This one's "Killing" me. I "must" comment to show everyone how much I know!, (don't) Options

[Mark Henry]

I often read things like that's too much money for that car, but often it's more likely "too much in my area".
California guys often state prices that are way lower than the rest of the country.
Canada prices are going to be higher mostly because of the exchange.
Euro prices way higher than that.

Add to that you have shipping costs and then that local cars price might not be as out of line as you think.

If a seller prices a car too high then it's just not going to sell. If you don't get a single PM on your car you are very likely too high on your asking price.

One of the reasons I say if someone is real worried about this start a general PPI or how to buy a 914 thread for people to read. Then get an admin to make it a top of the page sticky.
Make the buyer informed to make his own decision.

[Montreal914]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) That was a nice car and got bashed for no reasons IMHO. If' you don't think its worth the asking price, then let someone else enjoy it. It's all relative.
I don't know how many 914 are actually driving in the province of Québec (5-10 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) ) but this one is probably one of the nicest one.

What about this one approaching our member selling price;

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-porsche-914-2-0/

Not original color or interior, but still a very nice car, and will sell for the same price ball park.

[Tom_T]

I often read things like that's too much money for that car, but often it's more likely "too much in my area".
California guys often state prices that are way lower than the rest of the country.
Canada prices are going to be higher mostly because of the exchange.
Euro prices way higher than that.

Add to that you have shipping costs and then that local cars price might not be as out of line as you think.

If a seller prices a car too high then it's just not going to sell. If you don't get a single PM on your car you are very likely too high on your asking price.

One of the reasons I say if someone is real worried about this start a general PPI or how to buy a 914 thread for people to read. Then get an admin to make it a top of the page sticky.
Make the buyer informed to make his own decision.

Hey Mark, I do like that 914 buyer help topic idea!

I agree with you on the sales prices on the cars Mark, but the condition issues relative behind the values are probably helpful to other members' looking at the cars, if something is glaringly different than how it's presented by the seller.

I think some of the overpriced parts may be another issue though. For example, there was a guy in FL on CL over the past year who was trying to sell a rough looking set of5 of the 4-lug 914/4 Mahle Baby Gasburners for $2500 & more for the lugs & caps, who apparently didn't know the difference price-wise between them & the more rare & more expensive 5-lug 911/912/914-6 Mahles. After a year or so, he eventually got the message & dropped to $1000 IIRC & they sold within a month or so +/-, but with lugs & caps thrown in.

If it were on here, then some member could step in & point out the differences, & the guy would've had his wheels sold & money in hand sooner, & they buyer would have their set of restorable Mahles sooner, as well as saving some unknowing newbie from overpaying 2.5x too much on them.

So I think that those situations help all around to be handled in the open, rather than privately by PM/email only.

That sticky 914 buyer help topic you've suggested is a great idea too (or "nailed topic" as they call it on here), & one thing that should be in there is a link to the "914 Condition Assessment Form" which member Jeff Bowlsby created - with his permission of course.

http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/zTN_Gen_914CAF.pdf

Other resources for buyers to research would be a good idea in that nailed topic too, including Jeff's websites & the p914 & some of the better books out there.

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[mangrum]

Personalty, as a buyer, I appreciate most of the comments on adds. This forum is a community. Not all of us are seasoned experts.

As a seller, you can always sell your stuff on other sites that do not allow comments. But not on BAT.

My $0.02

Mike

[yerpants]

Tom is hitting the spot welds right on the head here. Is it possible to move this thread to the garage? Maybe just start another thread with a link? Tom, you're an admin at the club site and here right?

[matthepcat]

I personally like the feedback and input from members on my previous for sale cars here. Helps me identify details I forgot and allows members who have viewed my car in person to give their $.02.

[Tom_T]

Tom is hitting the spot welds right on the head here. Is it possible to move this thread to the garage? Maybe just start another thread with a link? Tom, you're an admin at the club site and here right?

No I'm not, otherwise I would've just moved it myself.

You may be thinking of George asking me last year to be one on the 914club site for their Concours Forum (essentially our Originality & History), but I didn't want to step on Pat Garvey's more experienced toes on here & there for both of those C & O&H forums, & I really don't have the time until I retire & get some projects done - including a house refurb/remodel/update.

