How hard is it to put a 2.4L -6 engine in? Options

[horizontally-opposed]

I went the stealth stock 4 route using Raby parts to bump up the HP to 120HP with Djet FI and heat. With close ratio transmission its plenty fast and great to drive. The only thing missing is the 6 sound which is okay as the wife likes the car quiet. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chair.gif)

^ Too funny—because I was just talking to a friend last night to say that, even with the factory airbox, a six-cylinder 914 is a less pleasant car on long drives vs a fuel-injected four. The mechanical music from that flat six is a bit, uh..., "present" in fifth gear at 70~ mph, where the Type IV's din of meh fades away on the freeway—making the 914-4 a great touring car. It's hard to say the same for a six, though ear plugs help.

Pick your poison. For how I use my 914, I'll take the Le Mans soundtrack, every time. And a pair of ear plugs for those rare long hauls.

[EdwardBlume]

I have both.... a 2056 /4 with SSIs (not hooked up) and a 2.4 /6 with headers. Both E tickets. I have a radio in both but they’re both worthless. I enjoy both equally. The /6 is special and I get a ton of thumbs up and hood gawkers.

I’ll be sad to see the ABM go which will be posted shortly. Like my silver 95 993, I will regret selling this one.... but it’s time.

[thelogo]

I would avoid the /6 conversion
Because you should have gotten one that was already done. Or it gets really expensive and time consuming..


Yes modern cars are stupidly too fast ...

But with the big /4 in stock or featherweight configuration . the 914 is pretty quick and way more maneuverable then 9o% of cars on the road today.


But as manfred v.richtoffen said .... Its not the quailty of the box , but the quality of the man inside the box.

So the driver is the main " component"

As most tesla drivers transition from a prius.
They are not up to the task.
Like going from karting straight to f1

Not a smart idea to assume all these lets go "green drivers" can handle the fastest accelerating car ever made....

[phillstek]

Hello,

I have the option of buying a 2.4L running engine from a 911T (F-model). The engine, with the carbs, is offered for $3900. First off, assuming I find nothing more about the engine, is this a reasonable price? (I asked already for compression, leak-down numbers, etc, I am waiting to hear the answers.)

Second, how hard is it to get this engine installed in my 1.7L 914 (is it even possible?) and is this an enormous project that will take my car out of commission for several years, or is this more like a month-long project? In a different 914 I did do a full engine rebuild (1.8L), how does converting to a -6 compare in terms of complexity of the project?

Thanks,
Andrei.

If that engine is good to go then it’s a great deal but getting an engine at a great price doesn’t make it any easier.

It’s a massive undertaking to do a 6 conversion that requires a significant commitment financially and/or skills wise to see through to a driving conversion.

Definitely not a ‘month long project’. You can count on delays and setbacks.

You need to ask yourself several questions: Is it something you’ve really, really wanted to do for a long time? Can you do it on your own? Sure you can pay someone but is it worth it?

Having said that, once done there’s nothing else out there that compares to a 6 powered 914. The chassis dynamics and the sound are unique, way better than any other air cooled transport I can think of.

[mb911]

If you are capable of doing yourself that would be the best case.. I think if you go no heat option then yes under 10k plus the engine.. I did one for a member here last summer and I did it waaaaaay to cheap.. Lessons learned and you will likely enjoy the process anyway..

[Tdskip]

Hopefully that engine is good, but I’ve not found many $3,900 911 engines that didn’t turn into $15-18,000 engines quickly.

If it checks out grab it and run!

[Superhawk996]

Hopefully that engine is good, but I’ve not found many $3,900 911 engines that didn’t turn into $15-18,000 engines quickly.

If it checks out grab it and run!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Yup, I got me one of those.

I knew that would likely be the case going into it so I'm completely fine. It won't run to the high end of Tdskip's price range since I do my own builds and the labor is "free" but I'm about $7K deep on case maching (welding + line bore + shuffle pins), rod rebuilds, and head worrk, etc.

The nice thing is that when it is done I should have a 2.4L that will last the rest of my lifetime and I'll know it's history.

[mb911]

Hopefully that engine is good, but I’ve not found many $3,900 911 engines that didn’t turn into $15-18,000 engines quickly.

If it checks out grab it and run!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Yup, I got me one of those.

