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> can somebody give me a crash course on carbs
Rouser
post Jun 28 2005, 08:57 PM
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QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jun 28 2005, 10:49 PM)
yeah but these arent gonna be brand new webers....

New ... old ... what's the difference? They're CARBS, and they're NOT NECESSARY.

Forget "getting some carb experience with this", THAT'S POINTLESS.

Eat crow and walk until you G-E-T_T-H-E_H-A-R-N-E-S-S.
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tat2dphreak
post Jun 28 2005, 08:58 PM
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QUOTE (Aaron Cox @ Jun 28 2005, 09:50 PM)
dude... Carbs on a FI cam suck.....

dont half ass it. go all the way, or not at all (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif)
no reversing....

yep, no giveseys backseys (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif) if you have to live with carbs for a bit to get the FI running so be it, but carbs won't make you happier, they will just displace your frustration...

btw CARB experience is a joke... you won't be able to apply it to FI later... don't end up like me, man!! I learned carbs when I was a kid and haven't invested time in learning FI... learn FI and forget the carbs

what is the REAL holdout? why would you really want to do this? that is what you should be asking yourself... learning carbs is not a good reason, to just get it going isn't even a great reason... either chose carbs because that is what you want the engine to be forever(or at least til the next rebuild) or because you already know carbs, or because you inheirted them...

you didn't inheirit and you don't already know carbs, and you already have a Full FI!
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tat2dphreak
post Jun 28 2005, 09:01 PM
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QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jun 28 2005, 09:52 PM)
if ya know latin (or lets say italian to be more applicable) you'll pick up more chicks... chicks dig a guy who knows how to work on carbs. I know hp will be put on the table, as will driveability, but i have lots of other things I need to work on and the 914 is kinda not at the top.....carbs will work for now, i have four places around me that do carb work.....and when i get my money together and get my stuff rebuilt....I will go back to FI.


I know FI is better, which is why i'm STILL a FI guy. I know alot about FI but learning latin sounds good too.

if you're trying to pick up a chick that digs carbs... she's either FAT (thinks your talking about doughnuts or something) or she MIGHT be batting for the other team (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

unless they are girls here... of course, but they know FI is a better choice too...
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bd1308
post Jun 28 2005, 09:07 PM
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(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif) yeah now that i think about it....


nothing i have now is matched according to the brad anders site....so i have to re-group and get everything matched, bc i am pretty sure that was a big reason why my engine ran like garbage when i used my stuff. the mps is good though.
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MattR
post Jun 28 2005, 09:21 PM
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QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jun 28 2005, 06:53 PM)
this guy surprises me all the time. For all i know he did switch the cams.

The cam on a type 4 engine is between the case halves. It requires a full rebuild to "switch" the cam.

I dont know FI well enough to give an opinion. I have 40 IDFs on my 914, but it hasnt been started up yet. I also have 40 IDFs on my 912 and it runs like a champ.

If you dont know what carbs they are, I BET they're going to be shitty carbs. If they are, dont pay for them. A single carb wont help you at all.
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bd1308
post Jun 28 2005, 09:28 PM
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it's definately NOT single carb setup...it's dual carb somethings....
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Rand
post Jun 28 2005, 09:35 PM
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QUOTE
chicks dig a guy who knows how to work on carbs


(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wacko.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol3.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolling.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/chairfall.gif)

Yeah baby, lemme show you how I work on carbs, then I'll walk you to the DQ for dinner...

I think I saw a pic of said chic in the sandbox...
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Gint
post Jun 28 2005, 10:05 PM
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You are soooooo screwed...

Take the money you're spending on carbs and their installation and buy a bike.
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bd1308
post Jun 28 2005, 10:10 PM
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i know....but when its all said and done and i die when my car gets engulfed in flames, i'll at least know that I have had a car with carbs.
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Rand
post Jun 28 2005, 10:13 PM
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...and a girl from the sandbox. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol3.gif)
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bd1308
post Jun 28 2005, 10:16 PM
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my girlfriend won't like me hanging with the grease-carb girl.....
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bperry
post Jun 28 2005, 11:59 PM
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Guys,
Sounds like on Friday he will have a car with dual carbs.
Lets at least help the guy a bit and stop trying to tell him what he
should do in a perfect world.

Britt, talk to your mechanic and ask him which carbs he will
be installing on your car. Weber IDFs and Dellortos are very popular.
If it is one of those jump over to the CB performace
website and order one of their Tech handbooks.
Weber Tech Book
Dellorto TechBook
It is great for understanding how they work and how to tune and
rebuild them.
They are only $10 so don't even think about not ordering one.
Haynes does have a Weber manual that you can probably get
locally but it is twice the cost and I don't think it is as useful.
In the mean time, while you are waiting for your book to come in,
jump over to the aircooled.net site and read all their technical
articles. They have lots of great information.
Aircooled.Net Tech Articles
In order to Tune the Carbs, you will need to have an air flow meter.
Lots of folks sell them and CB has them as well:
Flow Meter
This will get you started.
If you intend to maintain this yourself, there are some other
things that you will eventually have to know about the fuel
system and the ignition system.

