 Suddeny it wont run, This car is getting the better of me |
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| DavidSweden |
 Jun 13 2015, 06:59 AM
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#1
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Member  Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia  |
Went out for a short drive this morning. When I got back I parked up the car and shut of the engine. A few minutes later when I should start her up I had difficulty getting her going, the engine started but misfired badly. It then cut out and refuses to start. I have a Petronix but there is a spark. Any ideas on where to start?
Thanks |
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| catsltd |
Jun 13 2015, 07:28 AM
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 181 Joined: 7-June 15 From: Calgary Alberta Member No.: 18,814 Region Association: None |
I would pull a plug and make sure its dry and clean.
If it has been sitting with the same tank of gas for any length of time I would look at maybe a conditioner in the gas to remove water. Hope you figure it out. |
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| Spoke |
Jun 13 2015, 07:58 AM
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#3
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Jerry Group: Members Posts: 7,158 Joined: 29-October 04 From: Allentown, PA Member No.: 3,031 Region Association: None 
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Spraying starting fluid in the throttle will let you know if it's ignition or fuel delivery.
If the car starts and dies then its fuel. If nothing happens it likely is electrical. What is the voltage on the battery? Very low voltage could cause symptoms like you describe. |
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| Elliot Cannon |
Jun 13 2015, 10:35 AM
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#4
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914 Guru Group: Retired Members Posts: 8,487 Joined: 29-December 06 From: Paso Robles Ca. (Central coast) Member No.: 7,407 Region Association: None 
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Fuel pump running? Out of gas? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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| DavidSweden |
Jun 13 2015, 11:18 AM
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia |
QUOTE(Elliot Cannon @ Jun 13 2015, 08:35 AM)  I squirted starter fluid into the throttle and it fired and ran very irregularly. then it stopped. The fuel tubing feels like there is fuel under pressure and the fuel pump is running. I can smell gas Whats the best way to check the fuel pressure, and do I have to pull the tank to get att the fuel filter? Any other ideas why it should suddenly die? This car would test the patience of a saint (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) |
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| SirAndy |
Jun 13 2015, 12:03 PM
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#6
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 42,205 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) |
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| Bartlett 914 |
Jun 13 2015, 02:11 PM
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#7
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,218 Joined: 30-August 05 From: South Elgin IL Member No.: 4,707 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. I put a pressure gauge in place of the cold start injector. In my car, I never need it anyway so the gauge stays in place |
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| BeatNavy |
Jun 13 2015, 02:57 PM
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#8
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Certified Professional Scapegoat Group: Members Posts: 2,951 Joined: 26-February 14 From: Easton, MD Member No.: 17,042 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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QUOTE(Bartlett 914 @ Jun 13 2015, 04:11 PM) QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. It will make it run rich. The experience I've had with a open/failed, or open/failing, CHT circuit is the car will start or at least try to start when cold but quickly die and then refuse to start at all. Yes, I think at one time or another we've all needed a ton of patience with our Teener. Good luck, David. You'll figger' it out (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| DavidSweden |
Jun 14 2015, 11:57 AM
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia |
QUOTE(BeatNavy @ Jun 13 2015, 12:57 PM) QUOTE(Bartlett 914 @ Jun 13 2015, 04:11 PM) QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. It will make it run rich. The experience I've had with a open/failed, or open/failing, CHT circuit is the car will start or at least try to start when cold but quickly die and then refuse to start at all. Yes, I think at one time or another we've all needed a ton of patience with our Teener. Good luck, David. You'll figger' it out (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Stock D Jet 2.0 l CG Engine Thanks for the advice guys. Well this is a bummer the sun has arrived in Sweden and the car refuses to start This is what I have tested; Fuel pressure 28 psi Gas filter is clean 3k ohms on CHT the one by #3 Changed Peronix back to points and there is a spark Static timed engine Turned on ignition and opened throttle by hand in engine bay and can hear the injectors firing Still nothing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) When I crank it and put down full gas it sounds like it wants to start I pulled the plugs they had a thin coat of carbon on them and were slightly wet. Any ideas on what to check next? I got to get this car running |
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| SirAndy |
Jun 14 2015, 12:16 PM
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#10
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 42,205 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Bartlett 914 @ Jun 13 2015, 01:11 PM) QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. He never said that his spraying fuel helped. He said it still ran like crap when he did that. That's not my definition of "helping". He also said it smelled like fuel. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) |
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| DavidSweden |
Jun 15 2015, 10:21 AM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia |
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| BeatNavy |
Jun 15 2015, 10:39 AM
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#12
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Certified Professional Scapegoat Group: Members Posts: 2,951 Joined: 26-February 14 From: Easton, MD Member No.: 17,042 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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Can you describe how you measured the CHT resistance? Also, did you actually verify continuity from the sensor lead to the ECU? The wiring harness lead can get pretty nicked up, and while you may have correct values from the sensor lead to ground, the ECU may think it's an open circuit. Verify how and what you're measuring as well as correct resistance values for each model: Anders
That's all I got right now. You seem to have fuel and spark. And you set the timing... |
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| DRPHIL914 |
Jun 15 2015, 10:49 AM
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#13
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,821 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States
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the last time mine did something like this it ended up being my distributor cap/rotor.
