 Flaring the car, now what to do with the fender "lips", go for the smooth look or ??? |
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| Mueller |
 Oct 15 2006, 02:01 PM
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#1
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914 Freak!  Group: Members Posts: 17,146 Joined: 4-January 03 From: Antioch, CA Member No.: 87 Region Association: None 
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Had a meeting this morning with Jerry that will be doing the hand formed flares, bodywork and paint on my 914..the flares are to cover my 17x8's with 245s on all four corners.....the fenders need to be brought out at least 1" for proper clearance.
Now to decide a few things, such as lip or no lip on the fenders... The green car here that belongs to GaryD has the fenders flared and has kept the lips..... The yellow is JP's and on the rear, his flares (HPH 'glass flares) have no lip. I also noticed that the GT flares have no external lip..... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-87-1160430024.jpg)  |
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| JPB |
Oct 15 2006, 02:17 PM
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#2
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The Crimson Rocket smiles in your general direction. Group: Members Posts: 2,927 Joined: 12-November 05 From: Tapmahamock, Va. Member No.: 5,107 |
They both look great and think the lips are probably required on the stretched steel fendes for strength. If you have lips on the front fenders, then you should match them with the rear; either both off or both on. I like them on. Its kinda like a nice detail as the others don't seem to match. How far are you pulling the back ones out from their stock location?
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif) I feel like doing that to my car also from pics of your last post. |
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| Andyrew |
Oct 15 2006, 02:26 PM
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#3
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Spooling.... Please wait Group: Members Posts: 13,376 Joined: 20-January 03 From: Riverbank, Ca Member No.: 172 Region Association: Northern California
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cut the inner lip or the outer lip? The inner lip/ L is structural as you know, the outer lip is an indent for the outer lip. also semi structural.
If your forming them by hand, that lip gets contorted very easily. (I played around with keeping it or not myself when I was forming the flares) and IMHO it dates the car. I dont think he'll cut them off more as hammering them flat (the inner lip can NOT be rolled in, he'll have to bend the metal back, as I had to do this on felix's fenders when I was attempting to work them.) The problem I faced with my OLD fenders on my car was I went back and forth with the lip too many times and the metal was separating. Partly the reason why I told felix the flares were not good enough for his car. also why I went with fiberglass. The rears will need 1.5 inches. but thats pretty easy if he's got a palm nailer and he's done that before. the fronts I think an inch will be ok, but the problem will be lack of clearance when in turns.. Which I believe is one of the reasons JP cut his fenders up higher. Im sure I've told you all this before, but heres a post to jog your memory! oh ya.. Drool sucker!!! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/blog-172-1157945315.jpg) hph (IMG:http://myspace-399.vo.llnwd.net/00099/99/30/99790399_l.jpg) WCC05 hand formed (IMG:http://myspace-233.vo.llnwd.net/00167/33/25/167015233_l.jpg) autox with 255's rear hand formed. GL! |
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| J P Stein |
Oct 15 2006, 04:27 PM
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#4
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Irrelevant old fart Group: Members Posts: 8,797 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Vancouver, WA Member No.: 45 Region Association: None |
The inner lip or L, as Andrew refers to it, is necessary for strength.....and a pain to work around. In fact, I found no way to stretch it short of it pounding flat then rebending it back in. Jon Kelly can do it, but he has talent (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
The outter shape is even worse and thus history on my car. I did find it necessary to raise the front L about 3/4 inch for big tiars at full compression & lock.....and a lowered car, of course. A pair of vise grips & an eyeball, then a hammer & eyeball to get it fair. Just takes some time & patience and a lot of (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) |
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| Mueller |
Oct 15 2006, 05:49 PM
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#5
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914 Freak! Group: Members Posts: 17,146 Joined: 4-January 03 From: Antioch, CA Member No.: 87 Region Association: None
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jerry, the paint and body guy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) has restored many a 356 and has the solution for the inside lip which I know will get messed up so if we get rid of the outer lip, no problem....I've already FUBAR'd the rear drivers side outer lip by trying to do something I have no business in attempting (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
right now it's an issue of looks and if I want the smooth look or not... kinda neat having a professional work on the car, luckly we are doing the barter system so it won't hurt the wallet too much (famous last words, hahaha) |
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| turboman808 |
Oct 15 2006, 06:03 PM
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#6
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,718 Joined: 31-January 06 From: North Jersey Member No.: 5,505 Region Association: North East States |
QUOTE(Andyrew @ Oct 15 2006, 12:26 PM)  Those look pretty good. Should have mine done over the winter and have the car resprayed. With the slant nose fenders they desparately need to to be flared so they look nice. I think it will really make a difference in the cars looks. |
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| JPB |
Oct 15 2006, 07:58 PM
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#7
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The Crimson Rocket smiles in your general direction. Group: Members Posts: 2,927 Joined: 12-November 05 From: Tapmahamock, Va. Member No.: 5,107 |
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| race914 |
Oct 15 2006, 08:16 PM
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#8
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73 914-4 Group: Members Posts: 1,006 Joined: 31-October 05 From: Nipomo, California (Central Coast) Member No.: 5,027 Region Association: Central California |
I kept the lips so my flares were more 'stealth'
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| Andyrew |
Oct 15 2006, 09:11 PM
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#9
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Spooling.... Please wait Group: Members Posts: 13,376 Joined: 20-January 03 From: Riverbank, Ca Member No.: 172 Region Association: Northern California
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the flares are high performance house rich bontempi flares front and back.
