OT: where to buy American made tools, Sears is going bust! Options

[JOEPROPER]

As far as hand tools... Snap-On is the best. Yes, they're expensive, but how much do you value you're knuckles? I think Snap-On is a great investment. They don't go bad, are always under warranty and the company is very strong, not going anywhere. Specialty tools and such are a different story and should be purchased carefully, but like I said Snap-On hand tools are the way to go.

[Jett]

+1 snap-on is our choice. We were lucky to get a discount from the local vocational school my wife attends to enhance her welding skills. For a $1900.00 course we received $50% off of Snap-on tools up to $12K.

My brother also runs a large mechanics shop and has always used either Snap-on or Ingersoll Rand (air tools).

[sithot]

+1 snap-on is our choice. We were lucky to get a discount from the local vocational school my wife attends to enhance her welding skills. For a $1900.00 course we received $50% off of Snap-on tools up to $12K.

My brother also runs a large mechanics shop and has always used either Snap-on or Ingersoll Rand (air tools).

If you find the right Snap On dealer they will "play ball", especially if they're not having to "carry you" on the books. The dealer I used is a fine person and a good businessman when it comes to selling. He's not in love with inventory. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[TheCabinetmaker]

I have used thorsen tools for years. Best end wrenches I've ever used.

[flyer86d]

I totally agree with JoeProper. I had more faith in my Snap On tools not breaking and injuring myself. My next door neighbor (to the shop) had a 1 ton Dodge rack body 4x4 that needed front pads, rotors and front axle u joints. My big impact would not remove the front axle nut so we put my 3 foot 1/2” Drive Snap On breaker bar on the socket and added a six foot pipe to that. My next door neighbor, who is not a pound under 300 lbs, was hanging on the end of the pipe with his feet off the ground with the truck in the air on the lift. That broke the nut loose. The breaker bar and socket were undamaged. Vermont rust is better than Locktite!

Charlie

[sithot]

I totally agree with JoeProper. I had more faith in my Snap On tools not breaking and injuring myself. My next door neighbor (to the shop) had a 1 ton Dodge rack body 4x4 that needed front pads, rotors and front axle u joints. My big impact would not remove the front axle nut so we put my 3 foot 1/2” Drive Snap On breaker bar on the socket and added a six foot pipe to that. My next door neighbor, who is not a pound under 300 lbs, was hanging on the end of the pipe with his feet off the ground with the truck in the air on the lift. That broke the nut loose. The breaker bar and socket were undamaged. Vermont rust is better than Locktite!

Charlie

LOL!

[NoEcm]

All USA made Craftsman Tools at least 25 years old. See if you can figure out what's wrong with them before scrolling down for the answer(s).



























1. 1/2" drive, 15mm, 36 point socket (this was supposed to be a 12 point socket but got forged 3 times)

2. Round drive, 5/8, 12 point socket (this one missed getting forged on the 1/2" drive end)

3. Can you guess what this is? It came in a package with other 1/2" drive sockets

4. 3/8" drive, 3/8", 12 point socket (the 3/8" drive end and the socket end are reversed and the drive end walls are now very thin)

5. 3/8" Drive, 7/16", 12 point socket (this one got forged as a 6pt socket twice)

6. Round drive, 14mm, 6 point socket (this one missed getting forged on the 3/8" drive end)

7. 9/32" drive extension (circa 1935) This one fits nothing that I own. A 1/4" drive socket won't fit on the male end and on the female end it just falls off a 1/4" ratchet. To learn more: http://alloy-artifacts.org/craftsman-early-tools-p3.html

8. #1 Phillips screwdriver. Too bad the phillips blade end got inserted into the handle.

9. 3/8" drive, raw socket. This one did not get embossed with the size or forged on the socket end.

