Pricing confusion, what are 914's really worth? Options

[dudzy's914]

I know this topic comes up a lot, but I see 914's posted here and various other websites that have nicely redone 914's and they are ASKING 14k+ for a car with nice paint and interior and runs well, between a number 2 and 3 car on Hagerty( not show, but very nice drivers). Then I see some listed or at auctions, of the same quality for closer to 8k. Is this what they are selling for when asking 14k+? I know it is only worth what the buyer is willing to pay, but what are these cars actually selling for?

[Tom_T]

I would say that Hagarty has the best actual sales price data on their website (sign up for free to get their full report, if not already done), while NADA & KBB tend to not get the nicer cars sold into their data (they're getting better).

As you note - asking is not sold pricing, & IMHO evilbay & other auction sites tend to start at lower prices, then climb (use their "sold" search option to get final sold or at least bid it if not "completed" sales).

In any case, it's really hard to assess real condition just from pix & seller descriptions for comparisons, so I'd tend to go along with Hagarty's research, since it's in their best business interest to have accurate valuation data.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[dudzy's914]

I would say that Hagarty has the best actual sales price data on their website (sign up for free to get their full report, if not already done), while NADA & KBB tend to not get the nicer cars sold into their data (they're getting better).

As you note - asking is not sold pricing, & IMHO evilbay & other auction sites tend to start at lower prices, then climb (use their "sold" search option to get final sold or at least bid it if not "completed" sales).

In any case, it's really hard to assess real condition just from pix & seller descriptions for comparisons, so I'd tend to go along with Hagarty's research, since it's in their best business interest to have accurate valuation data.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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Okay, thank you! If you guys all trust Hagarty and think they are fair, then that is fantastic

[John]

I have a serious question concerning NADA values on these cars.



They seem to have a range of $19,100 to $37,100 for a 1974 Porsche 914 2.0.

The original bill of sale of my car in 1974 was around $6,500, and it probably lost money when it left the lot.

WTF?

These are 40+ year old cars, and while I like them and enjoy them, I doubt that I could get a buyer to pay in that price range (not that any of my cars are for sale, but I'm just saying).

[iwanta914-6]

I have a serious question concerning NADA values on these cars.



They seem to have a range of $19,100 to $37,100 for a 1974 Porsche 914 2.0.

The original bill of sale of my car in 1974 was around $6,500, and it probably lost money when it left the lot.

WTF?

These are 40+ year old cars, and while I like them and enjoy them, I doubt that I could get a buyer to pay in that price range (not that any of my cars are for sale, but I'm just saying).

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

[injunmort]

what ever the ass for the seat is willing to pay, no more

[John]

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

Inflation? You must be kidding.

Cars like most liabilities depreciate with age.

Few of them appreciate. Cars are not assets, especially not our NARP's.

Next you are going to tell me my stock 930 is worth way more than I paid for it.

[Steve]

It would be nice to start a thread on what people are getting for our cars. The nice stock 4 bangers are selling in the high teens depending on condition. The high dollar conversions are slow sells and never get back what they put into them. There was over $60k into my car and I bought it for $21k, back in 2009. I then put another $10k into it. Look at Joe's RS, it took a while to sell it and he took a major loss compared to what he had into it regarding parts and labor. Only real sixes are demanding and getting big bucks.

[injunmort]

imho, those values from hagerty, kelly nada etc only serve a good purpose for insurance claim purposes. not that i would sell any of mine, but they are nothing special except to me. 1971 driver that is a good running bitsa, 1972 original 4 with a lot of rust repair. i bought the 71cheap. done a lot of work to it and its rust free 45 years old and i would take the first $5000.00 daily driver. real sixes and le's command money.real real nice others, 6000-10000, tops. how many neglected ferarri 308's or 911's selling for 1000 to 2000 dollars. none, no matter how neglected, unfortunately, the 914/4 is not a unicorn.

[falcor75]

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

Inflation? You must be kidding.

Cars like most liabilities depreciate with age.

Few of them appreciate. Cars are not assets, especially not our NARP's.

Next you are going to tell me my stock 930 is worth way more than I paid for it.

A stock unmolested 930 has probably increased about 30-50k in the last 5-6 years. There's a finite number of these cars available and alot more people wanting to own one.

