect, but much better.

I want to again say THANK YOU to those of you in this forum. I dont have time to contribute very often these days, but still poke my head in and will do so.

[mark04usa]

Thanks to you, Steve. We have enjoyed your thread. I got to drive a new 912E when I worked at a Porsche dealer in the '70's. I don't recall if we had more than one. It was a great car to drive, and it was also quiet, just a subtle roar. You chose such a fine car to restore (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[rhodyguy]

Great picture. Beautiful car. Impressive geography.

[VGM911]

Thanks for taking the time, Steve, to meticulously document this project for our education and enjoyment. I read the entire thread from beginning to end.

I, too, owned a Bitter Chocolate 912E (#1746), but I always thought it was under powered with its somewhat "meager" 86HP. However, the massive 21 gallon gas tank was a wonderful feature, providing a cruising range of several hundred miles!

[Bulldog9]

Thanks for taking the time, Steve, to meticulously document this project for our education and enjoyment. I read the entire thread from beginning to end.

I, too, owned a Bitter Chocolate 912E (#1746), but I always thought it was under powered with its somewhat "meager" 86HP. However, the massive 21 gallon gas tank was a wonderful feature, providing a cruising range of several hundred miles!

Thanks, its been a blast. I'm happy with the power of the rebuild, but have nothing to compare it to. Have never driven or ridden in a 914, or 912E or 911 of that Era.

One of these days will get together with Kevin and others to see what they think of the power. I'm impressed, and guessing it is at about 115-120 HP.

[Bulldog9]

After almost 3 months of being gone training, I decided to go for a drive this morning. It was a bit chilly, but the sun was out. Unfortunately, my new AGM 911 sized Battery was completely dead.... Thankfully, I bought it at OReilly's and they tested it and it came up bad. They had one in stock, replaced at no cost and 60 minutes later I have the new battery in the car and am driving.... Real nice 3 hour drive. WHAT A SWEET car.....

After not running for 3 months the car kicked right off, and just a little spitting from one of the carbs (same one every time) the car ran sweet and strong. The Tangerine Exhaust with heat option does a fair job, puts enough warmish air on the windshield to keep it fog free unless I breath too hard... lol

I THINK however that the car killed the battery, and that I have a very slight draw somewhere in the system that drained the battery completely. I mean totally dead as in 0 volts... lol Last time I drove it was in Sept. I didn't put the trickle charge on before I left so my bad. I do need to try to track down the draw/short though.

Not sure why but a few things work if the key if off, particularly the windshield wipers. I figure if that circuit is still live there must be a couple others. Still need to get it to the body shop to get the door repaired...

[billh1963]

I THINK however that the car killed the battery, and that I have a very slight draw somewhere in the system that drained the battery completely. I mean totally dead as in 0 volts... lol Last time I drove it was in Sept. I didn't put the trickle charge on before I left so my bad. I do need to try to track down the draw/short though.

Not sure why but a few things work if the key if off, particularly the windshield wipers. I figure if that circuit is still live there must be a couple others. Still need to get it to the body shop to get the door repaired...

I have a '76 911S same color as yours. In that car (as well as my other 911's and such) I use this...seriously.

It may be old school. But, it saves the battery and also reduces my concern of a fire caused by a short or other electrical issue.



Amazon - Switch

[napasteve]

Steve, I agree with billh1963. Here is what I did on my 914. 3 benefits: 1) slight thief deterrent, 2) no more battery rundown from electrical leaks, and 3) eliminate the small fire hazard associated with 45 year old electrical systems that are energized and sitting in your garage.

[Bulldog9]

Yep, thanks was on the 'to do list' Picked one up today, will install this week. Still would like to track down the slow drain and figure out if the wipers should be 'active' while the key is off.

Initially the delay circuit and park on off function worked fine but after the first drive in the rain (yes.... it is NOT a garage queen) the wipers failed to return to park on off and the delay function ceased to work. I disassembled the motor, re-soldered the connections and no change so I assume it is the switch itself. Is on the 'list' I wanted to drive the car and enjoy it after 6 years of work.

My short list of 'to do's is:

1. New Leather seats - Recover stock units - $$$
2. Track down the short and wiper issue
3. Install fan on external oil cooler
4. Send Thermostat back to the 'awesome powdercoat' thermostat doesn't open, never has. Am running without.
5. Sell all my EXCESS parts.

But I've been so dang busy...... I just barely have time to squeeze in drives.....