10. 3/8" drive, 3/8", 6 point socket (on the drive end it got forged twice so instead to being square it has 8 points)

11. Open end wrench where the size marking got reversed

12. 3/8" drive, 3/8", round socket (they forgot to forge the socket end on this one)

13. Round drive, 6mm, 6pt socket (The drive end got missed in the forge)

14. Forging flaw that made it all the way through the chroming process (no, this is not a tube wrench)

15. The 5/16 box end of the wrench missed getting forged. Great for turning round nuts

16. This is what happens when you use an 8' pipe as a cheater bar

[burton73]

I've been through several of my newer ratchets, but yet mine from 30+ years ago are hanging on. Overall for the money and the warranty, I still feel they have been a good deal, even recently.

One item I heard with the buy out is that B&D/Stanley would increase the number of Craftsman retailers, but warranty replacements would be up the retailer, thus some might offer life-time warranty for hand tools, and others might not. Seems odd if they really implement that scheme.

As for being made in China, keep in mind that the Chinese are capable of building high quality goods, and they are capable of making junk - just like the US.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Bob B

[gandalf_025]

Snap on is as big a rip off as Harley..
You want to drink the Kool aid, go for it..
Neither is worth the price....

[mepstein]

Snap on is as big a rip off as Harley..
You want to drink the Kool aid, go for it..
Neither is worth the price....

Yes but there’s are reasons it works. They come to you. That’s very appealing to a mechanic who doesn’t have to leave work to buy what they need. Even the young guys at our shop don’t seem to be very internet savy when it comes to buying on the web. They offer financing for everything, including the big expense tool boxes. Again, the guys at our shop don’t seem to be very savy about the cost of long term financing. At least for us, the rep will warranty most anything so at least the investment is usable for a long time without the hassle of traditional returns.

If you want a good deal on a tool box, ask the snap on, Matco, or Mac dealer for a repossessed box. They get them all the time, usually in great shape and the reps will deal since they already made their money once, the second sale is gravy for them and has already been written it off by the company.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Snap on is as big a rip off as Harley..
You want to drink the Kool aid, go for it..
Neither is worth the price....

Yes but there’s are reasons it works. They come to you. That’s very appealing to a mechanic who doesn’t have to leave work to buy what they need. Even the young guys at our shop don’t seem to be very internet savy when it comes to buying on the web. They offer financing for everything, including the big expense tool boxes. Again, the guys at our shop don’t seem to be very savy about the cost of long term financing. At least for us, the rep will warranty most anything so at least the investment is usable for a long time without the hassle of traditional returns.

If you want a good deal on a tool box, ask the snap on, Matco, or Mac dealer for a repossessed box. They get them all the time, usually in great shape and the reps will deal since they already made their money once, the second sale is gravy for them and has already been written it off by the company.

I got some great deals on Craftsman's boxes by going to the SEARS scratch and dent centers, it's mostly banged up washers and dryers, fridges, etc. But they have a small section of tool boxes and equipment. Like the blue one pictured, it had one door that was bent shut, it was more than 2/3 off regular price. Bog John worked the door for 30 minutes and it works fine, that was 10 years ago.
The red one is my sole inheritance from the late great Dr. Wright.

[flyer86d]

Snap on is as big a rip off as Harley..
You want to drink the Kool aid, go for it..
Neither is worth the price....

Yes but there’s are reasons it works. They come to you. That’s very appealing to a mechanic who doesn’t have to leave work to buy what they need. Even the young guys at our shop don’t seem to be very internet savy when it comes to buying on the web. They offer financing for everything, including the big expense tool boxes. Again, the guys at our shop don’t seem to be very savy about the cost of long term financing. At least for us, the rep will warranty most anything so at least the investment is usable for a long time without the hassle of traditional returns.

If you want a good deal on a tool box, ask the snap on, Matco, or Mac dealer for a repossessed box. They get them all the time, usually in great shape and the reps will deal since they already made their money once, the second sale is gravy for them and has already been written it off by the company.

