 Inner cv came completely off of the trans output flange, a mile or so from home. |
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| Gint |
 May 11 2007, 10:35 AM
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#21
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Mike Ginter  Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains   |
QUOTE(Gint @ May 11 2007, 08:23 AM)  I'll put the joint back on with the two good bolts and roll pins so that I can run the car enough to get it up my steep driveway. Note that I said the two good bolts, and for clarification, the two roll pins, and bypass the two bolts that have stripped holes. Just so I can roll the car under it's own power top get it up my rather steep driveway. |
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| McMark |
May 11 2007, 10:36 AM
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#22
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914 Freak! Group: Retired Admin Posts: 20,179 Joined: 13-March 03 From: Grand Rapids, MI Member No.: 419 Region Association: None |
Cap'N do you pay any special attention to trying NOT to get grease on the threads? I always wondered if the grease contributed to loose CV bolts. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)
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| John |
May 11 2007, 10:38 AM
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#23
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member? what's a member? Group: Members Posts: 3,393 Joined: 30-January 04 From: Evansville, IN (SIRPCA) Member No.: 1,615 Region Association: None |
Need an output flange (without goobered threads) then?
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| Gint |
May 11 2007, 10:39 AM
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#24
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
QUOTE(John @ May 11 2007, 09:38 AM) Need an output flange (without goobered threads) then? |
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| rick 918-S |
May 11 2007, 10:40 AM
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#25
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Hey nice rack! -Celette Group: Members Posts: 20,471 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Now in Superior WI Member No.: 43 Region Association: Northstar Region 
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QUOTE(John @ May 11 2007, 08:23 AM) QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ May 11 2007, 08:10 AM) QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ May 10 2007, 11:54 PM) QUOTE(jkeyzer @ May 10 2007, 09:47 PM) CV failure is a rite of passage for the 914 owner. It happened to me twice, and then I safety wired them on and it hasn't happened since. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I have NEVER had a CV bolt that I've installed EVER come loose or off. Only once have I safety wired a set of CV bolts, and only then because the fool was willing to part with an obscene amount of money. I buy a LOT of CV washers. Many of the cars we service at the shop don't even use washers, BTW, and they STILL don't come off. The Cap'n I am in agreement with the Capt'n. If you put the CV bolts in with the proper backing plates, the proper schnorr washers and use the proper torque spec they will stay on. I tried all sorts of fixes for this over the years, then I went to the book and followed the directions of the engineers. Thems some smart guys.. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Just for reference, what is the torque spec? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) And BTW: anyone have a good source for quality flange gaskets? The last two shitty sets I purchased cracked in the package before I even installed them. I used RVT with the gaskets last time. I just installed my axles last night and used copper coat spray on both sides of the gasket. firstly, to glue the cracked gasket back together, then to glue it to the flange so it couldn't squeeze out the side. We should have a How to article with the best sources for gaskets, options for bolts and washers, and tricks for greasing the joint. Also how to tell if you have a worn joint and how to install your balls in the cage. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) |
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| davep |
May 11 2007, 10:42 AM
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#26
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914 Historian Group: Benefactors Posts: 5,151 Joined: 13-October 03 From: Burford, ON, N0E 1A0 Member No.: 1,244 Region Association: Canada |
It could be that the bolts won't start because the outer threads were damaged as the last bolt threads were hanging on for dear life. Perhaps you can fix the damaged threads. I'd only run a tap in for the first few turns to fix damaged threads. I find taps make threaded holes too loose; they clean up the threads too much sometimes.
I had one customer car where the CV & axle whacked the gearshift rod and bent it. This happened in the middle of an intersection in a big city. |
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| Gint |
May 11 2007, 10:45 AM
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#27
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
QUOTE(davep @ May 11 2007, 09:42 AM) It could be that the bolts won't start because the outer threads were damaged as the last bolt threads were hanging on for dear life. Perhaps you can fix the damaged threads. I'd only run a tap in for the first few turns to fix damaged threads. I find taps make threaded holes too loose; they clean up the threads too much sometimes. I had one customer car where the CV & axle whacked the gearshift rod and bent it. This happened in the middle of an intersection in a big city. |
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| John |
May 11 2007, 10:57 AM
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#28
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member? what's a member? Group: Members Posts: 3,393 Joined: 30-January 04 From: Evansville, IN (SIRPCA) Member No.: 1,615 Region Association: None |
QUOTE(Gint @ May 11 2007, 08:27 AM) QUOTE(John @ May 11 2007, 09:23 AM) Just for reference, what is the torque spec? According to the 914 Tech Spec booklet: 4.3 Nm Working on a conversion now... That can't be right. 4.3 N*m => 3.17 lbf*ft 4.3 kgf*m => 31.10 lbf*ft (maybe this is what is in the spec book) On Pelican board, it lists it at 31 lbf*ft. I think that is even too low. Anyone, anyone????? |
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| MrKona |
May 11 2007, 11:14 AM
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#29
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 597 Joined: 25-July 05 From: Santa Rosa, CA Member No.: 4,469 Region Association: None |
QUOTE(John @ May 11 2007, 09:57 AM) QUOTE(Gint @ May 11 2007, 08:27 AM) QUOTE(John @ May 11 2007, 09:23 AM) Just for reference, what is the torque spec? According to the 914 Tech Spec booklet: 4.3 Nm Working on a conversion now... That can't be right. 4.3 N*m => 3.17 lbf*ft 4.3 kgf => 31.10 lbf*ft (maybe this is what is in the spec book) On Pelican board, it lists it at 31 lbf*ft. I think that is even too low. Anyone, anyone????? Happen to have my Haynes book next to me. Haynes says 31 lb f ft. |
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| byndbad914 |
May 11 2007, 11:16 AM
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#30
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shoehorn and some butter - it fits Group: Members Posts: 1,547 Joined: 23-January 06 From: Broomfield, CO Member No.: 5,463 Region Association: None |
I haven't had a CV come off either. Let you guys in a on a little secret an old-timer mechanic I worked for showed me.