Currently 255's(on 8.5x17) front and 265's (on 10x18) on the back. I like the smooth lip.. and if thats what your body guy is good at, then I think the answer is obvious. less$$ for you, less stress for him.. |
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| nine14cats |
Oct 15 2006, 09:16 PM
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#10
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Bill Pickering -- 914-6 GT aka....Leeloo Group: Members Posts: 2,618 Joined: 10-February 03 From: Campbell, CA Member No.: 287 Region Association: None |
I voted for smooth. I like the subtle "custom" look of that.
Bill P. |
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| Chris Pincetich |
Oct 15 2006, 09:19 PM
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#11
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B-) Group: Members Posts: 2,082 Joined: 3-October 05 From: Point Reyes Station, CA Member No.: 4,907 Region Association: Northern California |
I vote no lips because you are not trying to keep the stock "Porsche" look with the wheels so why go through extra work to retain a stock look with the fenders? New paint and body work, you've got to be psyched. Weld the cowel seal, new side markers, colors, graphics, so many important choices to consider. Do you really even care how we vote? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) |
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| markb |
Oct 15 2006, 09:26 PM
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#12
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914less :( Group: Members Posts: 5,449 Joined: 22-January 03 From: Nipomo, CA Member No.: 180 Region Association: Central California
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QUOTE(JPB @ Oct 15 2006, 01:17 PM) They both look great and think the lips are probably required on the stretched steel fendes for strength. If you have lips on the front fenders, then you should match them with the rear; either both off or both on. I like them on. Its kinda like a nice detail as the others don't seem to match. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) |
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| jonwatts |
Oct 15 2006, 11:31 PM
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#13
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no rules, just wrong Group: Benefactors Posts: 2,321 Joined: 13-January 03 From: San Jose, CA Member No.: 141  |
The smooth look is kinda 80's (think 944 or 928). Nothing wrong with it, just also a bit dated.
What about the wide lip look of new cars?  |
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| John Kelly |
Oct 16 2006, 05:41 AM
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#14
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 692 Joined: 1-May 03 From: Moclips WA. Member No.: 640 |
Hi Mike,
I like both. The stock edge detail is not required for strength when the fenders are stretched. The extra compound curve you put in the fender makes it stiffer than stock. If going with the smooth look, it's probably a good idea to do it fairly early on in the flare process...or at least most of it. You do not want to have your flare done and still need to do a lot of work on the edge because the shape might change. If you do make a little too much of a bulge near the edge, you can shrink it down with a shrinking disc. This will work on a car retaining the detail that has too much stretch near the edge as well. It would require a high crowned shrinking disc, or clever torch work, and hammer and dolly. One of the things I learned on Zach's car was that I should have stayed away from the edge when stretching to keep from making the detail too shallow (this is in the video). His car is going to need some tricky blending of the shallow to the deep parts of the detail, or he will perhaps go with the smooth look. If Jerry wants any tips to get through tough spots he might run in to, I'll try to help if possible. One thing I did not put in the first video was the use of a slapper instead of a body hammer. This really speeds up the metal smoothing that is done between multiple stretching sessions. John www.ghiaspecialties.com |
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| Mountain914 |
Oct 16 2006, 06:57 AM
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#15
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Too much time in thin air! Group: Members Posts: 367 Joined: 22-May 03 From: Conifer, CO Member No.: 725 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Mick Jager, Stephen Tyler, and me, we all kept the lips... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stones.gif)
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| Aaron Cox |
Oct 16 2006, 09:20 AM
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#16
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Professional Lawn Dart Group: Retired Admin Posts: 24,541 Joined: 1-February 03 From: OC Member No.: 219 Region Association: Southern California |
is that a fender that was cut off a car, "curved" and welded/sectioned back in?
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| jonwatts |
Oct 16 2006, 09:33 AM
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#17
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no rules, just wrong Group: Benefactors Posts: 2,321 Joined: 13-January 03 From: San Jose, CA Member No.: 141 |
I think that's Mountain914's yellow car. Here's a profile shot.
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| Mountain914 |
Oct 16 2006, 11:18 AM
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#18
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Too much time in thin air! Group: Members Posts: 367 Joined: 22-May 03 From: Conifer, CO Member No.: 725 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Yep - existing fender "splayed out" and metal added in.
Dang - no good pictures. (IMG:http://gallery.rennlist.com/albums/album56/prepaint2.jpg) |
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| cbenitah |
Oct 16 2006, 11:46 AM
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#19
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Protected by the Swedish Maffia Group: Members Posts: 848 Joined: 16-August 05 From: San Diego, CA Member No.: 4,597 |
not to hijack the thread, but what wheels are those on the yellow car.. CCW?
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| mrdezyne |
Oct 16 2006, 12:32 PM
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#20
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Now on larger rolling jack stands! Group: Members Posts: 468 Joined: 31-July 05 From: Tulsa, OK Member No.: 4,510 |
I have the HPH rear flares also but I am actually adding the lip to match the front. The lip is one of the little things that make it look retro and adds a bit of detail interest to the side profile of the car. Without the lips there is not much going on down the sides IMO....
Lee, that is an amazing job on those fenders. I'm hoping to accomplish something similar with the Bontempi fiberglass flares.... |
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