Mid Engine Transmissions, I been thinking Options

[r_towle]

I am looking around, what other mid engine trannies are out there???

Toyota MR2 , probably easy to get at a junk yard
NSX Not so easy to get
Ferrari , unobtanium

Boxter
914
What else?

I know the MR2 and the NSX are both trying paddle shifting autos...

Just want to find a better solution.

Could a jag tranny or even a 928 tranny fit reasonably well?
How about Heiland (sp) I am not sure if that is even the name, but I have seen them on small openwheel racers...

rich

[Mueller]

MR2 is not mid-engine.......it's basicly a traditional* FWD platform moved to the near middle of the vehicle

Almost all of the Audi transmissions would work except for the TT series......the Boxster transmission is an Audi FWD/quattro gearbox from the looks of things.

Pantera gearbox works, there are a few on the list that have them behind chevy V8's.....less work if you and cost if you keep the Ford engine attached to it (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif) ......... Expensive and rare.

*engine is turned 90° from normal rear wheel drive applications

I'm sure a 928 transmission could be made to work, but the initial cost and the fabrication might not make it too practical

[cha914]

Pantera - $$$

I think the MR2 is a transverse mount, so it wouldn't work ...

same with the ferrari...at least on the 308 that I helped work on once - pain in the ass!

How about the new elise trans, its a toyota trans modified for the elise, we need to get Quarl to tear his car apart right after he gets it and see what they did to modify the tranny, then we can adapt it for our cars (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/tongue.gif) A quick shifting toyota tranny in our cars would ROCK!

From what I have heard, one of the Audi boxes seem to be the best bet for a cheapish trans swap (possible auto swap also), but noboday has done the development yet, probably due to the fact that its cheaper to do what has been done than to try something new.

[neo914-6]

Rich,
You need to decide on your engine first. KEP tells me they don't have adapters for the boxster so unless you want to use the Boxster engine you will be on your own to design fabricate an adapter. This engine BTW does not clear the rear susp arms. I am using an Audi engine which will mate to the boxster transaxle.

An inexpensive alternative to the boxster is the inline Audi tranny. It bolts up a 911 CV and axle. There is still some fabrication to relocate the cable shifter to the front of the engine.

A very few of the other trannys you mention may be possible but will require some measuring to confirm fit and involve costly fabrication. If you have lot's of $, are very motivated, and have the resources, go for it.

[neo914-6]

The scales of ecomony will show many transaxles or the fabrication will cost more than your 914... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif)

[kafermeister]

I used to wonder if the old VW Fox tranny would be a decent swap for a 914. We used to throw VW Foxs away arround here. The windshields alone often surpassed the value of a running car.

Rick

[michel richard]

lotus europa

[SpecialK]

What about a late '80's model front-wheel-drive Subby?

[lapuwali]

Lotus Europa used a Renault rear-engined gearbox with the R&P flipped. Sound familiar? It was not the best part of the car. The 4-speed was apparently a MUCH better unit than the 5-speed.

The early Soob gearboxes weren't known for their strength.

If all that's being asked after is another gearbox that's cheaper and easier to get than the 914 gearbox, not one that's good for stuffing behind a V8 or whatnot, then I'd consider the Type I gearbox. They're really common, flipping the R&P was done by thousands of Formula Vee racers (also a source of an already developed shifter assembly). They seem to be able to handle 100-150hp in pushing a T4 converted Bug around. No idea how much they cost, but considering how cheap the Bug crowd is (they make us look like big spenders!), I can't think it's all that much. The main downside is it's only a 4-speed. No idea on gearing choices.

[eeyore]

Try

http://www.mendeolatransaxles.com/S4S-S5S.php

$10K sequential shifters. For off-road use. Will handle LS-1 power.


Hewland trannies are nice. $$$ too.

[scotty914]

QUOTE (lapuwali @ Jan 21 2005, 11:12 AM)

The early Soob gearboxes weren't known for their strength.

niether is the 914 first gear, and early suby tranny have to be a dime a dozen and cheaper to rebuild. when i do scottstoolwenches 914 its going to get an auto tranny either audi or suby, might be a complete suby drive train

it all depends on how my car goes

[maf914]

QUOTE (lapuwali @ Jan 21 2005, 11:12 AM)

Lotus Europa used a Renault rear-engined gearbox with the R&P flipped.  Sound familiar?  It was not the best part of the car.  The 4-speed was apparently a MUCH better unit than the 5-speed.

I think the Lotus Europa box was actually a modified tranny from a front wheel drive Renault with an inline engine/clutch/tatransmission, but I can't actually verify that without checking some of my Lotus books.

When I lived in Europe in the past I used to read some of the British kit car magazines. The Brits made/make some cool kit cars. Some of the more powerful mid-engine designs, like Ford GT and Ferrari replicas, used 5-speed trannies from a large front drive V-6 Renault sedan sold in Europe. I have seen these transmissions for sale in kit car magazines here as well.

