Brake Upgrades for a 4 lug, what's available Options

[76-914]

Looking to upgrade my present brake system but I want to keep it 4 lug AND keep the parking brake. Not to mention, staying out of the Poor House at the same time. I'm not opposed to moving up to a larger MC. Is there such an animal? TIA, Kent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[bdstone914]

Looking to upgrade my present brake system but I want to keep it 4 lug AND keep the parking brake. Not to mention, staying out of the Poor House at the same time. I'm not opposed to moving up to a larger MC. Is there such an animal? TIA, Kent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I am working on aluminum billet hubs for four lug that will allow the use of BMW 320 calipers that will be modified for vented rotor use. They will use 911 1969-1976 20mm thick rotors. This will result in an economical upgrade package. Other than that you can go with the 320I calipers by modifying them to fit existing 914 struts. Estimating the hubs to be about $400 and calipers $200 , plus stock rotors $100 so the total will be in the $700-800 range. Prices are only an estimate pending on machining time and material cost. This was based on the Brad Robert design hubs which I recently acquired sold sets of the five lug recently.
I have sold several sets of the BMW calipers with customers staying with the 17mm master and they reported a greater brake pedal modulation. Upgrade to 19mm is not needed but would maintain the same pedal feel if you did got to a 19mm.
Looking for a test car to try it out when the first prototypes are produced.
Wanna be the Guinea pig?
Bruce

[Dave_Darling]

What is wrong with your current brakes that you are trying to fix?

For stopping power--
Upgrade #1 == tires. Brakes stop the wheels; tires stop the car.
Upgrade #2 == rebuilding the brake system. Most of us have old and tired parts in our brake system. Refreshing the system will go a long way to improving the stopping distance in that case.

--DD

[76-914]

Looking to upgrade my present brake system but I want to keep it 4 lug AND keep the parking brake. Not to mention, staying out of the Poor House at the same time. I'm not opposed to moving up to a larger MC. Is there such an animal? TIA, Kent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I am working on aluminum billet hubs for four lug that will allow the use of BMW 320 calipers that will be modified for vented rotor use. They will use 911 1969-1976 20mm thick rotors. This will result in an economical upgrade package. Other than that you can go with the 320I calipers by modifying them to fit existing 914 struts. Estimating the hubs to be about $400 and calipers $200 , plus stock rotors $100 so the total will be in the $700-800 range. Prices are only an estimate pending on machining time and material cost. This was based on the Brad Robert design hubs which I recently acquired sold sets of the five lug recently.
I have sold several sets of the BMW calipers with customers staying with the 17mm master and they reported a greater brake pedal modulation. Upgrade to 19mm is not needed but would maintain the same pedal feel if you did got to a 19mm.
Looking for a test car to try it out when the first prototypes are produced.
Wanna be the Guinea pig?
Bruce

Yes I do. PM me when your ready. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

What is wrong with your current brakes that you are trying to fix?

For stopping power--
Upgrade #1 == tires. Brakes stop the wheels; tires stop the car.
Upgrade #2 == rebuilding the brake system. Most of us have old and tired parts in our brake system. Refreshing the system will go a long way to improving the stopping distance in that case.

--DD

Everything is new sans the MC and working great. Why you ask? On a back road, I scared the shit out of myself a few month's back when I was teaching a BMW a lesson. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bootyshake.gif) Power is useless if you can't slow it down.

[jeffdon]

Looking to upgrade my present brake system but I want to keep it 4 lug AND keep the parking brake. Not to mention, staying out of the Poor House at the same time. I'm not opposed to moving up to a larger MC. Is there such an animal? TIA, Kent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I am working on aluminum billet hubs for four lug that will allow the use of BMW 320 calipers that will be modified for vented rotor use. They will use 911 1969-1976 20mm thick rotors. This will result in an economical upgrade package. Other than that you can go with the 320I calipers by modifying them to fit existing 914 struts. Estimating the hubs to be about $400 and calipers $200 , plus stock rotors $100 so the total will be in the $700-800 range. Prices are only an estimate pending on machining time and material cost. This was based on the Brad Robert design hubs which I recently acquired sold sets of the five lug recently.
I have sold several sets of the BMW calipers with customers staying with the 17mm master and they reported a greater brake pedal modulation. Upgrade to 19mm is not needed but would maintain the same pedal feel if you did got to a 19mm.
Looking for a test car to try it out when the first prototypes are produced.
Wanna be the Guinea pig?
Bruce

I am running the BMW calipers with a 19mm MC. My brakes are fantastic.

[stugray]

I often laugh when people want to upgrade the stock brakes for a street car.

I raced my car with stock brakes for 1-1/2 seasons, and if the system is in good working order and you have even 'decent' pads, this car stops better than ANY of my other cars.

If you like the firmer pedal feel, then upgrade your MC to the 19mm and get Porterfield pads all the way around.
If you want superior stopping power, get KFP Gold pads, but be prepared to hear squeaking.

I have stock front calipers all the way around, 19mm MC, and still use the prop valve on the rears.
I run the KFP pads on the front and Porterfields in the rear, and my car stops faster than almost any other car in my class. (with Hoosiers of course)
Like Dave says above, if you can lock the brakes, then the brakes are good enough, get better tires.

