Yet another starter issue Options

[saigon71]

Car is running great, but starting is hit-or-miss. Heading to a local car show on Saturday and I would prefer to NOT be push starting it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif) Car is a 1974 D-Jet.

- Doesn't matter if it is hot or cold
- New starter from FLAPS installed
- Seat belt logic under passenger seat bypassed by jumping yellow/yellow-red wires together.
- Grounds all clean
- New Optima battery
- New Battery terminals installed

When I jump the terminals on the starter with a screwdriver & the ignition switch on, the starter turns over, but the engine does not...is this normal?

It could be my ignition switch, but I want to eliminate everything else first.

Where do I go from here? Thanks.

[saigon71]

Fuel pump runs for a few seconds when key is turned too.

[914itis]

Silly question.
Did you remember to attach the transmission ground trap?

[914itis]

Fuel pump runs for a few seconds when key is turned too.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif)
That's normal.

[saigon71]

Silly question.
Did you remember to attach the transmission ground trap?

Just verified. Attached, clean and tight.

[saigon71]

Just came in from the shop doing some further testing:

- If I touch a quarter from the male spade connector (where the yellow starter wire connects), to the positive battery terminal, the car starts.

- 12V present at yellow wire at starter when ignition is turned to start.

- 11.92V measured on terminal 2 of the relay board when ignition is turned to start, and car actually started, scaring the hell out of me.

- 12.36V at the starter connection from the battery.

Leaning toward a bad ignition switch...am I missing anything?

[TheCabinetmaker]

Your answer is in the second paragraph.
"New starter from flaps". Good luck.

[chads74]

Ignition switch IMHO, just replaced mine cause I was having similar issues. Starts right up now.

[ThePaintedMan]

Ignition switch IMHO, just replaced mine cause I was having similar issues. Starts right up now.

Good possibility, even if you got 12V when you tested the yellow at the starter. If you've never changed it, it's almost surely the original one, so if it isn't the problem now, it will be soon enough. Easy to change, so I'd put it on my list of things to do. Chad had his back in right away.

[saigon71]

Appreciate the responses.

Removed all wires from positive battery terminal & scrubbed them down with wire brush...reinstalled. Cleaned positive battery terminal yet again. Car started eight consecutive times. Put cap back on connector that contains yellow starter wire on relay board & installed relay board cover. Car won't start any more.

Ordering a new ignition switch tomorrow. I don't know what else it could be.

[McMark]

The dash lights should be on while cranking. If those aren't on, your coil doesn't have power either and the car won't start.

the starter turns over, but the engine does not..

Does this mean that the starter spins without engaging the flywheel? If this is the case then it's definitely the starter itself. Nothing else can cause that.

[saigon71]

The dash lights should be on while cranking. If those aren't on, your coil doesn't have power either and the car won't start.

the starter turns over, but the engine does not..

Does this mean that the starter spins without engaging the flywheel? If this is the case then it's definitely the starter itself. Nothing else can cause that.

Have power everywhere else...but starter doesn't even click.

Yes. Tried it three times. The starter itself spins without cranking the engine (not engaging the flywheel) when I short the starter connection with a screwdriver.

[914itis]

The dash lights should be on while cranking. If those aren't on, your coil doesn't have power either and the car won't start.

the starter turns over, but the engine does not..

Does this mean that the starter spins without engaging the flywheel? If this is the case then it's definitely the starter itself. Nothing else can cause that.

Have power everywhere else...but starter doesn't even click.

Yes. Tried it three times. The starter itself spins without cranking the engine (not engaging the flywheel) when I short the starter connection with a screwdriver.

when you short it with a screw driver, the ignition (key) must be turned to ON position.
if not, it will crank but will not start

[McMark]

Definitely sounds like a defective starter to me.

[Rand]

the starter turns over, but the engine does not

Wait, what? You are jumping the wrong terminals then. You need to engage the solenoid. Different terminal.

[Dave_Darling]

It's a 74? Check under the passenger's seat for the Dreaded Seatbelt Interlock Relay. Jumper the two fat yellow wires together (better yet, permanently splice them and shrink-tube the connection) and throw the relay away.

--DD

[Tom]

Bob,
From your post #10. The car started 8 times then you put the cap back on the connector on the relay board with the big yellow wire. Now car will not start.
Remove that connector and clean both the male and female ends. You can slightly spread the male ends with a sharp knife for better contact.
Tom

[914itis]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)
Gotta be something on the relay board and connectors .

[Tom]

Bob,
While you are at it, clean the forward connector contacts also. BE SURE to disconnect the battery before removing the forward connector. It has un-switched and unprotected battery + on two pins, #12 and #14.
For the female contacts, I used a small wire brush of the type used to clean the bore of a 22 cal. Put it in a small variable speed drill and turn slowly. Wash out with isopropyl alcohol, blow dry.
Tom

[saigon71]

Still battling this...

Temporarily installed a remote push button starter switch in the engine bay to get through last weekend. Starter engages and the car starts every single time this way.

Installed a new ignition switch today from GPR. My old one was cracked so I thought for sure I found the problem. I did not - car still won't turn over.

Swapped out the relay board.

Tested for voltage at the starter and solenoid - this is what I found:

12.32V on the main terminal where the battery connects with ignition in the on position

11.85V on the main terminal where the battery connects with ignition in the crank position

12.14V to the yellow solenoid wire with ignition in the crank position

What gives?

Somebody suggested a defective starter. If this is the case, why would it work fine with the push button remote starter?

If it were a relay board problem, would I still get 12+ V to the solenoid when the ignition is turned to the crank position?

Again, the seat belt relay logic has been disabled by disconnecting the two large yellow wires and running a jumper between them...heat shrinked the whole jumper setup.

I'm not sure where to go from here.