 someone please write a dissertation on LSD's, Quaife, ZF, torsen, lockers, phantom's.. |
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| Aaron Cox |
 Mar 4 2006, 09:53 PM
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#1
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Professional Lawn Dart  Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California  |
blows my mind... im interested in how each one works, and the effects of it on acceleration (lock unlock etc) for each of them....
would be a great wealth of knowledge to have in one place.... bueller? |
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| TimT |
Mar 4 2006, 09:56 PM
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#2
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retired Group: Members Posts: 4,033 Joined: 18-February 03 From: Wantagh, NY Member No.: 313 |
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| Aaron Cox |
Mar 4 2006, 09:57 PM
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#3
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Professional Lawn Dart Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California |
tim, you can sing about LSD's if thats your style (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)
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| TimT |
Mar 4 2006, 10:01 PM
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#4
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retired Group: Members Posts: 4,033 Joined: 18-February 03 From: Wantagh, NY Member No.: 313 |
Not sure what your looking for exactly... As LSDs have been discussed ad nauseaum....
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| SLITS |
Mar 4 2006, 10:02 PM
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#5
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"This Utah shit is HARSH!" Group: Benefactors Posts: 13,602 Joined: 22-February 04 From: SoCal Mountains ... Member No.: 1,696 Region Association: None  |
1. Put tiny piece of designed square paper onto tongue and let disolve.
2. Experience dillusions for up to 14 hours. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wacko.gif) |
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| Aaron Cox |
Mar 4 2006, 10:02 PM
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#6
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Professional Lawn Dart Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California |
well make me dizzy.... in one thread..... |
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| J P Stein |
Mar 4 2006, 10:11 PM
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#7
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Irrelevant old fart Group: Members Posts: 8,797 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Vancouver, WA Member No.: 45 Region Association: None |
The only thing I know about LSDs is that I have had one on order since Nov 11 2005 and still haven't gotten the fucker.
Them Hawaiian gear cutters are doing too much surfin' and not enuff cutting. Supposedly, the next batch should be here about yesterday or the day before........which is still too damn late.......shit. |
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| pek771 |
Mar 4 2006, 10:20 PM
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 273 Joined: 23-November 05 From: Conover, NC Member No.: 5,175 Region Association: None 
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| Aaron Cox |
Mar 4 2006, 10:30 PM
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#9
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Professional Lawn Dart Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California |
just read the whole thing... knew most of it... now id like to learn about each one's behavior in accel/decel conditions... and cornering |
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| alpha434 |
Mar 4 2006, 10:31 PM
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#10
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My member number is no coincidence. Group: Members Posts: 3,154 Joined: 16-December 05 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 5,280 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Dude. Where's the young gun action? You have to know two-three times as much as the old guys do. That's the rule.
All limited slips consist of clutch mechanism(s) and a spring to hold the clutch(es) down. This way there is a lot of resistance to slipping. And it will slip when there is a lot of force telling it to, like when turning. And no slip (or very little) when your coming down the straightaway. The difference between manufacturers is either quality (parts tolerancing and failure prevention) OR novelty (achieving the same effect a different way.) Not usually both. The phantom grip isn't really a limited slip. It's positive traction. It locks both differentials when there is positive pressure coming from the pinion. And it unlocks when there isn't any pressure. They even sell spring kits on their site to be able to adjust responsiveness, i.e. how much pressure locks the diffs. A limited slip, posi-trac, locked, or open differnetial drastically changes how you have to drive on the track. If you're used to powering hard through corners, then an improperly tuned Phantom Grip will literally make your car "undrivable." But maybe a locked diff would be ok, because then you just have to push hard enough to break the tires loose. But now I'm past answering you question and I'm blabbering. |
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| alpha434 |
Mar 4 2006, 10:35 PM
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#11
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My member number is no coincidence. Group: Members Posts: 3,154 Joined: 16-December 05 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 5,280 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Glad you asked. PG: Can't power through the corners or the diffs will lock LS: Easy to set proper spring pressure for cornering. Locked:Have to be able to break the tires loose, or you'll push yourself off the track. Opem:Best cornering, since the axles are free to change speeds. Hurts you on the straights, where you've only got one wheel driving you at any given time. |
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| pek771 |
Mar 4 2006, 11:01 PM
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 273 Joined: 23-November 05 From: Conover, NC Member No.: 5,175 Region Association: None
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Regarding the Phantom Grip...
I looked at their website, but there wasn't much info. I'm really not sure how their unit operates. First I even heard of one was today, when XHead (Fiat guy) mentioned he has experience with them. Also, being old, I seem to recall the difference between limited slip and Posi-Traction is that Posi-Traction is a copyrighted name belonging to General Motors. I don't recall a Ford ever having Posi-Traction. Pat |
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| bondo |
Mar 4 2006, 11:06 PM
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#13
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Practicing my perpendicular parking Group: Members Posts: 4,277 Joined: 19-April 03 From: Los Osos, CA Member No.: 587 Region Association: Central California |
Ford had trac-lock as their trademark. Posi-trac and trac-lock are both clutch type. I think alpha is thinking of the "detroit locker" which fully locks on acceleration.. which I *think* is what the phantom grip is a variant of. |
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| alpha434 |
Mar 4 2006, 11:10 PM
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#14
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My member number is no coincidence. Group: Members Posts: 3,154 Joined: 16-December 05 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 5,280 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Could be. I've actually never worked on an american car.
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| bondo |
Mar 4 2006, 11:12 PM
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#15
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Practicing my perpendicular parking Group: Members Posts: 4,277 Joined: 19-April 03 From: Los Osos, CA Member No.: 587 Region Association: Central California |
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| alpha434 |
Mar 4 2006, 11:20 PM
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#16
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My member number is no coincidence. Group: Members Posts: 3,154 Joined: 16-December 05 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 5,280 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Yeah. My definition of posi-trac was hearsay from an idiot. I should've known.
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| Dr. Roger |
Mar 4 2006, 11:29 PM
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#17
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A bat out of hell. Group: Members Posts: 3,944 Joined: 31-January 05 From: Hercules, California Member No.: 3,533 Region Association: Northern California |
one strange thing about lockers is that if you go into a turn and accelerate out, the locker will lock. then your turning can get a little weird if your not used to it. most people stay out of the throttle on slow turns. Or gun it.
LSD set at about 80% is my preferrence. |
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| alpha434 |
Mar 4 2006, 11:33 PM
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#18
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My member number is no coincidence. Group: Members Posts: 3,154 Joined: 16-December 05 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 5,280 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Like I said. You can change those springs to set the response. Tighter springs will make it so that the locker doesn't lock as quickly. The 80% is usually a good choice. Everything depends on the track that you're at. |
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| sixnotfour |
Mar 4 2006, 11:38 PM
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#19
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914 Wizard Group: Members Posts: 10,432 Joined: 12-September 04 From: Life Elevated..planet UT. Member No.: 2,744 Region Association: Rocky Mountains 
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18 types to choose from;Use the "select diiff. " box and enjoy the selection.
http://reiderracing.com/differentials.htm# |
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| pek771 |
Mar 4 2006, 11:47 PM
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 273 Joined: 23-November 05 From: Conover, NC Member No.: 5,175 Region Association: None
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It seems the useful combinations we would consider are the open, Quaife type, ZF type and the Phantom Grip. The lockers are impractical, and the track cars would just run a welded rear.
I know there is a difference between the Quaife and the ZF, because I hear the autox guys rave about the Quaife, and the track guys say they suck. |
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