hotdgr needs HELP, cross country trip stopped in Benson AZ Options

[rick 918-S]

QUOTE (seanery @ Jan 18 2006, 07:12 PM)

I remember reading a couple years ago about ignition switch failures...maybe he should try to hotwire it (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif)

Ya, I told him in a pinch he could run a jumper wire from the coil to the pump but that's not getting him a starter. I'm firing up my old Think Pad. I think I have a wiring diagram I may be able to print and fax to his hotel.

[r_towle]

I called him.

He has a multimeter...that is a blessing

He is gonna check to make sure he has 12 volts at the coil

He said he has tried switching all the relays and he cant get the fuel pump going, but when he jumpers it he can get it going...so that is that plan for that problem...

Now, the non start issue...
he is looking for the ground strap...
and he will check the yellow wire coming from the ignition switch to see that he has 12 volts in the start position...

If he does not, he has wire with him and will make a jump circuit from that pole on the starter to touch the positive pole on the battery...

So worst case, he has a bad ignition switch and a flaky relay board...
If that is the case, he will jumper the fuel pump, and hotwire the starter and get home..

Rich

[bd1308]

if he's getting a oil and gen lights, his -ON- position on the switch works....

well, theres also a contact for lights, etc.....its a chance those could work too or not. I've BTDT...in rainy weather w/o wipers was NOT GOOD.

b

[Gint]

QUOTE (rick 918-S @ Jan 18 2006, 08:02 PM)

QUOTE (swl @ Jan 18 2006, 07:00 PM) No fuel pump AND no crank?  Thank kinda sounds like the ignition switch - or the power supply to it. The starter does go through the relay board but it is just passed through.  The relay board is just a connector. Dash lights, alt & oil, but no crank and no fuel pump.

They could very well be mutually exclusive. Hot start after heat soak (no starter engagement) AND a fuel delivery problem. In fact, the fuel delivery issue could be vapor lock. I wouldn't automatically assume it's the ignition switch. It does happen, but it's not as common as many other problems.

That sucks. BTDT too many times. But he's going to have to go through the steps to troubleshoot the problems. A second body and some light hammer tapping on the starter... Fuel steps listed above would be a good start. Check for actual fuel delivery.

I wish I were close enough to help.

[rick 918-S]

QUOTE (swl @ Jan 18 2006, 07:16 PM)

how about other switched items - headlight motors? If you have a meter you can check for 12 volts at the coil - it is pretty much a straight run from the ignition switch.

Sounds like the other switched stuff is working. dead starter and fuel pump.

[bd1308]

what about push-starting....

just get out of the car, push it real fast, jump in and drop clutch....

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

b

[Gint]

QUOTE (r_towle @ Jan 18 2006, 08:18 PM)

I called him. He has a multimeter...that is a blessing He is gonna check to make sure he has 12 volts at the coil He said he has tried switching all the relays and he cant get the fuel pump going, but when he jumpers it he can get it going...so that is that plan for that problem... Now, the non start issue... he is looking for the ground strap... and he will check the yellow wire coming from the ignition switch to see that he has 12 volts in the start position... If he does not, he has wire with him and will make a jump circuit from that pole on the starter to touch the positive pole on the battery... So worst case, he has a bad ignition switch and a flaky relay board... If that is the case, he will jumper the fuel pump, and hotwire the starter and get home.. Rich

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif)

Nice work Rich.

[r_towle]

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jan 18 2006, 10:20 PM)

what about push-starting.... just get out of the car, push it real fast, jump in and drop clutch.... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) b

we talked about his new parking procedures for the rest of the trip...

I told him that if its in good tune, a few feet is all I need to start it up on a hill...

He knew what I meant and will look for the correct parking on the way home...

Rich

[Gint]

QUOTE (r_towle @ Jan 18 2006, 08:22 PM)

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jan 18 2006, 10:20 PM) what about push-starting.... just get out of the car, push it real fast, jump in and drop clutch.... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) b we talked about his new parking procedures for the rest of the trip... I told him that if its in good tune, a few feet is all I need to start it up on a hill... He knew what I meant and will look for the correct parking on the way home... Rich

I did exactly that all the way home from NorCal in a 72 1.7. That car ran like a watch (except for the starter- LOL). Worked great.

