Brakes, tell me something Options

[Brad Roberts]

QUOTE

Anybody wanna tell me what brand of pad to use?

I like Porterfield. Race Compound.


B

[Aaron Cox]

QUOTE (Brad Roberts @ May 2 2005, 08:56 PM)

Aaron, Help me out.. QUOTE unless you buy mueller ™ hubs, and vented M calipers Mueller did the drawings and test fit one of his Mazda calipers. It pretty much ended there. B

the billet hubs.... M calipers/SC rotors you know?

[SirAndy]

QUOTE (Brad Roberts @ May 2 2005, 08:01 PM)

I cant say antyhingnlkwenqRQGK (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-2-1115092891.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) ask and you shall receive ...

hey trek, still wanna hang out this week while you're down here in my neck of the woods?
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beerchug.gif) Andy

[Trekkor]

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad2.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/screwy.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/mueba.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif)

Figure that out...

My air dam is cool.
"Go get your own".

So, 16 month old unknown brake fluid without being bled is bad, then?

KT

ps, I'll bring the videos. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

[Joe Bob]

I was running a 2800 lbs tail dragger with stock SC brakes....which most 914/6 use.
FRESH ATE blue, Ate power slot rotors and Porterfield pads.....nary a hiccup for three run groups. BTW...speed bleeders are a gud thang.

ATE makes fluid in blue and gold...change colors each flush and you know when you got a clean stuff.

I have a splitter up front with air ducts for the brakes....keep the dam but vent it for some brake cooling. Since you like to fabricate...consider some ducting attached to the dam that would direct air to the rotors.

Prolly worth another five page thread. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif)

[Trekkor]

QUOTE

Prolly worth another five page thread.

Night of the living thread... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/vampire.gif)

KT

[Andyrew]

Soo.... SS lines are better than rubber lines?







(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/happy11.gif)

[Brett W]

Alright, here goes

Leave the air dam on and put some ducts in, to run for cooling air. This will keep the air out from under the car at speed and keep the brakes cool. You can always block them off on the street.

Call Hawk and get some Hawk HPs or Blacks depending on how long your sessions are. They will work well on the street as well.

Stainless lines, put an adjustable prop valve in the back so you can tune the brakes and step up in master cylinder size. You might also look at adding a Stewart lock-resistant brake valve.

Ford Heavy Duty brake fluid has a dry boiling point of 585 or something like that. It is also very cheap. I have used it on many race cars with no problems. The GTU RX7 that I maintain used it last weekend at the Mitty to take first in class. As long as you keep the brakes bleed you will be OK.

Or you could always bite the bullet and upgrade to these:

[neo914-6]

QUOTE ("Z" @ May 2 2005, 08:24 PM)

I have a splitter up front with air ducts for the brakes....keep the dam but vent it for some brake cooling. Since you like to fabricate...consider some ducting attached to the dam that would direct air to the rotors.

Bill P had dryer ducts to the brakes on his/my car...

[Brad Roberts]

QUOTE

put an adjustable prop valve in the back so you can tune the brakes

and after 3-4 events of playing with the settings.. you will end up with it wide open (which is why I skip all the BS of trying to plumb one in to only find out I need to set it wide open)

This is just experience talking. I know lots of people with adj. prop valves in their cars... the common demonimator ? they run them wide open (especially in the 6 cyl cars)

Save your money.

The other way to control bias:

Run sticky pads up front and run Pep Boys crap in the rear.. or vice versa depending on what you want.


B

[Trekkor]

Just curious, did Chris' race car run a tee? His brakes felt really solid.

You said you'd stand the car on it's nose. You weren't kidding. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif)

KT

[Eric_Shea]

Just Autocross? Stock brakes should be fine. Get the mongo fluid and pads.

