Tracking the 914 - Happy New Year!, Turning this into a regular thing... Options

[infraredcalvin]

Spent last weekend at WSIR again, here’s 1 lap, chasing down some 911s and making a few of my own mistakes...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3R2fOphY1A

[infraredcalvin]

Car ran well in the AM, not so much in the heat, wasn’t too hot but she got harder to start at the end of the day. Sunday morning she fired up Like nothing was ever wrong...

Ready for the AM



Kills bugs, not quite as fast as a turbo...

[campbellcj]

Very cool, sounds like a fun time - I hope to join ya out on the track later this year.

[infraredcalvin]

That would be awesome! Hopefully in your teener, we need more rep out there, your car will certainly turn some heads!

[infraredcalvin]

Had 1/2 of a great weekend despite the heat. Was 115 Saturday, car ran warm but well. By Sunday, she only made it out one session before electronics succumbed to the heat. New lightweight battery, here we come! I was able to drag a friend out, he showed most of us up on his potent ‘57 speedster.

[infraredcalvin]

Skipped the race in Pahrump... onto Chuckwalla!

Beautiful start to the weekend.



Car was ready to go,



Day one, a bit disappointing in my afternoon sessions, off 5 Sec from morning sessions???

Day two, pushed hard, my best lap of the weekend, tried chasing down a spec boxster.... then it happened...



Kablooey! Looks like I’m in the market for a new engine... should I convert to a 6?

[GregAmy]

What are we looking at? What went kablooey?

The Type 4 oil pickup system is poor, and really sucks (actually, fails to suck) once you start putting some hard g-loading on it. Dry sump is really the way to go, and it's not very expensive or difficult.

If money is no object, go /6, you can build a monster engine with tons of power*. But if you have budget constraints then you can still make as good or more power from a /4 for the same amount of money.

GA


*But be careful: more power = more speed = I need bigger brakes = I need better suspension = I need more tires = I need more wheels = I need more fenders = I need more safety = I need big rollcage = I need less weight = I need to cut away panels = I need to fab more cage = divorce = how in the hell did I get here...?

[wndsrfr]

Go 2270 or 2316 (96mmx80mm stroker) for about 1/5 the price of /6 conversion. For another $2000 or so do a dry sump and you're more agile than a /6 anyway...

[infraredcalvin]

*But be careful: more power = more speed = I need bigger brakes = I need better suspension = I need more tires = I need more wheels = I need more fenders = I need more safety = I need big rollcage = I need less weight = I need to cut away panels = I need to fab more cage = divorce = how in the hell did I get here...?

I know, I’m going through that now. When I got the rear end repaired I had the bodyshop do some work on the hack job baseball bat rear flares. He did such a nice job I don’t want to go down the gt flare route with this car. I did make sure we could fit a 225 with a 3/4 in spacer though...

The pic is of all the oil coming from the top of the passenger side heads. The more I think about it, it could have been a high oil pressure issue. I had just made a mental note that the pressures seemed high just over 70psi about 30 seconds before the “pop”.

I need to drop the engine since the Fat shroud is covering everything topside. Speaking of Fat, I dropped by their shop to discuss a rebuild - yes I know their history, but I’m looking for a shop to assess the parts I have, if they’re any good anymore, most came from Fat or Scat...

[GregAmy]

He did such a nice job I don’t want to go down the gt flare route with this car. I did make sure we could fit a 225 with a 3/4 in spacer though...

I prefer the narrow body too. Can't use as much tire, but therefore can't spend as much money, either.

Speaking of Fat, I dropped by their shop to discuss a rebuild - yes I know their history, but I’m looking for a shop to assess the parts I have, if they’re any good anymore, most came from Fat or Scat...

I just sent FAT a short block last week (arrived Friday) for a build for my street car. Asking for a basic short block build with cam so we'll see how well it goes...buy some P&C and I've already got the heads.

So what's "the history"? I heard from reliabile soruces they are solid.

Last night I was thumbing through my October 1991 issue of "European Car" ("formerly VW&Porsche") - the 914 issue - and I spotted an ad from fat: "Dial 914. Cat FAT Performance. We're always ready to talk Type-IV...Send $5 today for our parts catalog. It's chock full of stuff too numerous to mention in this dinky ad.")

[infraredcalvin]

Go 2270 or 2316 (96mmx80mm stroker) for about 1/5 the price of /6 conversion. For another $2000 or so do a dry sump and you're more agile than a /6 anyway...