[Darren C]

When cars get old, putting a “one price fits all” tag on them is not possible. This kinda only works for cars under 5 years old when there are few variables.
At the end of the day it’s only worth what the buyer is prepared to pay and the seller is prepared to accept.
It is also subject to geography and supply & demand.
I get bored real quick with “generic valuations” and moans on high prices. We should embrace price rises not object to them!
As owners and enthusiasts, lets say we all make a pact to value our 914’s at $1 Million each and all vow to not sell for anything less. This would force the market and then those not in the pact and think this is a crazy idea would only see $$$ signs and join the frenzy in the end. We must not forget we really are in control of the value (interesting thought that)
Classic prices are fickle they go down as well as up. Fortunately we’re all on the up at the moment, and I agree with John’s “price band” for nice non-special examples.

[DaveO90s4]

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

Inflation? You must be kidding.

Cars like most liabilities depreciate with age.

Few of them appreciate. Cars are not assets, especially not our NARP's.

Next you are going to tell me my stock 930 is worth way more than I paid for it.

John I think you are mixing 'inflation' (the changed buying power of the currency over time) with the changed value of an item as it wears out / becomes more wanted (i.e. Valuable) over time.

If $6000 then is $33000 now, and most have rotted away (a liability for those owners, not an asset as you rightly point out) thus the good uns are more rare and more desirable for those with the urge and the cash, then it is not surprising that those good uns sell for more than purchase price (inflation adjusted).

I think the 914 is the new 356 and the 928 the next one to take off.

My $9.14 worth.

Dave

[billh1963]

what ever the ass for the seat is willing to pay, no more

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

[carr914]

I have a serious question concerning NADA values on these cars.



They seem to have a range of $19,100 to $37,100 for a 1974 Porsche 914 2.0.

The original bill of sale of my car in 1974 was around $6,500, and it probably lost money when it left the lot.

WTF?

These are 40+ year old cars, and while I like them and enjoy them, I doubt that I could get a buyer to pay in that price range (not that any of my cars are for sale, but I'm just saying).

John, I would not sell my car for less than $30k and I think I would have a line of people wanting it - '73 2.0

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

Inflation? You must be kidding.

Cars like most liabilities depreciate with age.

Few of them appreciate. Cars are not assets, especially not our NARP's.

Next you are going to tell me my stock 930 is worth way more than I paid for it.

I don't know what year 930 you have, but I guarantee that if you have had it for quite a few years, it is probably worth 2-5 times what you paid. 911/930 Factory Turbo prices are uber insane!

[Andyrew]

Taking $6500 in 1974 and adjusting for inflation, that's about $33,000. So, if the car is just as nice as it was when it was on the showroom floor in 1974, plus it becoming more desirable, I see nothing wrong with values in that range.

Of course, there are not many in show room condition.

Inflation? You must be kidding.

Cars like most liabilities depreciate with age.

Few of them appreciate. Cars are not assets, especially not our NARP's.

Next you are going to tell me my stock 930 is worth way more than I paid for it.

I have a feeling there is a bit of sarcasm here... most everyone knows at this point that all porsches have appreciated over the past couple years and air cooled cars especially the rare performance ones have been skyrocketing up.

If you dont then your insurance company surely does and has informed you to increase your coverage.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)

[era vulgaris]

real sixes and le's command money.real real nice others, 6000-10000, tops.

Please point me in the direction where I can buy a real real nice 914 with little to no rust, 5 footer paint, has original FI, that's running and driving reliably with no serious issues for $6-10k???? I'd really like to know because I'll probably be in the market for a car soon.

Five years ago, maybe. Today, it doesn't exist.

[JoeDees]

I agree with the above posters that so much depends on the car's details (original, restored, refreshed, modifications, etc) and especially on location. I think it's nearly impossible to put a blanket value on 914s.

[injunmort]

show me a nice 1.7l selling for, not asking for more, i see them frequently.

[Cal]

Some interesting sales history from Jeff Bowlsby's site....

[era vulgaris]

show me a nice 1.7l selling for, not asking for more, i see them frequently.

I think we maybe have different definitions of 'nice'. Nice to me is: zero rust repair required; a little surface rust here or there is ok; paint shines nicely but upon close inspection may have some chips etc and evidence of being driven; interior is complete and in great shape with no cracks in the dash, maybe a nick or two in a seat bolster is fine; major electrical items function correctly; mechanically a car you could get in and drive as it is any day and time without worry.

Find me a $6-10K car like that, please!!!! I scour internet car classifieds for 914's and Karmann Ghias every morning while I drink coffee. I have for the last five or six years. It's become an obsession. Most people read the paper with their coffee. I look for Ghias and 914s. I've not seen these $6-10k 'nice' 914s that you're talking about for at least a couple years.

Here's a 1.7 in our own classifieds, which doesn't even meet my aesthetic criteria with a $13.5k asking price:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=290549
This is a car I really like actually, but it needs a complete exterior respray and the interior needs new seat covers and bolsters, and a new dash.