[rick 918-S]

If anyone calls him again get the name of his hotel. I'm working on finding my wire diagrams. I think I can fax him at his hotel.

[MarkV]

I am less than an hour away from there. If he needs a part I could rob it from my car to get him going. What does he need ???

[seanery]

I had to "park creatively" for a couple months while driving the 951, nose down (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

[Eric Taylor]

I vote for ignition switch first, then relay board and relay failure. If It were me I would rewire the fuel pump to the positive side of the coil and ground it to the battery body ground. That will then bypass everything and get the pump running. For the starter, I would just bump it with a screw driver from underneath to get it going. If you cross all the terminals then the you can test the power to the starter as well as bypas all the relay's and ignition switch crap, just remember to leave the key in the on position when you bump the starter and the car out of gear. That's what I would do if it were me (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)
Eric

[TROJANMAN]

QUOTE (snflupigus @ Jan 18 2006, 07:14 PM)

i can be there in 2 hours... i have an entire wiring harness, a relay board that works (but is cracking...) and any tools you could ever need to fix whatever is wrong..... just left a message for him. I'm up for a road trip. anyone else want to go try and fix it if he calls? I can give it a good 3 hours of tinkering. 4 hours of sleep before work tomorrow = no problem (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

this is why this site rocks (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif)

[r_towle]

QUOTE (MarkV @ Jan 18 2006, 10:25 PM)

I am less than an hour away from there. If he needs a part I could rob it from my car to get him going. What does he need ???

he may need an early ignition switch..
He may possibly need a relay board...
And some known good relays....
If you go, bring a known good starter also.

Give him a call, he has very few tools, so if you go for the starter and ignition switch, bring all the tools to do the job.
A ground strap would help also...
Some emery cloth to clean all the connections.

Rich

[r_towle]

QUOTE (Eric Taylor @ Jan 18 2006, 10:28 PM)

I vote for ignition switch first, then relay board and relay failure. If It were me I would rewire the fuel pump to the positive side of the coil and ground it to the battery body ground. That will then bypass everything and get the pump running. For the starter, I would just bump it with a screw driver from underneath to get it going. If you cross all the terminals then the you can test the power to the starter as well as bypas all the relay's and ignition switch crap, just remember to leave the key in the on position when you bump the starter and the car out of gear. That's what I would do if it were me (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) Eric

you must be young...us old guys dont like to lay down to much or we fall asleep.

see, if you run a wire from the terminal on the starter to somewhere near the battery...you only need to get under the car once...get dirty once...

then each time you want to start it, you pop the engine lid and touch the wire to the positive terminal...nice and clean...

I am so lazy that I built a switch for this....I can clip it on and press a button....dont need to be under the car to start it up...

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Rich

[Eric Taylor]

lol, yeah at 19 I guess getting down and dirty just becomes a regular thing (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) .

Cool idea about the extra length of cable for the starter or even better the switch, maybe it will have to go in the tool box with frankenstien wiring for the fuel pump.

Eric

[gregrobbins]

QUOTE (rick 918-S @ Jan 18 2006, 08:24 PM)

If anyone calls him again get the name of his hotel. I'm working on finding my wire diagrams. I think I can fax him at his hotel.

When I talked to him a couple hours ago, he said the tow truck driver had just dropped him off at the Super 8 motel.

Great job of helping him out. Thanks all!

[rick 918-S]

QUOTE (MarkV @ Jan 18 2006, 07:25 PM)

I am less than an hour away from there. If he needs a part I could rob it from my car to get him going. What does he need ???

That would be cool! Call him if you think you can help. Find out what motel he's in. I'm trying to find my wiring diagrams. I want to see if I can fax them.

[rick 918-S]

QUOTE (gregrobbins @ Jan 18 2006, 07:41 PM)

QUOTE (rick 918-S @ Jan 18 2006, 08:24 PM) If anyone calls him again get the name of his hotel. I'm working on finding my wire diagrams. I think I can fax him at his hotel. When I talked to him a couple hours ago, he said the tow truck driver had just dropped him off at the Super 8 motel. Great job of helping him out. Thanks all!

Cool!