I knew that would likely be the case going into it so I'm completely fine. It won't run to the high end of Tdskip's price range since I do my own builds and the labor is "free" but I'm about $7K deep on case maching (welding + line bore + shuffle pins), rod rebuilds, and head worrk, etc.

The nice thing is that when it is done I should have a 2.4L that will last the rest of my lifetime and I'll know it's history.

About same here on my 2.4.. The only regret I have is not going with aluminum cylinders and to be honest not sure why thats a regret.. Supertec had the cylinders nikisiled so almost like biral

[Bleyseng]

I would avoid the /6 conversion
Because you should have gotten one that was already done. Or it gets really expensive and time consuming..


Yes modern cars are stupidly too fast ...

But with the big /4 in stock or featherweight configuration . the 914 is pretty quick and way more maneuverable then 9o% of cars on the road today.


But as manfred v.richtoffen said .... Its not the quailty of the box , but the quality of the man inside the box.

So the driver is the main " component"

As most tesla drivers transition from a prius.
They are not up to the task.
Like going from karting straight to f1

Not a smart idea to assume all these lets go "green drivers" can handle the fastest accelerating car ever made....

Totally agree with you on Tesla drivers! A friend bought one and the four of us went to dinner. Oh my god his driving was terrible as it full throttle or on the brakes. After 10 minutes I was ready to puke!

[Superhawk996]

Totally agree with you on Tesla drivers! A friend bought one and the four of us went to dinner. Oh my god his driving was terrible as it full throttle or on the brakes. After 10 minutes I was ready to puke!

@Bleyseng

Before you're too hard on your Friend, Tesla's are notoriously hard to drive smoothly.

Tesla (and many EV's in general) have a setting to determine how hard the vehicle regenerates electricity by using the EV motor to establish reverse "engine" braking torque from the DC motors. If that setting is to maximum regen, any small lift of the throttle establishes a significant torque reversal. Tesla has basically creating a "one pedal" car. They are intentionally trying to encourage the driver not to touch the brakes but to use Regen to decel the vehicle and therefore pump energy back to the battery & extending range in the process.

Even when settting to minimum regen, the jerk upon reducing throttle is still very noticeable to me as the driver. Even more noticeable to the passenger that has no control and doesn't know when to anticipate the torque reversal.

Now combine that with the fact that a DC motor is much quicker to establish drive (or regen torque) than a conventional motor and you have a situation where the vehicle response gets jerky very quickly. Even with a well calibrated throttle foot.

The rate of car sickness in EV's is much higher than ICE. It's quickly becoming a huge problem in China as they are moving toward EV's much quicker than we are in the US.

Now he may still be a bad driver without ability to modulate his throttle foot well or simply jumps from throttle to brakes needlessly. I can't make excuses for that. That would only make an already bad situation even worse. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[mepstein]

Totally agree with you on Tesla drivers! A friend bought one and the four of us went to dinner. Oh my god his driving was terrible as it full throttle or on the brakes. After 10 minutes I was ready to puke!

@Bleyseng

Before you're too hard on your Friend, Tesla's are notoriously hard to drive smoothly.

Tesla (and many EV's in general) have a setting to determine how hard the vehicle regenerates electricity by using the EV motor to establish reverse "engine" braking torque from the DC motors. If that setting is to maximum regen, any small lift of the throttle establishes a significant torque reversal. Tesla has basically creating a "one pedal" car. They are intentionally trying to encourage the driver not to touch the brakes but to use Regen to decel the vehicle and therefore pump energy back to the battery & extending range in the process.

Even when settting to minimum regen, the jerk upon reducing throttle is still very noticeable to me as the driver. Even more noticeable to the passenger that has no control and doesn't know when to anticipate the torque reversal.

Now combine that with the fact that a DC motor is much quicker to establish drive (or regen torque) than a conventional motor and you have a situation where the vehicle response gets jerky very quickly. Even with a well calibrated throttle foot.

The rate of car sickness in EV's is much higher than ICE. It's quickly becoming a huge problem in China as they are moving toward EV's much quicker than we are in the US.

Now he may still be a bad driver without ability to modulate his throttle foot well or simply jumps from throttle to brakes needlessly. I can't make excuses for that. That would only make an already bad situation even worse. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

I experienced exactly what you described when I drove some of our schools hybrids and ev’s. The brake felt like an on- off switch.