[Aaron Cox]

QUOTE (Cloudbuster @ Jan 21 2005, 12:13 PM)

Try http://www.mendeolatransaxles.com/S4S-S5S.php $10K sequential shifters. For off-road use. Will handle LS-1 power. Hewland trannies are nice. $$$ too.

my neighbor has a LS6 motor in a sand rail with a mendeola trans

[andys]

Nearly all Porsche motors will require the starter to hang out the back of the bellhousing. For V8 stuff, and other non-P motors, you can go various ways.

Renualt UN1-013 is a great transaxle, with great V8 ratio's. It is strong, and plenty of adapters are floating around the UK and Australia. Derek Bell (UK) makes some nice up-graded input shafts, etc. This is a popular transaxle for the European GT40 replica crowd. GTD is one of the replica manufacturers that use this trnsaxle. If you can find one from a Renault Turbo II, you're pretty lucky. Otherwise, you can look for the Eagle Medallion's with 5 speed's, but the ratio's will be slightly different (I've got a gear ratio chart somewhere).

The Audi/VW Passat transaxles are becomming more plentiful. 5 speed models are 012, 013, 016, 093 (of course most of these have a Quattro variant as well). I'd suggest the '98 up 012 model, though the ratio's are very similar to the 901. 6 speed is 01E (Euro only in front drive config), with a few early and rare 5 speed variants. FWIW

Andy

[lapuwali]

QUOTE (maf914 @ Jan 21 2005, 12:29 PM)

QUOTE (lapuwali @ Jan 21 2005, 11:12 AM) Lotus Europa used a Renault rear-engined gearbox with the R&P flipped.  Sound familiar?  It was not the best part of the car.  The 4-speed was apparently a MUCH better unit than the 5-speed. I think the Lotus Europa box was actually a modified tranny from a front wheel drive Renault with an inline engine/clutch/tatransmission, but I can't actually verify that without checking some of my Lotus books. When I lived in Europe in the past I used to read some of the British kit car magazines. The Brits made/make some cool kit cars. Some of the more powerful mid-engine designs, like Ford GT and Ferrari replicas, used 5-speed trannies from a large front drive V-6 Renault sedan sold in Europe. I have seen these transmissions for sale in kit car magazines here as well.

You may very well be correct there. I'd forgotten that most fwd Renaults hung their engines in front of the gearbox like the Audi. I wonder if the fwd gearbox wasn't just a Dauphine gearbox with a flipped R&P, though?

[r_towle]

So, Audi/VW tranny is what I am looking for.

I want a tranny that is plentiful to get at junk yards, has some aftermarket support, and can realistically handle 450 hp.

It seems that once I get over 300 hp, i get into a G50 tranny that will cost a fortune to rebuild.

I want a tranny that I can buy several and keep spares around with different gear ratios..

Right now I have like 7 901 trannies, but I may just sell them and get several trannies that can..
A) relialby handle the power
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif) Be able to handle long drawn out burn outs
c) handle drag racing type acceleration
d) possibly an automatic if I need that type of shifting.

A is the most important with B and C being a subset of A

This is not a dream, this is what I want to put in any car...to put all the money into a great motor only to have to baby the tranny seems like a waste of time.

The 928 puts out 300+ in stock trim...and it wont stay stock...I have seen 600HP versions out there.

I am ready to go down the 928 route with my car, but all the effort to build this and baby the tranny is just stupid IMHO...I know it can handle 300HP, but can it handle me with 300HP, I doubt it.

Rich

[bondo]

No mention of the 930 trans? I would think 930 or Pantera would be the way to go for 450 HP. I haven't ever heard of an audi trans handling that much. You don't hear much about G50s in 914s.. maybe they're too long?

[Mueller]

QUOTE

The 928 puts out 300+ in stock trim...and it wont stay stock...I have seen 600HP versions out there.

have you priced how expensive it is to hot rod the 928 engine? they are not cheap at all......you might end up being very happy with 300hp (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

[neo914-6]

QUOTE

So, Audi/VW tranny is what I am looking for. I want a tranny that is plentiful to get at junk yards, has some aftermarket support, and can realistically handle 450 hp

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Rich, What Audi with this tranny "realistically" handles 450hp? I'm planning on Boxster 6 speed S because I know they work with high hp 3.6L...

I understand if you plan to use a cheaper disposable tranny like the 901's and GM V8's.

BTW, which motor are you planning on, 928 5.0?

[redshift]

ZF, it's the only way to fly... it has more than any other, for twice the cost even..

The geometry doesn't even have to change... you can put a big V8 in, and never touch the firewall.

...and for the cost of an all expenses paid vacation for two to Hawaii, you can get a 6th gear..

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

M