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> T4 Engine tin: thermal design
914werke
post Mar 16 2023, 05:25 PM
Post #1


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So seeing a product recently got me thinking about the result of its application & my own observations of how well (or not) the T4 handles air flow, Engine block cooling & resulting oil temperatures. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Its somewhat well known that ...in the 914.. the T4 suffers from less than optimal cooling from the front mounted impeller/fan particularly to the #3 Cylinder
& that it is vitally important to seal the tins multiple openings to contain as much laminar air flow front to back over the finned cylinders.
In a gross approach, the goal was to seal the engine compartment "intake" air on top from the eng. heated "cooling" air below the tins.
When a motor is new and all its components serviced & refreshed, the design does, or did, a pretty good job.
After years of use (neglect), elements (oil dirt mice ext) conspire to restrict that air flow.
As well as eng. heat causing hardening of rubber pieces that are intended to help contain that cooling air below.
Now almost 50 yrs on I see fewer & fewer "STOCK" engine configurations which you can guess usually means more heat to deal with.
Jake addressed the cooling air via his(?) DTM solution, but IMO its not very practical for stock or near stock motors (& expensive)

The go-to response to eliminate that heat is usually an additional or a remote oil cooler which comes with its own set of challenges. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)
How about KISS (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Has anyone used any of the Fiberglass based stick-on reflective heat shielding products on the engine-sides of the tin?
Idea being rather than allow heat absorption to all the those steel pieces reflect it back to carried away by the cooling air?