[Superhawk996]

I experienced exactly what you described when I drove some of our schools hybrids and ev’s. The brake felt like an on- off switch.

@mepstein

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) Yeah that's another whole story. Some OEM's rather than do the heavy regen when you lift from the throttle do it when you touch the brake pedal.

Early in the stop they use the brake pedal to trigger the regen when the energy transfered to the battery is high. Later on as the vehicle slows, they do a transition between EV regen and the hydraulic brakes. Often that transition point isn't very smooth either.

Lot's of work and refinement still needed for EV's that is completly outside of the standard issues with range, availability of charging and the other usual gripes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/hissyfit.gif)

All of this is what makes me smile thinking about getting my 914 back on the road eventually with a sweet sounding six! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

[worn]

Hello,

I have the option of buying a 2.4L running engine from a 911T (F-model). The engine, with the carbs, is offered for $3900. First off, assuming I find nothing more about the engine, is this a reasonable price? (I asked already for compression, leak-down numbers, etc, I am waiting to hear the answers.)

Second, how hard is it to get this engine installed in my 1.7L 914 (is it even possible?) and is this an enormous project that will take my car out of commission for several years, or is this more like a month-long project? In a different 914 I did do a full engine rebuild (1.8L), how does converting to a -6 compare in terms of complexity of the project?

Thanks,
Andrei.

You still there? Let me know if I can help.
Warren

[Bleyseng]

Hmm, I didn't have problem when I test drove as model.

[thelogo]

[quote name='Superhawk996' date='Mar 3 2020, 04:49 PM' post='2791197']
[quote name='mepstein' post='2791191' date='Mar 3 2020, 07:43 PM']

I experienced exactly what you described when I drove some of our schools hybrids and ev’s. The brake felt like an on- off switch.
[/quote]

@mepstein

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) Yeah that's another whole story. Some OEM's rather than do the heavy regen when you lift from the throttle do it when you touch the brake pedal.

Early in the stop they use the brake pedal to trigger the regen when the energy transfered to the battery is high. Later on as the vehicle slows, they do a transition between EV regen and the hydraulic brakes. Often that transition point isn't very smooth either.

Lot's of work and refinement still needed for EV's that is completly outside of the standard issues with range, availability of charging and the other usual gripes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/hissyfit.gif)





















It's all shit from radio shack.
"The hurt locker"

[IronHillRestorations]

Back on topic. My.02 is that if you had all the tools, parts, and ancillaries; a 6 conversion could be done in a very short amount of time, a few weekends maybe.
But...it never goes like that. You always run into issues that need to be repaired or improvements you'd like to make.

[Tdskip]

Back on topic. My.02 is that if you had all the tools, parts, and ancillaries; a 6 conversion could be done in a very short amount of time, a few weekends maybe.
But...it never goes like that. You always run into issues that need to be repaired or improvements you'd like to make.

Oil tank and lines hardest part? Welding in the new engine mount?

[mb911]

Back on topic. My.02 is that if you had all the tools, parts, and ancillaries; a 6 conversion could be done in a very short amount of time, a few weekends maybe.
But...it never goes like that. You always run into issues that need to be repaired or improvements you'd like to make.

Oil tank and lines hardest part? Welding in the new engine mount?

Yes and wiring

[Larmo63]

I did a 2.4 /6 conversion so I know what is involved. I did most of it myself in my garage in my spare time. I like to think I did it right, too.

It is and/or can be: exciting, lots of planning, dreaming & thinking. Time consuming, wallet draining, worrying, frustrating, waiting, & impossible to finish. At the end and during first start-up; EXHILARATING AND SATISFYING!!!

All of the soul twisting you went through is quickly forgotten, believe me. I suppose it could be compared to childbirth? Lots of worry, then pain, then all forgotten when the healthy baby is bouncing on your knee.

Go for it. We're here to help.

[Tdskip]

Back on topic. My.02 is that if you had all the tools, parts, and ancillaries; a 6 conversion could be done in a very short amount of time, a few weekends maybe.
But...it never goes like that. You always run into issues that need to be repaired or improvements you'd like to make.

Oil tank and lines hardest part? Welding in the new engine mount?

Yes and wiring

2.4 with carbs doesn't need much wiring or fuel delivery work however, no?