914 Newbie., Help! Options

[jbell]

i want a 914. i've been looking into them, and think it would be a great car to build from the ground up.

now.. heres my dilemma. i want... no, i need a fast car...

i know they make v8 swaps.. but its pricey. figure 2000 for an engine, 3000 or so for the kit and supporting mods... etc. plus, you gotta deal with radiator, hoses, all that crap.

then briefly, i read about the rotary, 2.0, etc swaps, but nothing stood out to me.

what are my options in the air-cooled department, or should i suck it up and go water cooled?
ideally... i'd like to be around 200hp, get 20mpg, and be reliable. (honda motor swap? haha)


oh, and i remember hearing something about this months ago.... something about a vw turbo diesel swap...

[Twystd1]

Heres my 2 cents worth.

200 HP and 20 + miles per gallon going air cooled is very do-able.

Cept..

Doing it complete and done for 5K is very tough to do.. But not impossible.

Just not probable for most of us.....

SO:

Unless you are really well connected in the air cooled world.

Or you own a fab shop and guys owe ya big favors.

Or you are very lucky to find a 200HP air cooled six with all the fixins for very cheap..

Or if you somehow get adopted by Jake Raby..

The water cooled conversion is probably gunna be cheaper and easier to get 200 HP + 20mpg.

By the way.. All of these conversions can get 20MPG plus easily.

And any 914 with 200 HP is a flat dam riot. Stupid amounts of fun.

And very quick. Not 10 second 1/4 mile quick... but very fast.

Can smoke the tires at will in the lower gears unless you are running race rubber. Then sometimes you can still light em up...

Is this what you are looking for?

As with all mods. There are trade offs.

Why don't you tell us EXACTLY what your dream is for this car.

Like handling, daily driver or street fighter?

Is handling more important than ride quality?

Are ya gunna race it at the amatuer level?

Or do you just want to beat the kid in his Honda cause he thinks he is the shit?

Give us some parameters other than 200 pony's and 20 MPH..

That ain't enough data to really help ya...

By the way.. A BIG dollar factor in all of this is your ability to do much of this work yourself or with friends and having the tools to do it.

If ya have to farm out al ot of this.. Double the price and then some....

Hopefully Mark or Brett will chime in.. They builds cars for others every day.

Twystd1

[jbell]

hey! i was that honda kid at one time... haha
well, not the ricer... but i do appricate honda cars/motors and owned a tuned one.

anyway...

looking at everything... i think this is what i want to do:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act=...4372&hl=v6&st=0
the 3.8 v6 swap... its not crazy heavy, its very inexpensive, wont blow apart the trans, and looks like it will provide TONS of fun.

only thing is...
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-2...-1122050015.jpg
is a custom motor mount, and i can't weld for shit.

[Andyrew]

The motor mount is the least of your worries.

How much do you want to budget?

I spend 1500 on my v8 conversion to get it running.....

Spent another bit of money for non neccesity things.... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) But hey, your always gona wana go faster...


I would look at subaru conversions... Its very sensible.. and quick... not to mention the gas mileage...

[Twystd1]

Jbell,,
Thats from the Horses mouth. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif)

He did it for 1500.00 bucks.

Dam Andyrew.. How did you do that???? Very Kewl....

Does that include cooling system and suspension upgrades to handle the additional weight?

I mean is 1500.00 bucks for the conversion the turn key/done price?

And would you please adopt me?????????????

Twystd1

[jbell]

really, i want to be as cheap as possible. literally. pretend its a grassroots car, haha.

[Twystd1]

How much bucks.

Over how long a period of time.

Do you have to throw at this...

Twystd1

[rhodyguy]

it's an exspensive path. you're forgetting wanna go fast brakes, wanna go fast suspention, wanna go fast wheel/tire combo, and wanna go fast trans/axles/cv joints. get a nice, done, 914, drive it for a while and save yourself a shit pot full of money and time. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif)

k

[d914]

buy a v-8/v6 project car and or start with autocross car that might already have some go fast pieces....Make sure the basics are covered first. Don't worry about paint or interior....The inteior is easy for a DIY job and paint can wait for the $$$ to catch up..

[rhodyguy]

i forgot all about the $$$ for the redone interior and $$$$$ for new paint, rubber and seals. start saving NOW!!! (ps. just price out new bumpertops).

k

[d914]

he said fast not pretty!!!

By the way, 150hp is very fast in a 914. 200hp is frigging fast.... 300 plus if you can get it to the ground is sick!!!!

FYI there is a shop locally looking at putting a full honda engine and transaxle into a 914...but I think there will have to be some chopping going on here!!

[rhodyguy]

ok. he needs a clean tub with crappy paint and as rust free as he can find. there's a QUICK $1700+ to start. set for launch and go, go, go!!! 2-3-4-5 years later he'll be into it for 8-9-10 grand and will still have crappy paint. oh, big flares for the big tires for the big engine, cha-ching!!! driving around in a shitty looking car that goes fast, brakes and handles crappy is way too cool (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/clap56.gif) . but what do i know? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif) so.. i would suggest he clear a space in the garage, get a couple of sets of jackstands. dump the first $1700 right way and get started. GO FOR IT!!!!