"bug guts" on the threads. I use it on every threaded fastener and I NEVER have them come loose. I did have a whole power steering bracket fall off my mom's car after I forgot to use it and replaced her head gaskets (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) Bought new bolts, bug guts'd 'em and she put another 50K on it before selling it without an issue. I also use RTV to seal the original CVs (I have enclosed 930 stuff now) and never had an issue - a thin film of it is plenty. Smear it smooth with spit on finger, wait until it tacks up just a little, and assemble and torque. Bug guts = the brown liquid Permatex Aviation gasket sealer (#2 IIRC). Stays really tacky and doesn't seem to harden up at all so the threads just never vibrate loose. I have used it on numerous vibrating race cars and all bolt stay in place (you still have to use proper torque of course). Only time we safety wired on the SW Tour car was where it was required after inspection. Now watch, I will drop one tonight on the way to Sonic (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) |
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| Dr Evil |
May 11 2007, 11:34 AM
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#31
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Send me your transmission! Group: Members Posts: 23,002 Joined: 21-November 03 From: Loveland, OH 45140 Member No.: 1,372 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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Gint, just pull the flange. Its stoopid easy and will make things much easier, but you may need to drain your tranny a bit to keep the oil from leaking out depending on the level. 19mm socket, they are not torqued in too much.
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| RoninEclipse2G |
May 11 2007, 12:18 PM
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#32
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Suby Geek Group: Members Posts: 232 Joined: 28-April 07 From: Parker, Colorado Member No.: 7,701 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
same thing happened to my wife in the creamsicle monday night, coming up the hill about a mile from the house. weird, i think it damaged the exhaust, definitely noisier and if you turn on the heater it smells.
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| eric914 |
May 11 2007, 12:31 PM
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#33
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Member Group: Members Posts: 381 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Waynesville OH Member No.: 1,613 Region Association: Upper MidWest
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Did the gasket brake right through the middle? Take a close look at the CV joint gasket and see if where it broke looks like a small puzzle piece tab. The gasket industry has started to make round seals in pieces and then presses the pieces together. This saves a lot of material. I haven’t seen our CV gaskets being made this way but it wouldn't surprise me.
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| Gint |
May 11 2007, 12:55 PM
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#34
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
QUOTE(Dr Evil @ May 11 2007, 10:34 AM) Gint, just pull the flange. Its stoopid easy and will make things much easier, but you may need to drain your tranny a bit to keep the oil from leaking out depending on the level. 19mm socket, they are not torqued in too much. Torque spec has been corrected in my earlier post. Fact is, the 914 Technical Specifications booklet only gives the number. My mistake there. It is 31 lb/ft. I wasn't so much looking for hep with this thread than I was just trying to point out to those that aren't aware how easily these things can come loose if they aren't installed properly. And you can never trust the PO. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) There have been 914 owners that have incurred serious damage when a CV joint lets go. I got lucky. I just finished hanging the exterior shutters that I promised Shar I'd do months ago. *NOW* I can go work on the car. |
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| Gint |
May 11 2007, 02:16 PM
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#35
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
The 914 is on the lift. Root cause analysis is complete. Whoever put these CV's on is a total fuchsnut. No roll pins, half of the 4 bolts don't have schnorr washers, the schnorr washers that are installed are very well used. The teeth are all flattened and they are not curved at all. Totally flat...
Probably going to have to order some parts. Expect a call Eric. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I'm on a cerveza break. |
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| MoveQik |
May 11 2007, 02:22 PM
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#36
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What size wheels can I fit? Group: Members Posts: 4,645 Joined: 5-April 05 From: Scottsdale, AZ Member No.: 3,881 Region Association: Southwest Region |
Welcome to the club!! :-)
Safety wires should be standard! Attached image(s) 
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| Ferg |
May 11 2007, 02:33 PM
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#37
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,948 Joined: 8-January 03 From: Boulder CO Member No.: 116 Region Association: None
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Time to put Dr Evils kit to work...
You have time to order another before your six hits the road (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) Ferg (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| Gint |
May 11 2007, 02:38 PM
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#38
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,082 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Safety wiring CV bolts is simply not required if they are installed correctly in the first place. I need gaskets anyway, so a parts order is in the works.
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| TravisNeff |
May 11 2007, 03:06 PM
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#39
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,082 Joined: 20-March 03 From: Mesa, AZ Member No.: 447 Region Association: Southwest Region
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29 to 31 ft/lbs
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| RoninEclipse2G |
May 11 2007, 03:11 PM
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#40
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Suby Geek Group: Members Posts: 232 Joined: 28-April 07 From: Parker, Colorado Member No.: 7,701 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
we installed them "correctly" twice now and they're still coming apart on the drivers side, I'm thinkin the threads in the output hub are a little jacked, gonna have to run a tap down there and chase em I think, after that I'm givin the evil Dr a call once more money makes it's way to me
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