BTW Im not a Porsche engineer...but I did stay in a Holiday Inn last night (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)
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914werke   T4 Engine tin: thermal design   Mar 16 2023, 05:25 PM
technicalninja   That's possible a good idea... Done right it m...   Mar 16 2023, 06:03 PM
mepstein   An oil cooler with a fan pack seems like the way t...   Mar 16 2023, 07:07 PM
Lockwodo   So seeing a product recently got me thinking abou...   Mar 16 2023, 07:37 PM
914werke   Not debating that adding oil cooling does the job....   Mar 16 2023, 07:43 PM
technicalninja   Not debating that adding oil cooling does the job...   Mar 16 2023, 07:52 PM
914werke   Wondering how to tell how well the tins are seale...   Mar 16 2023, 10:15 PM
Superhawk996   Bottom line: reflective heat shield on the interi...   Mar 16 2023, 11:13 PM
Superhawk996   I was thinking about this a little more. What m...   Mar 17 2023, 11:06 AM
Superhawk996   Still thinking about this. Not sure copper “tin...   Mar 17 2023, 11:38 AM
GregAmy   Coming from a background in general aviation...I s...   Mar 17 2023, 12:40 PM
technicalninja   Insulating the tin should mean less heating of the...   Mar 17 2023, 01:40 PM
Nogoodwithusernames   Might be a bit OT, but I've seen things on The...   Mar 28 2023, 02:08 PM
NARP74   Between those two 3/8" holes....I was pluggin...   Mar 28 2023, 02:34 PM
yeahmag   That's really interesting... Got any pictures ...   Mar 28 2023, 02:38 PM
Al Meredith   lets remember that oil has gotten much better in 5...   Mar 28 2023, 03:17 PM
emerygt350   lets remember that oil has gotten much better in ...   Mar 28 2023, 03:25 PM
emerygt350   Does an oil cooler do anything for head temps? Du...   Mar 28 2023, 03:21 PM
VaccaRabite   Does an oil cooler do anything for head temps? D...   Mar 29 2023, 05:48 AM
914werke   Coming from a background in general aviation...I ...   Mar 28 2023, 03:32 PM
Superhawk996   You could use the Fan that is already in the Eng ...   Mar 28 2023, 05:12 PM
DRPHIL914   You could use the Fan that is already in the Eng...   Mar 30 2023, 06:08 AM
Geezer914   Spark plug wire seals!! Plug those holes.   Mar 28 2023, 04:28 PM
914_teener   Jake and others use an exothermic coating on the c...   Mar 28 2023, 04:56 PM
Geezer914   Biral cylinders?   Mar 29 2023, 04:30 AM
914werke   B:)   Mar 29 2023, 09:02 PM
yeahmag   What am I looking at here? B:)   Mar 30 2023, 10:58 AM
ClayPerrine   If you want to improve the engine cooling, you nee...   Mar 30 2023, 08:15 AM
914werke   If you want to improve the engine cooling, you ne...   Mar 30 2023, 09:11 AM
technicalninja   That's the early pre-heater thing for addition...   Mar 30 2023, 11:40 AM
914werke   That's the early pre-heater thing for addition...   Mar 30 2023, 03:16 PM
r_towle   These are oil cooled engines using air. Complete a...   Mar 31 2023, 09:20 PM
searunner   These are oil cooled engines using air. Complete ...   Apr 1 2023, 04:40 AM
wonkipop   These are oil cooled engines using air. Complete ...   Apr 1 2023, 04:56 PM
emerygt350   You don't want low oil temperature though. Op...   Apr 1 2023, 02:19 PM
Superhawk996   You don't want low oil temperature though. O...   Apr 1 2023, 04:46 PM
searunner   You don't want low oil temperature though. O...   Apr 2 2023, 02:57 AM
914werke   Now almost 50 yrs on I see fewer & fewer ...   Apr 1 2023, 05:51 PM
wonkipop   Now almost 50 yrs on I see fewer & fewer ...   Apr 1 2023, 06:49 PM
r_towle   I found that it takes a lot of detailing to proper...   Apr 1 2023, 05:58 PM
emerygt350   The 912 comparison would be very interesting.   Apr 1 2023, 06:52 PM
914werke   I found that it takes a lot of detailing to prope...   Apr 1 2023, 07:13 PM
r_towle   I found that it takes a lot of detailing to prop...   Apr 1 2023, 08:51 PM
einic   Gene Berg performed several attemts to improve coo...   Apr 2 2023, 02:28 AM
930cabman   Gene Berg performed several attemts to improve co...   Apr 2 2023, 12:57 PM
914werke   :idea: To prove or disprove the theory that the O...   Apr 2 2023, 12:42 PM
wonkipop   :idea: To prove or disprove the theory that the ...   Apr 2 2023, 03:39 PM
914werke   Call me skeptical. The T1 was never installed in ...   Apr 2 2023, 01:09 PM
r_towle   Call me skeptical. The T1 was never installed in...   Apr 2 2023, 03:59 PM
moto914   Hi. My around town & ocasional 2 hr highway ru...   Apr 2 2023, 04:51 PM
r_towle   Hi. My around town & ocasional 2 hr highway r...   Apr 2 2023, 06:04 PM
914sgofast2   Hi. My around town & ocasional 2 hr highway ...   Apr 2 2023, 06:13 PM
wonkipop   [quote name='r_towle' post='3069295' date='Apr 2 ...   Apr 3 2023, 06:47 AM
Superhawk996   i'm sure the vw/porsche engineers had the op...   Apr 3 2023, 08:26 AM
wonkipop   i'm sure the vw/porsche engineers had the o...   Apr 3 2023, 06:02 PM
wonkipop   So seeing a product recently got me thinking abou...   Apr 2 2023, 05:04 PM
moto914   QUOTE(914sgofast2) good question. QUOTE(r_towle @...   Apr 2 2023, 06:56 PM
Superhawk996   @wonkipop You are correct. Black is indeed the...   Apr 3 2023, 08:19 PM
wonkipop   [b]@[url=http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?s...   Apr 3 2023, 09:05 PM
searunner   [quote name='Superhawk996' post='3069511' date='A...   Apr 5 2023, 03:25 AM
moto914   My opinion for the TWO deflector underside is that...   Apr 5 2023, 08:43 AM
wonkipop   @searunner yeah the 911 "tin" ware is ...   Apr 5 2023, 07:48 AM
wonkipop   @searunner to expand naively on the space shuttl...   Apr 5 2023, 08:09 AM
Mikey914   The 2 deflector design works very well. You have 4...   Apr 5 2023, 10:53 AM
914_teener   The 2 deflector design works very well. You have ...   Apr 5 2023, 12:57 PM
914werke   we added "winglets" to the design. Keepi...   Apr 5 2023, 01:57 PM
wonkipop   we added "winglets" to the design. Keep...   Apr 6 2023, 01:35 AM
Mikey914   To be clear that's a 3% increase in the effici...   Apr 6 2023, 09:42 AM


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