not sure why but it came out of nowhere. chased my tail testing everyting else and in the end it was just that simple. Phil |
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| 914_teener |
Jun 15 2015, 11:14 AM
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#14
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,264 Joined: 31-August 08 From: So. Cal Member No.: 9,489 Region Association: Southern California |
QUOTE(Bartlett 914 @ Jun 13 2015, 01:11 PM) QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. I put a pressure gauge in place of the cold start injector. In my car, I never need it anyway so the gauge stays in place Without the ECU seeing a ground from the CHT......the car will not run....period. |
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| stugray |
Jun 15 2015, 11:51 AM
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#15
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,825 Joined: 17-September 09 From: Longmont, CO Member No.: 10,819 Region Association: None |
QUOTE(914_teener @ Jun 15 2015, 11:14 AM) QUOTE(Bartlett 914 @ Jun 13 2015, 01:11 PM) QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 13 2015, 01:03 PM) Stock D-Jet? If so, check the CHT, the wire may have come lose ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I thought the cht circuit open would make the car run rich. If it is running rich then I wouldn't think spraying additional fuel would help. I put a pressure gauge in place of the cold start injector. In my car, I never need it anyway so the gauge stays in place Without the ECU seeing a ground from the CHT......the car will not run....period. If you just ground the CHT wire to the engine case it should start IF the temp sensor is the problem. Shorting that wire to ground just looks like a head temp of greater than 300F. So it should run rough but start because the ECU just thinks the engine is warmed up when it is not. |
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| JeffBowlsby |
Jun 15 2015, 11:53 AM
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#16
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914 Wiring Harnesses & Beekeeper Group: Members Posts: 8,907 Joined: 7-January 03 From: San Ramon CA Member No.: 104 Region Association: None
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Does the MPS hold vacuum?
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| DavidSweden |
Jun 15 2015, 11:58 AM
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia |
QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Jun 15 2015, 09:53 AM) Does the MPS hold vacuum? I hope so Jeff it was you who rebuilt it about 2 months ago. I will check and let you know |
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| Spoke |
Jun 15 2015, 12:11 PM
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#18
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Jerry Group: Members Posts: 7,158 Joined: 29-October 04 From: Allentown, PA Member No.: 3,031 Region Association: None
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You can check for a stuck cold start injector. That could cause a very rich mixture.
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| DavidSweden |
Jun 15 2015, 12:15 PM
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#19
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Member Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: 8-June 14 From: Sweden Member No.: 17,452 Region Association: Scandinavia |
QUOTE(Spoke @ Jun 15 2015, 10:11 AM) You can check for a stuck cold start injector. That could cause a very rich mixture. Thanks, I did take a piece of tubing attached it to the cold start valve and blew down it to see if it was open (ignition off) is this the correct procedure? |
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| larss |
Jun 15 2015, 12:32 PM
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 431 Joined: 10-September 09 From: Sweden Member No.: 10,787 Region Association: Scandinavia |
QUOTE(DavidSweden @ Jun 13 2015, 06:18 PM) ...Whats the best way to check the fuel pressure... On the steel fuel line between the injectors on one side there is a T-tube with a small bolt at the end, just undo the bolt an hook up a pressure gauge on it and make the pump running. /Lars S |
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