The current engine is (was) a 2165 (94x78), it was definitely tired as it was originally assembled in 1998, so this wasn’t a big surprise. I have a brand new set of 96mm JE pistons that came with it, that would push it to a 2258. All signs are pointing towards the 4 build unless all my good parts are toast.

Car has a 914-6 tank and runs a front cooler, with the tuna can I never saw any low pressure issues, and that’s running Big Willow and Fontana, both long high speed, high g tracks.

Since I like running with POC, there aren’t many older cars, so the other option is to sell this car and buy a used Cayman S and start upgrading. That’s a slippery slope as well, and defeats my original intent of spanking the new tech with my old 4 banger.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif) I just don’t want to start throwing too much $$$ into a lost cause.

[GregAmy]

The pic is of all the oil coming from the top of the passenger side heads.

You sure it's not just a popped breather hose? I've had two instances of valve cover hoses separating from the heads on the track...and it made a mess of the track both times. To resolve this at Lime Rock '19 I had to kinda-flare the aluminum fitting with a taper, glue on the hose to the fitting with adhesive, then drill a hole through the hose, clamp, and fitting and run a cotter pin across them then goop it up with silicon. Worked like champ for the weekend.

Next pair of valve covers will use TIG'd on AN fittings with screw-on hoses. That ain't coming off.

[infraredcalvin]

Wow, I hope so! What are your thoughts on 72ish psi oil pressure? I’ve always heard 10 psi per 1k rpm is typical for a street engine. I was only spun up to 5k when it popped....

[infraredcalvin]

Sorry I missed your post, I think the gal showed me your stuff, LOL. As for history, Fat used to be the “it” company for type IVs. Won numerous Baja races with their Volkswagen based builds. Short version is they got bought out and new mgt started cutting corners and some of the old timers. They bought a great machine co RIMCO and did the same, quality suffered for a few years till they got their act back together. Now they are supposed to be pretty solid. Just watch out cause parts avail / lead time and typical auto mech communication can ruin the experience.

Ever since I got my first teener at 20, I wanted a Fat built motor. They used to be down the street from where I grew up in Santa Ana, would go with my neighbor (he had a McDonald’s sponsored Baja bug he’d run in the 500/1000) to Fat and drool over their parts... had no idea what I was looking at back then, but it always stuck with me.

[GregAmy]

No thoughts on the oil pressure. Greater than zero and I'm happy.

Though, high oil pressure would not generally cause VC hoses to pop off.

I'd say put it on the trailer and take it to a car wash. Soap it all off with a car wash sprayer, fire it up and see if you have oil pressure. If so, then seek out the oil loss, starting at the heads' oil tubes, then valve covers/gaskets, block vent, oil tower, etc. If you still have oil pressure and no bangy-bangy noises then it doesn't sound fatal.

First time this happened the swaged tube itself pulled out of the head (2L engine). Second time was the hose pulling off of the VC fitting (1.7L engine so no head vents). And it was always the outside-of-the-turn head that had the problem (either tube pulling out or hose pulling off the VC) as I suspect the liquid oil was pooling in the top end and the case pressure was blowing it out.

Those head fittings are now threaded into the head for the 2L street car, and will be plugged off on the 2L race engine to use threaded VC hoses in the race car. It's always something. (the 1.7L was a temporary/borrowed F Production engine)

I got good vibes corresponding with "Dennis" at FAT about a build. Let's see if they come through.

[infraredcalvin]

Well, no such luck on the damage. I dropped the motor and the more I dug into it, the more I realized it was not going to be good...

First, there was a about half a quart of oil in my header...


Then I dropped the engine and noticed the crack in the shroud from an impact coming from the inside...


Then all the metal falling out as I took the shroud off...


Looks like I lost an exhaust valve, then all hell broke loose...

Hmmm decisions....

[mepstein]

Holy moly

[brant]

those "windows" in the case are a clear sign of the rod needing more space

[GregAmy]

Ooooowww....

"So what happened?"

"Cooling system issue."

"Oh?"

"Yeah, a rod went through the cooling shroud."

[campbellcj]

^^^

So this is basically why I went -6 after nervously running a -4 on the track for a couple years...

Re. POC it's gotten depressing how few older cars are out there - meaning 986/996 era is now "classic" and the action is in the BSR and 911 GT3 type stuff. I've thought about moving to a BSR or Cayman but would have to sell a car for budget and space and don't want to... I may go check out VARA next year as well (finally)