Exactly Mark. I bought my Snap On tool box, my Snap On scissor lift, and my last tire machine used thru my Snap On dealer. If I wanted something and didn’t want to buy new, I would tell my Snap On dealer and within a couple of weeks, he would have it. I brought everything to my home shop except the tire machine and balancer. I don’t want to add up what I spent on tools but that’s the way I made my living at that time. One fellow that worked for me would buy Snap On tools on EBay used. The dealer would still warranty them. Expensive tools yes. But if you are in the business and needed them every day, it was the way to go.

Charlie

[Drums66]

All USA made Craftsman Tools at least 25 years old. See if you can figure out what's wrong with them before scrolling down for the answer(s).







.......Breaker bar 1st & 16. doesn't happen!(or 1/2" drive)



























1. 1/2" drive, 15mm, 36 point socket (this was supposed to be a 12 point socket but got forged 3 times)

2. Round drive, 5/8, 12 point socket (this one missed getting forged on the 1/2" drive end)

3. Can you guess what this is? It came in a package with other 1/2" drive sockets

4. 3/8" drive, 3/8", 12 point socket (the 3/8" drive end and the socket end are reversed and the drive end walls are now very thin)

5. 3/8" Drive, 7/16", 12 point socket (this one got forged as a 6pt socket twice)

6. Round drive, 14mm, 6 point socket (this one missed getting forged on the 3/8" drive end)

7. 9/32" drive extension (circa 1935) This one fits nothing that I own. A 1/4" drive socket won't fit on the male end and on the female end it just falls off a 1/4" ratchet. To learn more: http://alloy-artifacts.org/craftsman-early-tools-p3.html

8. #1 Phillips screwdriver. Too bad the phillips blade end got inserted into the handle.

9. 3/8" drive, raw socket. This one did not get embossed with the size or forged on the socket end.

10. 3/8" drive, 3/8", 6 point socket (on the drive end it got forged twice so instead to being square it has 8 points)

11. Open end wrench where the size marking got reversed

12. 3/8" drive, 3/8", round socket (they forgot to forge the socket end on this one)

13. Round drive, 6mm, 6pt socket (The drive end got missed in the forge)

14. Forging flaw that made it all the way through the chroming process (no, this is not a tube wrench)

15. The 5/16 box end of the wrench missed getting forged. Great for turning round nuts

16. This is what happens when you use an 8' pipe as a cheater bar

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif)

[Elliot Cannon]

I had Snap On tools issued to me when I worked on big jets in the Air Force. I still have the 1/4 drive ratchet. If I was a pro working in a shop, I would go with high quality tools. As for now I use the stuff from Lowes.

[Chris914n6]

For the past 30 years, the majority of my hand tools have been Craftsman. I've got a set of 1/2" drive metric sockets from Stanley, and most of my impact sockets are HF.
I can count the number of broken tools on one hand and half are user error -- like using a 12 pt 18mm plain socket on a motor mount bolt with a 2' breaker bar. I walked into Sears and traded it for a new one no problem.
My SnapOn/MAC/Matco/SK stuff is specialty, like wobble sockets that I know I will break again someday, and torx drivers that are easy to twist.
If I'm going to use an impact gun then I use an impact grade socket.
A pipe 'extension' is a redneck tool. PBblaster and a few hours of soaking has solved all my rusty nut problems.

But lately I've noticed the other Craftsman hand tools have a half price Generic Chinese equivalent, and given how little I use things like hose clamp pliers, I usually buy lowest price.
It's also easy to score Craftsman tools on ebay at a significant discount. Which is nice cause I'm a tool slut. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wub.gif)

[sithot]

Chinesium drill bits and these:

[914 RZ-1]

Wow. I had no idea there's be this many replies!

It seems that Snap-On is the favorite, with older Craftsman coming in next.

I just want to support American manufacturing and American companies. I get that we're in a global economy and that often we get "Made in USA out of global components." I can do a web search for "Made in USA tools", but I thought I'd see what everyone else thought/did.