Although I still try to help folks out on both sites where/when I can with my TMI posts (BTW - I use a laptop & type fast!) - & try to garner interest in folks coming out to our SoCal PCA Concours - if they can just get by the CW avoidance part - & think of them as fun cars shows to attend, display or enter! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

Maybe someone will move it .... eventually. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[mepstein]

Doesn't matter where the thread is moved. The decision has been made ( quite a while ago in fact)

[rick 918-S]

Simple solution. when posting in a for sale thread just start with "I'm interested in your car but"....

Here is the next problem. Someone interested in purchasing a car here posts a comment and a question in the same breath, Gets banned as he is going back to check for a response and send a PM with an offer, doesn't know why he can no longer follow a car he is interested in purchasing. Can't remember the sellers screen name, By the time he figures out it's not the site going down he has lost the option to purchase. So getting banned without a fair warning to clarify the parties intent could cause some real ill will.

If I comment on a car it's because I'm interested in it and the seller either does not know he is misleading or does and is counting on someone with less knowledge to step up and pull the trigger.

I will be sure to start my inquiry that way from now on.

[Tom_T]

Simple solution. when posting in a for sale thread just start with "I'm interested in your car but"....

Here is the next problem. Someone interested in purchasing a car here posts a comment and a question in the same breath, Gets banned as he is going back to check for a response and send a PM with an offer, doesn't know why he can no longer follow a car he is interested in purchasing. Can't remember the sellers screen name, By the time he figures out it's not the site going down he has lost the option to purchase. So getting banned without a fair warning to clarify the parties intent could cause some real ill will.

If I comment on a car it's because I'm interested in it and the seller either does not know he is misleading or does and is counting on someone with less knowledge to step up and pull the trigger.

I will be sure to start my inquiry that way from now on.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Tom_T]

Doesn't matter where the thread is moved. The decision has been made ( quite a while ago in fact)

So Mark, are you saying that you're one of the Admins?

I have no idea who are all the Admins are on here, nor do most on here I would think.

We don't appear to have anywhere listing the Admins & Mods & what they're in charge of on the site.

So how would somebody on here who sees something misleading or incorrect on an ad, even know who & how to contact a Admin to report it, as Eric's post said to do!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Also, if it was decided "quite a while ago," then the Classified &/or site rules should've been updated to reflect that & any other new rule(s), & certainly should be now that this has come up.

I say this, because Eric's 5-7+/- threads on it will eventually disappear at the bottom of the list netherworld, or after the 30 day or whatever the expiration is.

I agree with Rick that folks should not be blindsided & banned for something that is not generally known - & new folks on here will not know all of these "unwritten rules" of which you & the Admins seem to be aware of exclusively.

And that is in addition to & aside from some members' disagreement on the wisdom & value of this rule, as already noted by many in this topic (& maybe other rules), relative to looking out for our fellow members.

There seems to be more posts in favor of allowing reasonable comments done tactfully & constructively, than against it & banning folks - & most of the latter are just saying that's the decision so shut up & accept it, with little reasoning behind it's purpose - other than to protect sellers, who may or may not be purposely misrepresenting their cars &/or wares.

JMHO (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Tom_T]

BTW - does this new rule also apply to all types of classifieds - i.e.: parts & other stuff - or only to cars & rollers for sale?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

And in the same vein either way - does this also mean that we risk being banned for adding useful info on the the topic for WTB ads - of all or just cars FS classifieds? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

And can another member answer an interested prospective buyer's question - &/or correct an incorrect seller answer - once a question on the subject has been asked, or will that also get us banned? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Those are 3 valid questions affecting everybody, so I'd appreciate an actual answer clarifying them on here.

TIA (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Bruce Hinds]

Are we looking for opinions here?

Banning someone just for commenting on a car or parts for sale seems a little thin skinned to me.

I think I saw the original one that set this off about the lenses. I didn't see a problem for someone saying they could find them somewhere else cheaper - but it may have gone to far to put the guy down for trying to make a profit off the group. - then the other guy who went though the explanation process put it into perspective and that was good information for all of us to see what it takes to get parts for the rest of us.

Not sure I see what all the fuss is about, but I guess I'll be careful now.

[mepstein]

Doesn't matter where the thread is moved. The decision has been made ( quite a while ago in fact)

So Mark, are you saying that you're one of the Admins?

I have no idea who are all the Admins are on here, nor do most on here I would think.

We don't appear to have anywhere listing the Admins & Mods & what they're in charge of on the site.