If it twas my ride I'd go with "Mueller Hubs" (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/hide.gif) (sorry Brad... I only tease ya if'n I like ya) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

Seriously... minimum I would have on that car is M-calipers up front and a T-fitting. Drew's set-up would be my choice... cept;

Drew, if that's a stock -6 caliper you have on the rear then those SC calipers won't do anything for you. They still have the same 38mm pistons that your -6 calipers have. It wasn't until 84 with the Carrera's that they changed that piston to 42mm. If they're -4 calipers then that's another story and that's a good swap. And... if they're the later Carrera rears you may want to think about that proportioning valve again. Especially with A or S-Calipers up front. Just thinking (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/idea.gif)

[nebreitling]

doesn't seem like anyone here is really fretting much over brake bias. it would seem to me that this would be a crucial variable, depending on how the car is setup, how it transfers weight, etc...??? am i wrong, making too big a deal out of this?

[Eric_Shea]

I think you're right but my last post was pretty much biased toward bias (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) I like:

M-Calipers - -4 Rears - T-fitting
M-Calipers - -6 Rears - P-Valve
A or S-Calipers - -6 Rears - T-Fitting
A or S-Calipers - M Rears - T-Fitting
A or S-Calipers - Carrera Rears - P-Valve
930 Calipers - Carrera Rears - T-Fitting

I agree with the hub designer, thinkerupper guy... The adjustable P-valves are too often set wide open. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beerchug.gif)

[Brad Roberts]

QUOTE

Just curious, did Chris' race car run a tee?

He does have a tee in place. He *talked* about a running a bias valve, because he felt something weird with the car in ONE corner of the track. You dont drive around the course adjusting the brake bias for evey corner so it doesnt really make sense to have great braking for 14 corners out of 15.

My all time favorite: Carrera fronts on the rear.. turbo 944's up front. From there I go into full blown custom braking setups with Colemans or something.


B

[ArtechnikA]

QUOTE (VegasRacer @ May 2 2005, 10:47 PM)

7.) Street or 'sport' pads are no substitute for real Track Pads.

or vice versa.

running real Track Pads will probably have you blowing through the first corner at an autocross (which is the venue in question). track pads work great when they're hot but are less effective when they're not.

i agree with your other points without qualification.

there are racing classes that require stock, solid rotors, and they can be made to last, but it involves properly engineered and fabricated cooling. i haven't seen anything lately that indicates to me that the methods shown in Carroll Smith's "Prepare To Win" (his first book, now ~30 years old) can be improved on much.

[davep]

What I don't understand is people not changing brake fluid before each event. Reports from WCC and several other events mentioned old brake fluid. Even for a street car, change the fluid twice a year. Track cars, before each event. It is the cheapest insurance known. It gives you the chance to inspect all the brake lines and other parts of the system.

[drew365]

QUOTE ("Z" @ May 2 2005, 08:24 PM)

ATE makes fluid in blue and gold...change colors each flush and you know when you got a clean stuff.

The ATE Blue can says Racing Fluid, the Gold can does not. Are they the same fluid, they have the same boiling point.

[grantsfo]

QUOTE (Brad Roberts @ May 2 2005, 07:53 PM)

QUOTE I have to agree with Eric, change to larger brakes and change out your fluid and M/C. A fast car is only as good as it's brakes. A proper stock system with GREAT pads will work just fine. John, You nailed it. The next "greatest" thing is the unltra expensive Castrol brake fluid. There is nothing wrong with the stock brakes. Trekkor fits in the same category as everyone else who has brake issues: 1.shitty fluid 2.shitty pads 3.worn stock components All this adds up to a person who compounds the issue by hanging on the brake pedal because the car wont stop. Get GREAT pads. Replace the lines. Get a tee. Put a 19mm in. B

I'm with Brad on this one. Stock 914 brakes are pretty darn good when you maintain them. SS lines and good fluid are religion for me. I have Porterfields on the front and I think you have seen me locked up going into fast corners. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif) I just need to get some of those pads on the back soon so my bias is balanced.

[Jeroen]

First, you deserve a couple of good smacks on the ol nuggin' for not changing your brake fluids before the track event
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/slap.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/alfred.gif)
There you go... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

Like the others said...

ATE Super blue racing (changing with "gold" when flushing)
duct that snowplow and get some cooling air on yur rotors

If that don't help (still got fading), THEN you need to look into bigger brakes/rotors

SS lines won't help in keeping your brakes cool, but they can frim up the pedal a little