Out of curiosity I priced out a #2 Phillips screwdriver from various brands:

Project Source (available at Lowes): $0.98
Harbor Freight: $1.69
Stanley $3.50 (made in USA)
Husky: $4.22
Kobalt: $7.35
Craftsman: $6-7
Proto: $8-9
SK: $12
Snap-On: $24

I get paying for good tools, but it seems most of us don't need the high-end stuff, unless we are doing this for a living. Even then, it seems a steep price to pay. I'm all for supporting American companies, but at what point are we being ripped off? $24 for a screwdriver?! WTF!? How is it that much better?

I've broken a Harbor Freight breaker bar, found a broken HF box wrench, stripped a few smaller Craftsman screwdrivers and broken a Kobalt screw extractor. I was not misusing any of them. All the stores gave me new ones/money back with no hassles.

I couldn't find any site that reviewed tools the same way Consumer Reports reviews items. Toolguyd.com, Garage Journal and a few others have forums in which they discuss them and posters chime in, but there is no formal testing. Anybody know of any sites?

I'd like to buy reasonably priced, American-made tools from a vendor that has easy, no-hassle returns. That used to be Sears.
There's a Harbor Freight everywhere it seems, but I've broken more of their tools than any other.
I could go with Husky or Kobalt, but they make most of their stuff in China.
Stanley makes decent tools, but I want to see what happens with them "re-shoring" their manufacturing. They have many "Made in the USA" tools, but they don't seem to have too many tools for automotive use.
Proto and SK can be bought online, but it seems like a hassle to return anything. I have to wait to send it there, then wait to get it back. If I need a tool now, I'm screwed.
I live in LA and have hardly ever seen a Snap-On, Matco or other tool truck anywhere. I'm not so sure they'll come to my house so I can buy one tool, either. I'm not sure I want to go to them; for the prices they charge, they should come to me.

Another option is to got to swap meets, but then I'm getting used/possibly abused tools.

Sigh...I guess I will wait and see what happens in the tool manufacturing world and what else you people all chime in with! Happy New Year!

[914 RZ-1]

This company makes a nice kit I picked up recently.

https://chapmanmfg.com
[/quote]

Thanks for the info. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) This is new to me. I'll have to bookmark them and check them out.

[914 RZ-1]

If you find the right Snap On dealer they will "play ball", especially if they're not having to "carry you" on the books. The dealer I used is a fine person and a good businessman when it comes to selling. He's not in love with inventory. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)


What do you mean by ""carry you" on the books"?

[914 RZ-1]

Snap on is as big a rip off as Harley..
You want to drink the Kool aid, go for it..
Neither is worth the price....

Yes but there’s are reasons it works. They come to you. That’s very appealing to a mechanic who doesn’t have to leave work to buy what they need. Even the young guys at our shop don’t seem to be very internet savy when it comes to buying on the web. They offer financing for everything, including the big expense tool boxes. Again, the guys at our shop don’t seem to be very savy about the cost of long term financing. At least for us, the rep will warranty most anything so at least the investment is usable for a long time without the hassle of traditional returns.

If you want a good deal on a tool box, ask the snap on, Matco, or Mac dealer for a repossessed box. They get them all the time, usually in great shape and the reps will deal since they already made their money once, the second sale is gravy for them and has already been written it off by the company.

1. Is someone telling these not so savvy young guys that they might be getting ripped off? Don't get me wrong, I agree that buying good tools is important, but financing them?! And how are they not web-savvy? Seems like they could get a good set of tools from Proto/SK (I think they have programs for students and apprentices) or even Home Depot/Lowes for way less.

2. Is it a good deal if it's still really pricey? How much is a used/repossessed tool box from Snap-On? Tool boxes seem to be one of those things that everyone makes well. Even Harbor Freight seems to have decent ones.

BTW, no disrespect/animosity intended or implied, I'm just asking/having an interesting discussion!