So how would somebody on here who sees something misleading or incorrect on an ad, even know who & how to contact a Admin to report it, as Eric's post said to do!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Also, if it was decided "quite a while ago," then the Classified &/or site rules should've been updated to reflect that & any other new rule(s), & certainly should be now that this has come up.

I say this, because Eric's 5-7+/- threads on it will eventually disappear at the bottom of the list netherworld, or after the 30 day or whatever the expiration is.

I agree with Rick that folks should not be blindsided & banned for something that is not generally known - & new folks on here will not know all of these "unwritten rules" of which you & the Admins seem to be aware of exclusively.

And that is in addition to & aside from some members' disagreement on the wisdom & value of this rule, as already noted by many in this topic (& maybe other rules), relative to looking out for our fellow members.

There seems to be more posts in favor of allowing reasonable comments done tactfully & constructively, than against it & banning folks - & most of the latter are just saying that's the decision so shut up & accept it, with little reasoning behind it's purpose - other than to protect sellers, who may or may not be purposely misrepresenting their cars &/or wares.

JMHO (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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No, I am not an admin. I never said I was. You can get the list of admins from the site. Follow the rules, don't follow the rules, I don't care.

[mepstein]

Simple solution. when posting in a for sale thread just start with "I'm interested in your car but"....

Here is the next problem. Someone interested in purchasing a car here posts a comment and a question in the same breath, Gets banned as he is going back to check for a response and send a PM with an offer, doesn't know why he can no longer follow a car he is interested in purchasing. Can't remember the sellers screen name, By the time he figures out it's not the site going down he has lost the option to purchase. So getting banned without a fair warning to clarify the parties intent could cause some real ill will.

If I comment on a car it's because I'm interested in it and the seller either does not know he is misleading or does and is counting on someone with less knowledge to step up and pull the trigger.

I will be sure to start my inquiry that way from now on.

We are all friends here so I'm just guessing the admins are not going to start banning members without some heads up first. It takes a lot on world to really get Andy pissed.

[Tom_T]

No, I am not an admin. I never said I was. You can get the list of admins from the site. Follow the rules, don't follow the rules, I don't care.

No, I understand that you never said so, it just seemed like you knew what, when & how that new rule all came down, & I'd not heard anything about it before this thing.

I was out of touch on here for a big chunk of time last year while my Aunt was sick & passed on, so I may have missed it.

Also, those of us in disagreement with this no commenting on here about this classifieds rule, are just stating our reasons why.

I think the best rule for everything on here, is just to treat others as you'd want to be treated, which was always a good guideline for life in general, as imparted by my parents, grandparents & especially great-grandmother.

So apologies to you, if I offended you by asking. I wasn't intending to do so.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Eric_Shea]

Hey-Fuching-Zeus...

It was discussed adnauseum FOUR years ago.

READ THIS TOM (Et al):
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=194079

Moreover; read the date of when it was written. I HAS BEEN A STICKY AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE FOR FOUR YEARS NOW (jus say'n)

I didn't make the rule. I'm put in the position of attempting to enforce it because people don't seem to remember it, care about it, abide by it, etc. I'm the one who gets bitched at when I'm not always available to monitor the carny's raiding the circus. It appears I get bitched at when I attempt enforce or remind people of it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

This is an extremely well run "self policed" site. Meaning; the monkeys run the zoo. It's just a little easier if the monkeys know the rules. Go have a banana and stop flinging poop at me! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Tom_T]

READ THIS TOM (Et al):
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=194079

Sorry, but I didn't see that before as a sticky Eric. My bad! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

If it applies to all types of ads, then maybe put a sticky at the overall classifieds section too as a sticky.

Also, I meant nothing against you for having to enforce the rules on here - as I said early on - but I was just saying that I disagree with the idea that only actual buyers can ever comment on ads (in a helpful & polite way), as have others.

Thanx for pointing out the sticky.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[Tom_T]

Also - I think that adding to the number of the posts on this topic: "This one's "Killing" me. I "must" comment to show everyone how much I know!" - was not the most tactful nor right way to put it, & comes across as insulting to those of us trying to help others - as others on here have helped us before. It was just unnecessary & unjust, along with the other 3-4 posts on the same topic.

As folks above have already stated - many are either atrying to help others, & others are thankful the help.

Just offered up herein as a thought for the future handling of such notices, as well as to others on here who like to post disparaging comments about others' intentions, when they really have no idea what those intentions are/were.

Just give folks the benefit of the doubt, & be kind!

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[rhodyguy]

Advising can be done via pm or email.