[1stworks]

Looking to upgrade my present brake system but I want to keep it 4 lug AND keep the parking brake. Not to mention, staying out of the Poor House at the same time. I'm not opposed to moving up to a larger MC. Is there such an animal? TIA, Kent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I am working on aluminum billet hubs for four lug that will allow the use of BMW 320 calipers that will be modified for vented rotor use. They will use 911 1969-1976 20mm thick rotors. This will result in an economical upgrade package. Other than that you can go with the 320I calipers by modifying them to fit existing 914 struts. Estimating the hubs to be about $400 and calipers $200 , plus stock rotors $100 so the total will be in the $700-800 range. Prices are only an estimate pending on machining time and material cost. This was based on the Brad Robert design hubs which I recently acquired sold sets of the five lug recently.
I have sold several sets of the BMW calipers with customers staying with the 17mm master and they reported a greater brake pedal modulation. Upgrade to 19mm is not needed but would maintain the same pedal feel if you did got to a 19mm.
Looking for a test car to try it out when the first prototypes are produced.
Wanna be the Guinea pig?
Bruce

If be very interested in brake upgrade for front with vented rotors.

[Racer]

Someone once told me, "If you can lock the tire, you have enough brake"


Beyond that, most improve their brakes more for the heat soak and need to stop repeatedly from high speeds. A few quick stops on the street aren't usually enough to warrant most brake upgrades.


That said, you might find that better pads are alone all you need. What pads are you currently running?

[draganc]

Someone once told me, "If you can lock the tire, you have enough brake"
.
Beyond that, most improve their brakes more for the heat soak and need to stop repeat

+1, that's all you need at 20,30, 50 and 65 mph.

[Elliot Cannon]

Someone once told me, "If you can lock the tire, you have enough brake"
.
Beyond that, most improve their brakes more for the heat soak and need to stop repeat

+1, that's all you need at 20,30, 50 and 65 mph.

Yup. True. So why do I have aluminum "S" calipers in front and aluminum 914 6 calipers in the rear (thanks Eric) both front and rear on vented 911 rotors? Why?? Because it looks KOOL. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
Stop on a dime, give ya 9 cents change. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

[Dave_Darling]

Why you ask? On a back road, I scared the shit out of myself a few month's back when I was teaching a BMW a lesson.

So it just didn't slow down enough? In that case, see my earlier post. Good tires, and a system in good shape will do it. Plus decent pads.

--DD

[ThePaintedMan]

Bruce, count me in. I am worried, since I track the car, about the heat generated with the extra power (from the Suby) and solid rotors. I already did the 320 calipers when I first got the car. They've been a nice heat sink (more metal than the stock calipers), but that's just with a stock Type IV.

The other obvious solution for most people is just to go 5-lug, but that would require 2 new sets of wheels as well for spares. This vented 4-lug setup is a better option for me personally.

Other than that, totally agree - on a street car, no need for anything but a fully, well-functioning stock braking system and a driver who knows how to modulate the brakes.

[mbseto]

...On a back road, I scared the shit out of myself a few month's back when I was teaching a BMW a lesson.

Wouldn't mind hearing this story...

:-)

[VaccaRabite]

100% serious. Have Eric rebuild your stock calipers. Use good pads. Do NOT replace the prop valve with a T fitting. Replace your tired soft brake lines. Bleed until the pedal is rock solid.

On a stock car, if your brakes are in good working order, the brakes work very well, and will out brake a lot of modern cars.

I'm running 205/60 tires, and can lock them up at will or modulate easily.

Zach

[zach914v8]

Bruce put me on the list please.

[StratPlayer]

I'm running the BMW 320i calipers up front, have had them on there for about 15 years.

[Elliot Cannon]

I'm running the BMW 320i calipers up front, have had them on there for about 15 years.

This was also my first brake upgrade. I also installed a "T" in the lines and threw the prop. valve away. But then again, I'm not a expert. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smoke.gif)

[914_teener]

Someone once told me, "If you can lock the tire, you have enough brake"


Beyond that, most improve their brakes more for the heat soak and need to stop repeatedly from high speeds. A few quick stops on the street aren't usually enough to warrant most brake upgrades.


That said, you might find that better pads are alone all you need. What pads are you currently running?

I would agree that locking the tires up indicates enough brake....I might disagree if the context meant effective braking.

[ClayPerrine]

On Betty's car we have the stock 4 lug brakes. Calipers rebuilt by PMB, pads supplied with the calipers, and a T fitting in the rear. Proportioning valve has been gone for over 15 years at the recommendation of the late Wes Hildreth.

The car stops great. Easy to modulate. Reliable, and the park brake works. It is definitely enough brakes for a /4 powered car.

Only problem is the pads squeal, and Betty doesn't like it. I need to put some Smurf Stuff on the backs of the pads to stop the squeal.

[Dave_Darling]

I would agree that locking the tires up indicates enough brake....I might disagree if the context meant effective braking.

If you lock the wheel, there is nothing more than the brake can do for you in that particular application. And frankly, if you can't lock the brakes on a 914 then something is wrong with the system!!

Any improvement is either going to be to the feel of the pedal, the pedal effort, how easy or difficult it is to modulate to keep on the edge of lock-up, and heat management. Not to stopping. Heat management is important on the track, but it's a very rare street drive that causes stock brakes to overheat...

Then again, the Big Red brakes with cross-drilled rotors are a look that some people like, and they will do those upgrades just for the looks. Just remember that a heavier system can actually increase your stopping distances if it's heavier enough!

--DD