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> -6 Original Motor Convert?
1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 05:07 PM
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Hi everyone! This is a great source that i look at daily. Have a question for the experts.

Car: 73 2.0 with original motor, Weber 40 carbs (but have fully functional injection in boxes - wanted to play with carbs -sadistic), MSD 6AL ignition, Holley fuel pump, all braided fuel lines, inline fuel filter, headers, supertrapp, custom cage (driver compartment only right now with side bars), fuel cell, remote cooler up front with -10/AN lines running center of car, corbeau seats w/5-point harness, koni adjustables all around- 200lb springs in the rear, stock torsion bars (as far as i know)stock brake calipers, pagid orange pads, 19mm master cylinder, braided lines, fiber hoods and bumpers, includng the GT front end with cutouts for the correct shaped and ducted cooler, 2.0 fuchs w/ 205/50/15 kuhmo rubber and a set of 15x7 panasports (race) when i get the courage to flare. Car is almost exclusively used for track and autocross, although i plan to do an occasional weekend fun run starting soon (will register for this purpose - it isnt currently). Thats all i can think of to describe - trying not to get flamed for poorly formed question. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Opportunity: Original 2.0 from 6 cylinder car in family (read - free) with good heat exhangers and muffler. Motor has been sitting for 10 years in dry and controlled conditions, when father pulled it and put it an IMSA race motor and generally turned the car into a monster; he races the car in several venues.

Question: Im sure this question has been asked before, but what kind of efforts would be needed to install the 2.0. How much are top end parts, assuming the bottom is ok and the end result would be a "warmed" stock motor for the HSR 2.0 class, with an eye toward longevity? What about conversion costs (motor only at first)?

Any advice/comments would be really appreciated!

Bill

EDIT - knew i would miss something! Side shifter with shortened 4th and 5th.
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Joe Bob
post Aug 11 2003, 05:36 PM
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You need a lot more than the motor....oil tank, lines, and motor mount to name a few.

To rebuild that 2.0/6 will cost as much as getting a 3.0 and throwing the carbs and Heat Exchangers on it.....but you will MUCH more fun. That 2.0 has 110 hp.....pretty anemic compared to the 3.0 or 3.2,.....
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1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 05:41 PM
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Appreciate the response Mike. My goal is to have a class-legal car in HSR 2.0 class without expecting to spend 25k to be a "winner". Most interested in having a car that will be fun without destroying the bank account. Have done a bit of research, but sure that i havent looked under every stone....

Should also mention that I would be able to (with a few knowledgeable friends) be able to do most of the motor work myself....

All replies really welcome!
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Joe Bob
post Aug 11 2003, 05:43 PM
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Well....with the stock motor, you WILL be in that class....being competitive will be another matter.

Talk to Chris Campbell.....he is runing a small bore 914/6 and he has gobs more hp than the stock 2.0/6....
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 05:44 PM
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Hey Bill !!

The 2.0 6 cyl engine is the choice to go with in the HSR class do to the power output available from a race-prepped 2.0 6.

However... you can build a 180hp 4cyl for a few K cheaper and the car weighs less.

I'll revisit this thread a little later.

B
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SirAndy
post Aug 11 2003, 05:45 PM
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QUOTE(1973914 @ Aug 11 2003, 04:41 PM)
My goal is to have a class-legal car in HSR 2.0 class without expecting to spend 25k to be a "winner".

i don't think the 2.0/6 is going to give you any significant advantage that would justify the (high) costs of converting from /4 to /6 ...
the 2.0/4, if "warmed up" a bit has similar power/torque numbers as the /6.

just my 2 cents,
Andy
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1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 05:49 PM
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Mike - how can i get in touch with Chris?

Brad - have a 4cyl 2.5 project i can gracefully bow out of right now - im mostly worried about the "grenade" effect most of these hot 4cl cars seem to have, plus the sixes i have been on the track with have the low end torque/grunt that just leaves me in the dust coming out of a corner. Just dont want to spend another dime on the almost ready to assemble 4 cyl project i have. Its been done "right", but an opportunity on a factory 914/6 seems a little good to pass on - besides i would end up there anyway! Slippery slope...... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
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Joe Bob
post Aug 11 2003, 05:53 PM
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Chris posts on this board. He will see the thread, or you can send him a PM.

