123 Distributor Group Buy Thread, Replacement for NLA stock Dizzy's-Order 15 % Discount Options

[Millerwelds]

Vacuum ports on a distributor should never be capped. On any car. Ever.

Either left open, or connected via a hose to the intake/plenum/wherever.

Never capped.

No really. Never. Spread the word.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ph34r.gif)

To clarify in my case the ports on the throttle body are capped. The port on the dizzy is not.

[Millerwelds]

Why didn't you choose setting B? I have a 1.7 and I used setting 2 according to the Bosch part No. chart.

In referencing https://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/djetparts.htm
It shows Porsche part # 039 905 205 A as the correct dizzy for my car (mine had been replaced by a different unit previously) and 0 231 174 011 as the Bosch part number

The 123 manual shows both switch 2 and switch B as being for the Bosch 0 231 174 011.
Both show the same advance start of 1000 and max advance of 2700/22,0.

I took that to mean the 2 setting use the same curve and the only difference is if the vacuum is positive or negative. Since I am not planning on using the vacuum port I assumed I could use either setting with the same results...

I am no expert by any means so if I am missing something I'd love to hear it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[123ignitionusa]

Hey Good News
All orders but four hit the post today...Unfortunately Fedex lost 13 units out of the boxes coming with the Group Buy Order. I filled the purchases in the order in which they were placed. Unfortunately there are four who have been notified that they will experience a delay until I can get the lost units replaced. Unless you got an email your unit has been shipped. Thanks so much! I will try to expedite this debacle and keep those informed when I know more. Any questions feel free to call or text Ed 440-668-8164
Hope this helps (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)
Ed

[123ignitionusa]

Just to confirm, you don't need to relocate oil line, you can see the clearance in one of my pics, However, I did have to file away a little of the fan shroud near the base of the dizzy. I couldn't get it to sit flush on the case. The washer/spacer on the 123 is a little bigger than a stock dizzy shaft.

JMT
Do you have the OD of the stock dizzy where you had to file away?

[914_teener]

Why didn't you choose setting B? I have a 1.7 and I used setting 2 according to the Bosch part No. chart.

In referencing https://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/djetparts.htm
It shows Porsche part # 039 905 205 A as the correct dizzy for my car (mine had been replaced by a different unit previously) and 0 231 174 011 as the Bosch part number

The 123 manual shows both switch 2 and switch B as being for the Bosch 0 231 174 011.
Both show the same advance start of 1000 and max advance of 2700/22,0.

I took that to mean the 2 setting use the same curve and the only difference is if the vacuum is positive or negative. Since I am not planning on using the vacuum port I assumed I could use either setting with the same results...

I am no expert by any means so if I am missing something I'd love to hear it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Well I noticed that and I was wondering because this dizzy will eventually be going on a 2.0 with a 74 D-jet setup. Right now it is running flawlessly on setting 1 on a 1.7. I mistakenly posted it was on 2. It is set on 1. Too much holiday cheer I quess.

A little research has gleaned this, mostly from this site. Which port to use off the TB, advance or retard. On the 1.7 I used only the advance port off the TB as that is how I interpreted the table even though the distributor it replaced had a combination vacuum can. I just plugged the hose on the PLENUM side, NOT the dizzy side. Oh...BTW...NEVER plug the nipple on the dizzy side......spreading the word, although it would be nice to lnow why (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

So with that being said, I have a TB with two ports one for advance and one for retard. I would assume for the 2.0 build I would also use the advance port for the dizzy vac port.

I can only assume that you would use the letter setting when you had only the retard port on the TB? Maybe someone can confirm.

I can confirm this with the advent of our Thanksgiving heat wave here in So Cal. In 96 deg heat uphill on part load and at cruise there were no issues with pinging or other issues.

[Dave_Darling]

On the stock distributors, you don't plug the ports on the distributor dashpot (vacuum thingie) because that keeps the diaphragm inside the dashpot from moving as freely as it is supposed to.

When the factory discontinued the vacuum advance on the 914, they ran a hose from that fitting down under the plenum, and left it disconnected. The hose seems to have been used mostly to keep people from freaking out about a bare fitting...

--DD

[914_teener]

On the stock distributors, you don't plug the ports on the distributor dashpot (vacuum thingie) because that keeps the diaphragm inside the dashpot from moving as freely as it is supposed to.

When the factory discontinued the vacuum advance on the 914, they ran a hose from that fitting down under the plenum, and left it disconnected. The hose seems to have been used mostly to keep people from freaking out about a bare fitting...

--DD

Thanks Dave. Of course. It would freeze or limit the advance plate so it wouldn't move as much from the centrifugal advance.

This could be troublesome. Holiday cheer IS wearing off.

[914_teener]

On the stock distributors, you don't plug the ports on the distributor dashpot (vacuum thingie) because that keeps the diaphragm inside the dashpot from moving as freely as it is supposed to.