K

[nomore9one4]

QUOTE (rhodyguy @ Feb 26 2006, 08:11 AM)

ok. he needs a clean tub with crappy paint and as rust free as he can find. there's a QUICK $1700+ to start. set for launch and go, go, go!!! 2-3-4-5 years later he'll be into it for 8-9-10 grand and will still have  crappy paint. oh, big flares for the big tires for the big engine, cha-ching!!! driving around in a shitty looking car that goes fast, brakes and handles crappy is way too cool (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/clap56.gif) . but what do i know? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif)  so.. i would suggest he clear a space in the garage, get a couple of sets of jackstands. dump the first $1700 right way and get started. GO FOR IT!!!! K

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif) Its sounds like you want to make a donation Kevin! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif)

[rhodyguy]

yep. the 041 car is exactly what he needs. IMMEDIATELY!!! note the +. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

k

[brant]

Jbell,

I'm not trying to sound sarcastic here really...
but to me it sounds like you need to go buy a used integra...
that will meet all of your needs and cost 50% of what it would cost to do it with a 914..

plus the integra will give you instant gratification


seriously what do you want a fast car for?
I'm not asking to be a jerk it really affects the direction to go

(for example if you wanted to race with a vintage club, then you would be severely limited in what type and size of motor... but if you want to race on the street then less limitations.. although the integra is still going to give you more of what you want for half the money)

just so you know up front. Most people that start a conversion and project like you are pondering end up not finishing for 3-5 years.
I tell you this to remind you about the instant gratification part. Do you need a fast car now, or in 2010

brant

[rhodyguy]

i think he wants a fast car that looks bad soon, i guess, brant. nothing wrong with dreaming, but getting ifo that it's relatively easy, quickly and can be done on the cheap is sorta misleading. you just wrote it so much more politely than did.

k

[brant]

I love day dreaming...
I do it all the time.
but it seems to me that we (as a non-club) ought to be honest when people ask about conversions and projects..

I know andrews car is awesome, there are kick butt subaru's out there, and trekkors -6 rocks... all were done quickly and affordably.

but I think these are the exceptions and not the norms.

(I think I can count the number of affordable conversions on 1 hand after 20 years of watching this hobby)

In fact I'll bet that 40% of the conversions that are started don't even get finished by the same person that started them. It takes some pretty freakin amazing dedication just to finish these. That means that Andrew, Tony, and Trekkor are amazing.

it also means that new people who are pondering such a project have a good chance of failing. and further they have a good chance at going 100% over budget and taking 5 years...

but heck maybe I should shut up and then try to buy this project in a box for some fire sale price in 3 years when this guy has given up on it.

To the original poster.
if you can't fathom spending 6-10 THOUSAND dollars over a 5 YEAR time frame then you should re-think about the integra I mentioned.

(sorry if I'm sensitive lately from all of the endless debates about conversions.. I think its a disservice to not be honest about these issues... thats my opinion and I'm sticking too it..)

brant

[rhodyguy]

if he were to buy the 041 car, you'd have a great car to dream with! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) (in 2-3-4-5 years)

k

[jbell]

QUOTE (brant @ Feb 26 2006, 09:15 AM)

I love day dreaming... I do it all the time. but it seems to me that we (as a non-club) ought to be honest when people ask about conversions and projects.. I know andrews car is awesome, there are kick butt subaru's out there, and trekkors -6 rocks... all were done quickly and affordably. but I think these are the exceptions and not the norms. (I think I can count the number of affordable conversions on 1 hand after 20 years of watching this hobby) In fact I'll bet that 40% of the conversions that are started don't even get finished by the same person that started them. It takes some pretty freakin amazing dedication just to finish these. That means that Andrew, Tony, and Trekkor are amazing. it also means that new people who are pondering such a project have a good chance of failing. and further they have a good chance at going 100% over budget and taking 5 years... but heck maybe I should shut up and then try to buy this project in a box for some fire sale price in 3 years when this guy has given up on it. To the original poster. if you can't fathom spending 6-10 THOUSAND dollars over a 5 YEAR time frame then you should re-think about the integra I mentioned. (sorry if I'm sensitive lately from all of the endless debates about conversions.. I think its a disservice to not be honest about these issues... thats my opinion and I'm sticking too it..) brant

i completely understand where you are coming from.
i have no dobut that i will complete the converstion. i've done my fair share of engine swaps, rebuilds, etc. and i've never really had a problem.

as for price, i have no problem throwing 6 - 10 grand at a car over 5 year span. i'd like my initial investment of an engine swap and supporting mods to be under that mark though.

its seems that the buick v6 is a great swap. they're cheap, assuming i can have someone weld that motor cradle, im golden.

after that, its a matter of when i feel like upgrading other things... interior, paint, etc, etc.