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> Aftermarket FI with Single Throttle Body, getting started ...
SirAndy
post Aug 21 2005, 11:52 PM
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sooooo, as some of you might know, i have been tinkering with the idea of putting a FI system on my hot cammed 2056 that utilizes a single throttle body and long intake runners (similar to the stock D-Jet setup).

the idea is that long runners promote more low end tourque (gud for AX) and the single throttle body makes tuning *much* easier ...

the initial idea was to reproduce the stock 2.0L runners with a larger OD for the bigger displacement engine plus a bigger size (volume) plenum.

this proved somewhat difficult and the quotes i got for fabbing such runners where in the $1500 - $2000 range for a "test" set. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif)

so i consulted a pro, and we came up with a slightly changed attack plan:

- short carb intake manifolds with welded on injector bungs
- cylindrical plenum on top of the manifolds on each side
- horizontal runners to a single center plenum
- single throttlebody

all sizes/volumes/length/dia. has been worked out to fit engines from ~2056 to ~2270, for bigger engines sizes would have to be changed ...

well, so far, the short carb intake manifolds with welded on injector bungs have been finished and they turned out great.
i hope the rest will follow soon (mostly held up by $$$ at this point)

attached are a few pics of the intakes and a schema of what the complete system will look like ...
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif) Andy


the manifold with the injector bungs welded on:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-11-1124689756.jpg)

injector angle, pretty much a straight shot at the valve:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-11-1124689795.jpg)

closeup of the bung:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-11-1124689837.jpg)

quick photoshop mockup of the layout:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-11-1124689719.jpg)
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redshift
post Aug 22 2005, 12:01 AM
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That is the Romulan Bird of Prey, from the original (children playing in space) Star Trek series.

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Trekkor
post Aug 22 2005, 12:02 AM
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QUOTE
closeup of the bung


Nooooooooooo!!!!
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redshift
post Aug 22 2005, 12:02 AM
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(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)
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Trekkor
post Aug 22 2005, 12:09 AM
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Seriously, Andy Brian with RR-PCA, who runs the red 914 with the 2.1 or 2.2 FOUR has adapted a Volvo TB to his car with very good results.


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SirAndy
post Aug 22 2005, 12:09 AM
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QUOTE (redshift @ Aug 21 2005, 11:01 PM)
That is the Romulan Bird of Prey, from the original (children playing in space) Star Trek series.

i knew you would figure out where i got the idea from ...

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif) Andy
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SirAndy
post Aug 22 2005, 12:11 AM
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QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 21 2005, 11:09 PM)
Seriously, Andy Brian with RR-PCA, who runs the red 914 with the 2.1 or 2.2 FOUR has adapted a Volvo TB to his car with very good results.

and how is a volvo TB going to help me with the volume of the plenum and the OD of the runners???

do you understand what i'm trying to build?
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Andy
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redshift
post Aug 22 2005, 12:16 AM
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Yes, I do.

You need a big, thick lead trashcan, and alot of CF to wrap it in, if you breach the warp core... only Kirk knows..



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Trekkor
post Aug 22 2005, 12:16 AM
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I prolly don't, but unless you enlarge the intake ports to match your new BIG runners, it may not make a differance... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif)

Can I have your Weber's? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/poke.gif)

KT
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redshift
post Aug 22 2005, 12:18 AM
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Trek, keep going man, I am so rolling around on the floor.. 2 times in months, where that poking smiley made me gag laughing.. the other was in the 4/6 thread, with Scott T



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jonwatts
post Aug 22 2005, 12:20 AM
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no rules, just wrong
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dammit jim
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SirAndy
post Aug 22 2005, 12:22 AM
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QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 21 2005, 11:16 PM)
I prolly don't, but unless you enlarge the intake ports to match your new BIG runners, it may not make a differance... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif)

no where in my post did i say i was going to use the stock TB ... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

i'm planning on enlarging the complete system to be able to handle the increased appetite for air my engine has developed ...

bigger OD on the runners, more plenum volume, bigger TB. goes with larger valves in the head and larger OD headers ...

should be fun when it's done. btw. the guy who's fabbing all this stuff for me builds drag-racing engines.

word on the street has it, he build a nice T4 turbo setup for a club-member as well ...
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif) Andy
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Trekkor
post Aug 22 2005, 12:22 AM
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I gotta keep the jabs to a minmum as I don't want him spearing me on the Go-Kart track tomorrow, getting us both black flagged...


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redshift
post Aug 22 2005, 12:39 AM
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Dood, are you kidding? If he charges you, just let him hit you, fall down, and we'll show them the picture of him with the green tongue..

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THE MEAN GERMAN HIT ME! (black flag on his morning!)


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jonwatts
post Aug 22 2005, 12:48 AM
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QUOTE (SirAndy @ Aug 21 2005, 11:22 PM)
word on the street has it, he build a nice T4 turbo setup for a club-member as well ...
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif) Andy

Stop, you're embarassing me.












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SirAndy
post Aug 22 2005, 12:55 AM
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QUOTE (jonwatts @ Aug 21 2005, 11:48 PM)
Stop, you're embarassing me

i didn't think that was possible ...

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif) Andy
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Jeroen
post Aug 22 2005, 05:30 AM
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how about using stock 90deg exhaust bends for the runners?
weld some flanges to them, so they bolt to your weber manifolds
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Sparky
post Aug 22 2005, 05:44 AM
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Sooo... 944 TB? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rocking nana.gif)
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DNHunt
post Aug 22 2005, 08:06 AM
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Hold on a little while Andy. I'm putting my 2270 in the car over Labor Day. Raby 2270 G kit. The intake is stock except for a 50 mm throttle body and I opened up the snorkel on the air box . Exhaust is the early Eurorace header into a small Magnaflow muffler. We'll see if it pumps enough air. When I had it in the car last winter it looked like it would work.

Dave
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Bleyseng
post Aug 22 2005, 08:21 AM
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Dave, I am sure it will run but....odds are it will run out of air at high rpms.


Interesting Andy, I think I can get my welder guy to fab up some stuff with bends in it so its four runner to the plenum from the carb manifold. (I have some of those laying around as backup if you other idea didn't work.)

I don't think larger valves is neede just a different duration on the cam to use the extra air. Huge intake valves just get in the way and slow down the intake charge. 44mm should be plenty big for anything and not disrupt the port speed. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smash.gif)
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