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> type 4 max streetable power ?
got914?
post Dec 28 2014, 07:36 PM
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What kind of figures are places pushing on these anyway ?
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Jake Raby
post Dec 28 2014, 10:53 PM
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My record is 284 HP NA from my 2.9 twin plug, on pump gas. Boosted, just over 475HP @ 20 PSI on pump gas.
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got914?
post Dec 28 2014, 11:39 PM
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So jake can 200 hp in a type 4 be at all reliable as a daily driver ?
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Jake Raby
post Dec 28 2014, 11:42 PM
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QUOTE(got914? @ Dec 28 2014, 09:39 PM) *

So jake can 200 hp in a type 4 be at all reliable as a daily driver ?


If you can afford to build it properly. Today my engines start at 200HP, and all are developed for the street.

Its all in the combo, and how you make that 200HP, is more important than the dyno graph in regard to drivability, reliability, and longevity.

200 HP is no longer a benchmark for power from these engines; development has changed everything.
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Dave_Darling
post Dec 29 2014, 12:40 AM
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What do you consider "streetable"? Answer that question, and you'll be a fair way to answering your question.

--DD
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Mark Henry
post Dec 29 2014, 09:28 AM
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200hp type 4 is in the price territory of 'you may as well do a Porsche 6'.
No armchair engineer here... I've built a few of the big type4's, I own one and my current project is a /6 conversion.
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914werke
post Jan 15 2015, 01:19 PM
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QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Dec 28 2014, 08:53 PM) *

My record is 284 HP NA from my 2.9 twin plug, on pump gas. Boosted, just over 475HP @ 20 PSI on pump gas.

So Jake who is producing these heads? Are you doing them in house?
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Mueller
post Jan 15 2015, 02:37 PM
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QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Dec 28 2014, 09:42 PM) *

QUOTE(got914? @ Dec 28 2014, 09:39 PM) *

So jake can 200 hp in a type 4 be at all reliable as a daily driver ?


If you can afford to build it properly. Today my engines start at 200HP, and all are developed for the street.

Its all in the combo, and how you make that 200HP, is more important than the dyno graph in regard to drivability, reliability, and longevity.

200 HP is no longer a benchmark for power from these engines; development has changed everything.



How much $$ would be the minimum amount required to break into the 200hp Type IV club?

$2K? $5K?....$8K+?
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mepstein
post Jan 15 2015, 02:54 PM
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QUOTE(Mueller @ Jan 15 2015, 03:37 PM) *

QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Dec 28 2014, 09:42 PM) *

QUOTE(got914? @ Dec 28 2014, 09:39 PM) *

So jake can 200 hp in a type 4 be at all reliable as a daily driver ?


If you can afford to build it properly. Today my engines start at 200HP, and all are developed for the street.

Its all in the combo, and how you make that 200HP, is more important than the dyno graph in regard to drivability, reliability, and longevity.

200 HP is no longer a benchmark for power from these engines; development has changed everything.



How much $$ would be the minimum amount required to break into the 200hp Type IV club?

$2K? $5K?....$8K+?

lol. I bet your talking $20k + for a turnkey engine from jake.

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Mark Henry
post Jan 15 2015, 02:55 PM
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QUOTE(Mueller @ Jan 15 2015, 03:37 PM) *

QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Dec 28 2014, 09:42 PM) *

QUOTE(got914? @ Dec 28 2014, 09:39 PM) *

So jake can 200 hp in a type 4 be at all reliable as a daily driver ?


If you can afford to build it properly. Today my engines start at 200HP, and all are developed for the street.

Its all in the combo, and how you make that 200HP, is more important than the dyno graph in regard to drivability, reliability, and longevity.

200 HP is no longer a benchmark for power from these engines; development has changed everything.



How much $$ would be the minimum amount required to break into the 200hp Type IV club?

$2K? $5K?....$8K+?


Double your last figure. Or more.
$8k maybe if you are at my skills level, ie can replace seats and port heads, build the engine, header, etc...
I also bought my nickies at group buy prices...