The big/4s can be had from Jake RAby....he seems to be pretty competent on the bad boy 4 cylinders....
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:00 PM
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ChrisC cant help you. He runs a totally different class (POC)with a 2.4 6cyl engine.

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1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 06:00 PM
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yeah im aware of Jake down there - he doesnt touch the 103's that are on this motor and for 7k, I cant for the life of me find a way to explain that kind of scratch for a 4 cyl to the wife (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) BTW - your avatar is gonna get me in trouble....

Defintely would like to find out how to get more, yet reliable horses from the 2.0 IF I go down that route....
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:01 PM
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Um Mike.. what part of 2.0 class dont you understand ??

Raby doesnt build hot rod 2.0 race engines that run on race gas.


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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:04 PM
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Ouch..ok I now know our budget. It will be real difficult to build a 2.0 6cyl or 4 cyl that will be competitive for that class.

We end up with 10k in our 1.8 185 hp engines.

B
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Joe Bob
post Aug 11 2003, 06:08 PM
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QUOTE(Brad Roberts @ Aug 11 2003, 04:01 PM)
Um Mike.. what part of 2.0 class dont you understand ??

Raby doesnt build hot rod 2.0 race engines that run on race gas.


B

Everything....take a pill..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
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1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 06:09 PM
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Brad,

Even with doing the assemby ourselves? Have several knowledgable people helping, so it would be a matter of headwork and maybe some cam work? Im definitely not looking to win the 2.0 class, just to run and get more experience, run my car at DE, and maybe do some PCA, all for pretty much fun. Willing to wait to get the big motor and progress gradually.
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:09 PM
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For some reason..I couldnt post a smilie to let you know I was busting your balls.


B
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:13 PM
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Its not just the engine..

Oil tanks are 500-600$ new
Oil lines.... 300$+ depending on what you use.
Engine mount... 350$+ "depending on what you use."
Engine tin...300$+ "..................."
Headers for the engine.... 350$ "You could use the stock heavy HE's" but I would sell them.

B
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1973914
post Aug 11 2003, 06:19 PM
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Ok now we are getting somewhere - these are are the kind of numbers I am looking for. Willing to spend the dollars on the required stuff. Completely agree on the new parts route for oil system, been burned on used before...

"Engine mount... 350$+ "depending on what you use.""
Whats the best route here?

"Engine tin...300$+ "...................""
Was hoping to use fiberglass -as you noted the 6 motor is heavier and every bit counts i suppose.

"Headers for the engine.... 350$ "You could use the stock heavy HE's" but I would sell them."

Defintely going that route. How much can be expected to come back from the sale of stock original 914-6 HE's in good condition?

looking at around 1600 for the oil system, exhaust, and tin, minus whatever i can get for the HE's.

Of course sell the original 2.0 4 cylinder for 1k with rebuilt webers....
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Joe Bob
post Aug 11 2003, 06:20 PM
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QUOTE(Brad Roberts @ Aug 11 2003, 04:09 PM)
For some reason..I couldnt post a smilie to let you know I was busting your balls.


B

I was trying to be polite and point him in directions that equated to ...... "How competitive do want to be? How much ya got?"

People think that small bore motors are cheap....they aren't. A 30 year old engine is just that....30 years old. You can update it with newer technology....but $$$ Caching....is in the same conversation......
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Brad Roberts
post Aug 11 2003, 06:25 PM
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Engine mount:

Rich Johnson mount (firewall mount weld in..No crossbar that interferes with headers)

Yes.. on fiberglass "tin". Still 350-400$

Stock HE's: 800-1k depending on condition.

B
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redshift
post Aug 11 2003, 06:28 PM
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QUOTE(mikez @ Aug 11 2003, 08:20 PM)
A 30 year old engine is just that....30 years old.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

It's all magical, and expensive, and then you have to go and say something like that.

I actually say in conversation, "My life, and I mean my car when I say that... is.."..



M
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