When the factory discontinued the vacuum advance on the 914, they ran a hose from that fitting down under the plenum, and left it disconnected. The hose seems to have been used mostly to keep people from freaking out about a bare fitting...

--DD

...you mean a bare nipple.

[98101]

Soooo close. Still hoping some kind soul would be willing to help me with this:

3) As I understand it, the Bluetooth version arrives with an empty brain. Would anyone else with a similar engine as mine (2270, Dellorto 45s, Web hot street cam, cool Pacific NW climate a little above sea level) be willing to share your configuration tables with me?

or at least tables that would work the same as my 009 until I can optimize them?

[914_teener]

Soooo close. Still hoping some kind soul would be willing to help me with this:

3) As I understand it, the Bluetooth version arrives with an empty brain. Would anyone else with a similar engine as mine (2270, Dellorto 45s, Web hot street cam, cool Pacific NW climate a little above sea level) be willing to share your configuration tables with me?

or at least tables that would work the same as my 009 until I can optimize them?

This thread has some good info.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=319841

[McMark]

Yup, Dave's got it.

The vacuum chambers (of any sort) are obviously sealed, except for the port/tube. When you apply vacuum to the chamber, it pulls the advance mechanism. When you leave the port open and disconnected, changes in the advance mechanism (because of centrifugal advance) will essentially work backwards down to the vacuum diaphragm. These movements of the vacuum diaphragm force air in and out of the vacuum chamber. If the port is plugged, you're restricting that movement because not the vacuum chamber is sealed and it become a pressure chamber. That pressure buildup can have erratic effects on timing as the air pressure tries to force the advance mechanism back.

Maybe this would be clearer. If you take a plastic soda bottle, and you cap it, you can't squeeze it like you can if it's not capped. The vacuum advance mechanism is meant to move, so if you cap it you're stopping or reducing the movement of the whole advance mechanism.

[98101]

I wish I got in on the buy before I realized i need one of these...any chance for another group buy for black Friday special?
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

For those who missed out use 914world5 for a 5% discount. If your group reaches 5 units then 10%. Offer expires Dec 3rd.
Hope this helpEd

OK, I placed my order. Looks like we're still in 5% discount territory.

I didn't order the coil because the car already has a 2010 Pertronix "Flame Thrower." Let me know if this wouldn't work.

If anyone's in the Seattle area and wants to make sure I don't screw up the install, I'll be happy to drive to your place (on a less rainy day... car isn't set up for rain).

I'm guessing my car has issues beyond ignition timing but maybe easier to fix those things with decent timing set up.

--Michael, novice in Seattle

[rfinegan]

I hope to get my order in right before the deadline this week end...

[123ignitionusa]

For those replacing the Bosch 009 here is the curve for that. It is from the TUNE Software but the values can be loaded into your Bluetooth. It will be a good starting point. No vacuum on this curve
http://123ignitionusa.com/content/Example5.xml
Here is a link to the download curves page. Somewhat limited but there is one near the bottom for an 009 with vacuum too.
So far only one on the next group buy.
Hope this helps
Ed

[Dave_Darling]

...you mean a bare nipple.

HEY! Take that to the Sandbox!!!



(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol2.gif)


--DD

[stevend914]

Hey Good News
All orders but four hit the post today...Unfortunately Fedex lost 13 units out of the boxes coming with the Group Buy Order. I filled the purchases in the order in which they were placed. Unfortunately there are four who have been notified that they will experience a delay until I can get the lost units replaced. Unless you got an email your unit has been shipped. Thanks so much! I will try to expedite this debacle and keep those informed when I know more. Any questions feel free to call or text Ed 440-668-8164
Hope this helps (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)
Ed

One of the four - oh well - I wasn't in a hurry anyway

[pete000]

Interesting that the Richie Ginther 914-4 modified the stock distributor by removing the vacuum canister altogether.

Also removed the FI harness due to Carb conversion.

[98101]

Interesting that the Richie Ginther 914-4 modified the stock distributor by removing the vacuum canister altogether.

I thought it might be useful to experiment with vacuum advance, but Mark Henry suggests it might not be useful for my carb and cam set up.
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?s=&...t&p=2552875

[BillC]

Curve 1 or curve A?

I have a '73 1.7 with factory D-Jet injection. The stock distributor is a Bosch 007. The booklet that comes with the 123Ignition distributor shows two choices for that distributor: 1 and A. If I'm reading the booklet right, curve 1 is vacuum advance and curve 2 is vacuum retard. Which is the correct curve to choose on the distributor: 1 or A?

I think curve 1 (vacuum advance) is the correct one, but thought I should double-check just to be safe.

Thanks!

[914_teener]

1 and use the advance port for the dizzy.