For an idea price HAM the top level heads, nickies, stroker crank, rods, header, carbs WEB cam and internals.
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veekry9
post Jan 15 2015, 03:03 PM
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QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Dec 28 2014, 11:53 PM) *

My record is 284 HP NA from my 2.9 twin plug, on pump gas. Boosted, just over 475HP @ 20 PSI on pump gas.

Wow,That's a stratospheric territory,unknown to us mere mortals with rusted 914s.
To wish upon a cloud.If 4=475 then 6=710,a number of some portent.
A ton of work to make reliable and durable.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/first.gif)
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Jake Raby
post Jan 15 2015, 10:23 PM
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Len did the heads on that 284HP beast. The engine resides in Australia.

Our prices start at 20K these days, an engine like that 284HP beast (if you could convince me to build it) would be 35-40k.

I turned down all the builds that were "crazy" last year, and I'll only do one this year.
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thelogo
post Jan 16 2015, 10:35 PM
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Our prices start at 20K these days, an engine like that 284HP beast (if you could convince me to build it) would be 35-40k.




Come on now , is this what they mean when they say

Caution ,price gougers learking here.

I somehow doubt that the engine Porsche should have built would be that expensive...

But. What do I know ....
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DBCooper
post Jan 16 2015, 11:05 PM
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Uh oh, now you've done it. Ironically Jake actually loves criticism because it gives him the opportunity to answer it with infomercials. But don't worry, it will pass and you will learn.
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Jake Raby
post Jan 17 2015, 01:10 AM
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This year I moved to only using USA made performance products within a line of my engines. This means a billet crankshaft, and Nickies cylinders, among other things. An engine like this has 13K worth of parts alone and comes 100% complete.

As component quality drops more and more, we have to manufacture more parts, do more development on those parts, and we can't buy just a few at a time.

I did one single time study on an engine assembly in 2014, and by the time we started, till the time the engine was on the truck, we had 103 hours of accumulative time in that single engine.

Call it price gouging if you want to, but you won't find anyone to even tune your engine up for less than 85 bucks an hour. To create a complete engine, and spend this amount of time doing so, we are making 20 bucks an hour less than that, generally speaking.

I have no shortage of people who appreciate this, if I stopped taking orders right now we'd be working into 2016 just from those who are already committed.
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crash914
post Jan 17 2015, 06:07 AM
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Go price the parts...12k will just get you the entrance fee...just about every part is 1 to 3K...crank, heads, induction, cam, exhaust, ceramic lifters, Nickies, etc....I know it scared me when I added it all up. But it was done and done...6 or 7K for a used 6 cyl doesn't look too bad....but I still like the big 4....
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Mark Henry
post Jan 17 2015, 08:45 AM
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QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Jan 17 2015, 02:10 AM) *


I did one single time study on an engine assembly in 2014, and by the time we started, till the time the engine was on the truck, we had 103 hours of accumulative time in that single engine.


That build time estimate is about dead nuts on.

It's why I don't work as much on these projects anymore. As when I give my price quote the whining starts "Can't you do it cheaper"
Peeps are shameless, I even ask what would you say if your boss said "I want you to work for half price for the next month"? "Well no I wouldn't ...but can't you give me a deal...."
Luckily I'm in the position to say "No, I can't, sorry".




That said the hell with even the six, for 35-40K there are whole finished cars I'd rather own (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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GeorgeRud
post Jan 17 2015, 11:12 AM
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The old saying has always been true! Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?
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Maltese Falcon
post Jan 17 2015, 11:46 AM
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QUOTE(got914? @ Dec 28 2014, 05:36 PM) *

What kind of figures are places pushing on these anyway ?

I daily drove my 2.0, relatively stock internals ,with a low 7 psi turbo engine for 50,000 miles no problem. It ran a water/alcohol injection and boost enrichment; made 140 rwhp.
The engine was sold running strong, and went into a mid engine sand rail.
Marty
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colingreene
post Jan 17 2015, 11:49 AM
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Capitalism i guess.
Someone will pay it. I wont.
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