If you don't already have one, I'd highly recommend getting
a timing light with 'advance' functionality. This will allow you
to set your timing because sometimes whacky performance issues
are actually ignition timing issues an not carburettor issues.

BTW, make sure you get ALL your FI parts back so that if you
do decide to go back to FI in the future you will at least have
a starting point.

You should also have you mechanic give you quick rundown on
exactly what he did so we can help you in the future.
Things like:
- Which carburettors
- VERY IMPORTANT: jetting:
(Venturi size, Emulsions, Idles, Mains, Air correctors)
- What distributor
- How was timing set, what was it set to?
- What fuel pump and where did he attach it for +12v power
- Is there a Fuel pressure regulator? what was pressure set to?


Hope that gets you going.

--- Bill
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bd1308
post Jun 29 2005, 06:19 AM
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thank you.
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ChrisFoley
post Jun 29 2005, 06:19 AM
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QUOTE (bperry @ Jun 29 2005, 01:59 AM)
In order to Tune the Carbs, you will need to have an air flow meter.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif) with everything Bill said except the quoted portion.
A piece of hose (fuel line works) long enough to go from your ear to the carb throats is enough equipment to synchronize the carbs. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)
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Pugbug
post Jun 29 2005, 07:20 AM
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I don't understand why you guys are so anti carbs. I am running Dellortos on my car mostly because that is what was on it when I got it, and it runs great.
If you run a stock cam then I guess the FI is better, but if you want to up the Hp with a more radical cam, then you need to run carbs, or an after market FI system.
I also agree with Bill. Just make sure your mechanic replaced the stock fuel pump with one designed for carbs, or you probably will go up in flames.
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Joe Ricard
post Jun 29 2005, 07:43 AM
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QUOTE (J P Stein @ Jun 28 2005, 05:45 PM)
Go watch an expert tune the carbs & have him explain what he is doing & why.....pay him exrta if you must. Turn some screws under his tutilage....or it's 6 months of hit & miss + insufficient info from books. I did it the latter way...just happy I didn't break anything (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/unsure.gif)

Yup me too. My 1.7l with original D jet ran SOOOO great. Well I wasn't happy with that so I put in my very modded motor with 44 IDF's. Yup ran so so and required constatnt tweaking. Started to run really good. swapped intakes and 40 IDF's. Coll now I get to do more tweaking and a bunch of head scratching and cussing.

Got it hauling ass Litterally. So I put the car back on jackstands and decided to weld up some shit.

Hope to be ready for race next week (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif)


Britt. WTF are you doing now? I coulda set up your whole motor for you if'n you learn to comunicate. and or LISTEN. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/poke.gif)
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tat2dphreak
post Jun 29 2005, 07:47 AM
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I'm not anti-carbs... if that what you already have... and I'm only for stock-FI on a stock engine... but if you have a stock FI and you have a stock engine, why invest the energy into carbs?

my thing was also that they are harder to learn than FI...

Britt, you should also do 1 thing before you get carbs on your car... if you want to learn them, rebuild one... you can get the kits for webers or dells at aircooled.net, read the article on that site about choosing your jets, and get the right ones(I know they should be slightly bigger than stock idles and mains on weber 40s) and rebuild them... this will give you a peek inside and you'll start to see how they work...
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bperry
post Jul 4 2005, 05:40 PM
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Britt,
So tell us. How'd it work out with the carbs?
What did you end up with?

--- bill
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Trekkor
post Jul 4 2005, 06:09 PM
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I've run both F.I. and carbs.

Both are great when they are working. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

In my case, I *have* dual triples and am happy with the performance. I have no intention of changing to F.I. on this motor. ( Why would I? )

Nathan runs his 2056 with duals- fast
Grant runs his 1.8 with L-jet- fast
Albert pulled his duals off his 2.0 and put them on his 1.8 with stock cam-fast.
Howard runs D-jet on his 2.0-fast
Demick runs D-Jet on his 2056-fast

Point is: a good running motor can be had with carbs or F.I.
The stock cam will be O.K. , too. Maybe not the best, but you should be able to produce a reliable driver in an afternoon.

Stop fooling around, and make us proud. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

KT
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TravisNeff
post Jul 4 2005, 06:10 PM
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I will agree with the books as a starting point. If the mechanic installs them and they work fine, don't fuck with them. Your car will most probably work a little differently from day to day with carbs (depending on how hot, humid altitude etc.). You will need a meter of sorts. Long ago I tried the hose thing but I really didn't know what I was trying to do, a meter would tell me a little easier - but that is just exposure and experience. You will need to know how to pull your idle jets, because you will need to blow them out every so often.

Carbs can be pandoras box just as FI has been for you, pick your poison.
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